[poopiehead46]

Hi everyone,

I'm wondering how important is the remaining years of warranty on a CPO as well as potentially purchasing the 7 year/100k mile warranty on CPO car.

I'm currently shopping for a 2022~2023 X5 x45e. It will be my first BMW and it will be a family car. I used to work on my cars all the time, but now that I'm older with a family and other responsibilities, I simply just don't have the energy and time to wrench away.

I typically own cars for 8~10+ years, but I've never owned an European car. I've owned my last car for 13 years and it will be replaced whenever I get a new one (hopefully X5). If I get a X5, I hope it will last another 7-10 years under my ownership without breaking the bank.

Most of my driving will be city driving < 30miles a day. I can charge the car to full every night if needed. I don't think I'll come close to 10k miles a year for the next 3-4 years. Maybe 5 to 7k miles/year.

If i don't get extended warranty, then a 2022 CPO will be out of warranty by 2027. Do I just take the car to independent mechanic from that point onwards? I assume this will put my car out of commission without a loaner... That might be really inconvenient since it's a family car that needs to haul kids around. I don't mind dropping car off at dealership and come back with a loaner, but I'm not sure if that'll cost me an arm and a leg. The last thing I'd want is a surprise 4000$ repair bill.

Should I maybe stay away from BMW if i plan on owning a 10 year old car down the line? Everything I read on the internet is so extreme...either "Stay away from luxury cars outside of warranty!!" or "My BMW ran 100k miles and didn't have issues". I really don't want to buy a car for 3 years, warranty expires, and then have to buy another.

[PunsGalore]

Warranty is crucial for any new German car. Thank me later.

[poopiehead46]

Originally Posted by PunsGalore

Warranty is crucial. Thank me later.

what do you guys do when the car is completely out of warranty after year 7?

[PunsGalore]

Originally Posted by poopiehead46

what do you guys do when the car is completely out of warranty after year 7?

I don't know. Our E91 doesn't have 5-10k headlights, fancy power tailgates, heated armrests, air suspension, hybrid systems, etc.. I just know from friends' experiences that newer cars with those luxury car features require a warranty, unless you don't mind insane service charges, mostly for battery/electronics. If you don't DIY that's even more reason.. do routine maintenance at a third party place though.

[TurtleBoy]

It is up to you and how you feel about it. For most members it is not important at all, for the remaining it is. Just a matter of whether you see value in the peace of mind knowing that is something that is covered breaks you don't have to pay for it.

[Darkmann]

Originally Posted by poopiehead46

what do you guys do when the car is completely out of warranty after year 7?

I've kept my Japanese ones well past warranty. My 1996 300ZX TT still runs fine. I have kept only one German car past warranty - my 2005 Benz ML500 - now sold. Others I have gotten rid of at Warranty - not cost effective to keep, especially when my nearest dealer is 2 Hrs away.

[Darkmann]

Originally Posted by poopiehead46

Hi everyone,

I'm wondering how important is the remaining years of warranty on a CPO as well as potentially purchasing the 7 year/100k mile warranty on CPO car....

I have bought more than a few used vehicles. CPO or not, I will not buy without a good amount of warranty. I would rather negotiate warranty in the total cost than buy without warranty. Just not worth the headache for me.

[kfresh]

I've had my m4 for 2.5 years (5yrs total) outside of warranty and have paid 2k total on 3 separate repairs. If I had a 1k ded. for each claim I would already be under on a warranty plan. I think the census among most members in the community is take that money and put it away in a rainy day savings fund to pay for repairs as they come up with a trusted Indy shop.

The 45e is a different beast though with hybrid technology that many Indy shops may not want to get involved in and you will be left with a brick if something goes wrong on the electrical side. My advise is to look for a 40i and save yourself the potential future headaches.

[SteVTEC]

There's a number of us in here that hope to be able to own and drive our G05's for the long-haul also. I'm one of them too, and the clear choice for that is the 40i with the (mostly) proven B58 and ZF8 powertrain.

The 45e/50e are as of yet unproven for long term ownership, and the 50e has already had a bunch of initial problems that seem to be getting resolved. They could be great long-term, or they could be total nightmares. Nobody knows. And yes, lots of independent BMW shops might not want to touch them when they go wrong out of warranty, which would be another downside.

