[davchr]

Originally Posted by Shareandenjoy

Bah, after having had 45e for 6 months, i was truly wondering (apologize for my US and UK friends for using the beautiful metric system) why:

- I have to carry an additional 300Kgs for batteries around, just to get 70Kms of electric range. Handling is very different from 40i.
- Paying 10K to 15K EUR more to purchase the car.
- When using public rechargers, the cost/km with electric is higher than the gasoline one.
- When Electric range is over, I have to drive a thirsty (for EU standards) 3.0 twin turbo gasoline engine, with 6/7Km liter range with a 2.4 Tons elephant to carry around. This is less of a problem in USA as you are used to those kind of gasoline engines and costs, but for Europe this very unusual.
- I have to wait 6 hours to charge the car (yes, I know this has improved on 50e).
- You have to own solar panels and charger in the garage, not always possibile if you live in a condo.
- Yes, there are some small benefits, like not paying charge in pollution areas...but not that much.

So, bottom line: for EU, a 3.0 diesel engine is still the best choice overall.

...and when you do the math for the cost / mile in Excel, remember to factor in the extra cost for purchasing the car are the cost of fuel when not driving in electric mode.

Just my humble view on why you have to pay 120K EUR, get a much heavier car and have a very short electric range...and again, USA vs EUR makes a big difference I know.

I answered those question plus why would I want a car with so many initial problems and bought the 40i.

[jad03060]

I have a 2021 45e, early in the first year it was sold in the USA (but not the rest of the world), and so far after nearlng 4-years of ownership, have not had a single warranty claim…we hear about problems on the board, because people gravitate to it when they do have an issue…but, we seldom hear from those that do not have an issue. I’ve bought ‘first-year’ vehicles 4x in my life, but only had repeated issues with one, an Audi. I sold that one much earlier than I usually would because it pissed me off. Maybe I’m lucky.

[FastLaneJB]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

You can get a PHEV Lexus TX and Toyota Grand Highlander (possibly the not so grand version too?). Ford had a PHEV explorer and Lincoln aviator as well. Mazda CX90 also and I think there a version of the Mitsubishi outlander as well? Plus who knows howamy others in the pipeline.

The length is the age old problem. Too small for US, or too big for Europe? I suspect that X7 sells more in the US, so the answer is you make the X7 bigger. It's a good bit smaller than TX and GLS, which has done very well for Mercedes.

I think you underestimate how big the battery needs to be. 20-30 miles of range is probably fine. Just enough to get the kids to and from school, ya know?

I think pretty much none of the models you've mentioned are available in Europe so without looking them up, guessing they are longer to fit a battery in.

I'm sure you are right and the X7 sells more in the US than Europe and probably China also but it is a European brands car so I guess they still want to be able to offer it in Europe. Hence making it any longer than it is probably just isn't a viable option.

You do need a pretty big battery do 20 - 30 miles when you are talking a 2.5 ton, 7 row SUV which isn't all that aerodynamic. It's not efficient so the battery size needs to be reasonable to make up for that. I think the Range Rover which is more aerodynamic needs almost a 40kWh battery to do a claimed 70 miles range so maybe 50 - 60 real world. You'd probably need at least 20kWh to do anything reasonable.

One last point but the reason they shoot for at least 70 miles of WLTP range is it drops the tax bracket for company car buyers by that point. Most who buy PHEV's tend to fall into those brackets. Other European countries also have rules that push for longer ranges.

[FastLaneJB]

Originally Posted by eelnoraa

Just one technical correction, 45e/50e don’t have battery in boot or trunk at all. Battery, a small portion is under 2nd row floor and majority portion is under 2nd row seat cushion. It is the gas tank that is relocated to trunk into.

Ah didn't know that. Seen reviews that suggest you lose space under the boot so assumed it was the battery. I guess though the end result is the same, you still need room to do it. Thanks for the info.

[BlkGS]

Yeah I don't really care about European rules. They can drive their ship into the iceberg however they want with regulations, not my problem (as long as automakers don't screw up American products because of it).

I think BMW is probably the most stubborn of the German automakers. They were big on "we will never make an M SUV", then they did. "we will never make an AWD M", then they did. "We will never make an M out of the 7", one day they probably will make an X7M, M7 probably not since sedans are dying. BMW could easily make US specific variants, but are probably too stubborn to do it.

Personally, I'd offer it in two lengths. A shorter one for ROW, and a longer one for the US. The longer one could be as long as a GLS without any issues, maybe a little longer since BMW sucks at packaging. Then you'd have plenty of space for a PHEV battery.

I still don't think it needs a huge battery or PHEV range. 20-30 miles is all you'd need, that would get me toy kids school, work, and back to school and home on a charge. If I forgot to charge or used extra juice for whatever reason, no big deal, it's a PHEV, it just uses the gas engine. All good, don't want the gas to go stale from not getting used. I think the automakers need.to.get smarter about PHEVs, they need smaller batteries to just offset some usage, not expensive batteries that kill any potential ROI.

[mscot]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

Personally, I'd offer it in two lengths. A shorter one for ROW, and a longer one for the US. The longer one could be as long as a GLS without any issues, maybe a little longer since BMW sucks at packaging. Then you'd have plenty of space for a PHEV battery..

Agreed. An X7L would be a better idea for NA.

Originally Posted by BlkGS

I still don't think it needs a huge battery or PHEV range. 20-30 miles...
I think the automakers need.to.get smarter about PHEVs, they need smaller batteries to just offset some usage, not expensive batteries that kill any potential ROI.

I think technology will solve this problem in a few years with better battery tech. For now, I like the 40+ miles I get in the X5 and often wish it had a bit more!

For the OP's original question. Luckily CO energy is still relatively affordable, plus we plan on going solar next time we replace the roof.
But saving money wasn't the big factor in buying this car (how could it be, it cost 90k). I see it as a step towards full EV and until battery tech is better, this solves the problem of giving me all EV for most of my days while insuring I can get to the mountains and back no matter the traffic or conditions without having to charge it.