I'm the original owner of my 2011 E93 335i, which is older by years now but still under 100k miles. I had leased it originally, and then bought out the lease and flipped it to a CPO with that warranty out to 6 years. The rule of thumb for BMW ownership out of warranty has long been about $200/mo typically in once or twice per year chunks. That's largely been true for my E93, but my indy shop guys have told me that the E9x chassis were the last to have relatively reasonable repair costs, and that all of the F-chassis and newer cars are costing way more, so I'm not sure what to say. Maybe it's more like $300-400/mo now? Sounds like a lot, but considering new car prices have gone through the roof also, it might not be completely unreasonable.

You can go either way, but if you skip extra warranty coverage you'll absolutely want to find a good independent BMW repair shop. I luckily have an outstanding one within walking distance of where I live, which is probably about the only reason I still have my E93. They've been great to deal with, and do excellent work at generally about 2/3rds the price of what the dealership would have charged.

The other thing is that you have to love a vehicle enough to want to keep dealing with it. That's been the case with our E93, which is last of breed in many ways. And it was not the case with the 2018 Suburban that I just unloaded for a G07 X7. Great vehicle and served its purpose, but whoa.... Had hoped to drive that for 10-15 years, but the repairs it needed or was going to need just weren't going to be worth it for us to hold onto it, so unloaded it while I still could.

[BlkGS]

I'm fairly new to BMWs as well.

The thing to remember is that brand image takes a long time to recover. BMW made horribly.unrrliable cars with garbage engines that leaked anything liquid out of them for decades. Then they learned that fluids are meant to stay inside to engines, and things got better, but 90% of the experiences you hear and the overall image comes from those many, many, many years of garbage vehicles you wouldn't want to own outside of warranty.

I think it boils down to what your expectations for reliability are. Outside of B58 oil pump failures, and rod bearings faires on M cars, and crank hub failures from modding, and blown motors from modding, BMWs don't tend to catastrophically fail. They tend to just need upkeep, and that gets expensive, and eventually the cost to upkeep them exceeds their value.

They are not like an old small block that will run forever with oil changes and that's it. They eat through brakes and tires surprisingly quick - our expedition is at 65k miles and the brakes are nearing needing replaced, my X5 has 28k and has already had a full pad replacement. It's also nearing time for it's third set of tires.

I agree with the sentiment that to keep one of these for 10 years you're going to have to love it enough to do so. My take is, buy the CPO car and when COO runs out you make a decision.a lot can change between now and 2027.

[CR290Guy]

In my world, it was dependent on the vehicle. We’ve kept several vehicles well past the warranty end because they were so dependable. Honda, Toyota and one you wouldn’t expect, a ‘95 LR Discovery that was kept for 8 years and well over 100,000 miles.

Before our current X5, my only other German vehicle was a Porsche Macan S which was a CPO. It was traded near the end of the warranty period due to its tendency to require a new battery every 14 months or less (AZ heat), replacement of the CPM and an engine out reseal.

Listen to the vehicle. You’ll have a good idea as the cpo warranty ends. Pay attention to forums like this for issues related to your model year. Determine if you have a well-recommended independent service facility near you. Then, make a decision.

[SteVTEC]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

I'm fairly new to BMWs as well.

The thing to remember is that brand image takes a long time to recover. BMW made horribly.unrrliable cars with garbage engines that leaked anything liquid out of them for decades. Then they learned that fluids are meant to stay inside to engines, and things got better, but 90% of the experiences you hear and the overall image comes from those many, many, many years of garbage vehicles you wouldn't want to own outside of warranty.

I think it boils down to what your expectations for reliability are. Outside of B58 oil pump failures, and rod bearings faires on M cars, and crank hub failures from modding, and blown motors from modding, BMWs don't tend to catastrophically fail. They tend to just need upkeep, and that gets expensive, and eventually the cost to upkeep them exceeds their value.

They are not like an old small block that will run forever with oil changes and that's it. They eat through brakes and tires surprisingly quick - our expedition is at 65k miles and the brakes are nearing needing replaced, my X5 has 28k and has already had a full pad replacement. It's also nearing time for it's third set of tires.

I agree with the sentiment that to keep one of these for 10 years you're going to have to love it enough to do so. My take is, buy the CPO car and when COO runs out you make a decision.a lot can change between now and 2027.

New small blocks aren't like the old small blocks either. It would be nice if GM (and Dodge) could figure out that lifters are meant to keep spinning freely, rather than locking up, grinding out cams, spreading debris throughout the engines and eventually grenading them.

As for the rest, it's just considered [preferably preventative] maintenance and upkeep in the BMW world. If you love them you deal with it, and plenty do either DIY or with solid indy shops. I still see more than a few E46's on the road in my area. And you forgot plastic cooling system components that love to crack or burst with age also. There's a sticky thread in the E9x forum with a big list of everything that can go wrong with those cars, and I laughed because I think I've ended up doing most if not all of those repairs, including a few not listed. I've probably put more into upkeep and repairs in the car than it's worth today, but in the end it's been cheaper than buying another new car, and I have a relatively 'classic' E9x car that's still in great shape and not falling apart from neglect.

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by SteVTEC

New small blocks aren't like the old small blocks either. It would be nice if GM (and Dodge) could figure out that lifters are meant to keep spinning freely, rather than locking up, grinding out cams, spreading debris throughout the engines and eventually grenading them.

As for the rest, it's just considered [preferably preventative] maintenance and upkeep in the BMW world. If you love them you deal with it, and plenty do either DIY or with solid indy shops. I still see more than a few E46's on the road in my area. And you forgot plastic cooling system components that love to crack or burst with age also. There's a sticky thread in the E9x forum with a big list of everything that can go wrong with those cars, and I laughed because I think I've ended up doing most if not all of those repairs, including a few not listed. I've probably put more into upkeep and repairs in the car than it's worth today, but in the end it's been cheaper than buying another new car, and I have a relatively 'classic' E9x car that's still in great shape and not falling apart from neglect.

Agreed on both counts, lol. AFM has been a nightmare for the small block and hemi. People say you have to do super short oil change intervals (like 5k miles) but I think of that were the case, the oil life monitor would tell you to do that. It costs GM nothing to spec a shorter oil life interval, whereas it can cost them warranty dollars if the lifted get jacked up.

I also agree that it's upkeep that makes the difference. That said, the line between upkeep and repairs is blurry for people. I had a heater hose start leaking in our expedition, it was a slow leak, but I noticedy.coolant levels were dropping during an oil change. I replaced them for $150 and was all good, but the dealer wanted $2500 to do it. Should heater hoses leak at 65k miles? No, but they do. Is that upkeep? It's not on any schedule but it's a well known failure point that people say is good to replace about every 60k miles. I could easily see people saying that it's a repair, because it is in fact a problem with the car.

[SteVTEC]

I still remember that it was recommended to basically replace the entire E39 cooling system, including the plastic radiator, every 60k miles as preventative maintenance. Why plastic? It was all to maintain the 50/50 weight dist, especially with the 540i and the big V8 lump.

Stuff like the Expedition heater hose isn't for weight distribution or any real purpose other than cost cutting. One could say the same about plastic BMW cooling system bits too, but its a clear part of the brand DNA to maintain the weight distribution.

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by SteVTEC

I still remember that it was recommended to basically replace the entire E39 cooling system, including the plastic radiator, every 60k miles as preventative maintenance. Why plastic? It was all to maintain the 50/50 weight dist, especially with the 540i and the big V8 lump.

Stuff like the Expedition heater hose isn't for weight distribution or any real purpose other than cost cutting. One could say the same about plastic BMW cooling system bits too, but its a clear part of the brand DNA to maintain the weight distribution.

E39 M5 owner here. The above statement is NOT correct. In those era, the issues for cooling are expansion tank crack (plastic), thermostat stuck open, serpentine belt failure and pulley issue, compromise water pump capability. The so call overall is NOT for entire system, but rather those items, which all are easily assessible and simple fix.

As for plastic cooling parts:
1. expansion tank is usually plastic for most cars. I don't remember seeing a single car with metal expansion, so not unique to BMW. What is unique is in this era is expansion tank is part of the pressurized system. Over the year this cracks. The good thing is, there are ton of aftermarket aluminum option, $200~$300 range.

2. Radiator is NOT plastic. Fins and passenger part is aluminum. It is the radiator end cap is plastics. They are actually quite OK. My car is 21 years old now. It is on the 2nd OEM radiator. The first one leaked (not completely failure) at 100K miles. There are also plenty of aftermarket AL options. If I need to replace mine again, I will sure get the AL option

The so called "complete system' are basically it. There are not much to those old BMWs compare to today's BMW. I still love those era's BMW, E39, E46. They are super simple and easy to maintain in today's standard. They drive like a driver's car.

[SteVTEC]

I stand corrected. I was generalizing based on long ago memory, but nice to know the specifics.

[FCX5]

Originally Posted by PunsGalore

Warranty is crucial for any new German car. Thank me later.

I agree. Once the car starts having problems after warranty I usually sell it then. IF you want peace of mind for long term peace of mind, I would suggest either 40i or non German luxury. The 40i seems very reliable as per Consumer Reports.