[Skilly]

Originally Posted by phillipeino

Two things...


1) I think you are assuming the U-pin in the upmost position means the valve is partially open. What if the valve actually is fully open and when the U-pin is down the valve is partially closed? I ordered an endoscope camera on Amazon and will take a picture inside the exhaust. It should be here tomorrow, I'll let you know the position of the valve.

2) It was found that with these exhaust valve actuators, they variable in the way they open and close. I believe it's based on RPM and/or throttle position. Either way, under low RPM or load, the valve may be in the closed position. The gain with unplugging it in the open position is that we guarantee it'll be open under all conditions.

This is the right question - what is '100%' open?

Stationary throttle blips are rev limited and if this operates like Mercedes (which Im guessing it does) there will be no way to get to completely open - fully open will be limited from the factory to reduce noise.

Unless its manipulated with an EVM or a coding tool,...or a visual scoping tool that allows you to eyeball it (creative!), I dont think any of these suggestions get the job 100%.

[blackoutF15]

Originally Posted by phillipeino

Two things...

1) I think you are assuming the U-pin in the upmost position means the valve is partially open. What if the valve actually is fully open and when the U-pin is down the valve is partially closed? I ordered an endoscope camera on Amazon and will take a picture inside the exhaust. It should be here tomorrow, I'll let you know the position of the valve.

2) It was found that with these exhaust valve actuators, they variable in the way they open and close. I believe it's based on RPM and/or throttle position. Either way, under low RPM or load, the valve may be in the closed position. The gain with unplugging it in the open position is that we guarantee it'll be open under all conditions.

Ok I was lazy to take pic but I knew I’m going to end up doing it. Here’s the close up of the spring and bracket came with my valvereonic design exhaust. I hope you now can understand what I was talking about the horizontally connection makes 0 restriction on the rotation. Since I already had sst evm on the car, I opted to use the oem actuators although the exhaust came with their vacuum driven kit and remote controllers too.

Good question if the stock U pin at where it’s stuck is indeed fully open position or just a tilt? Well, based on what I hear, it’s only a tilt. Otherwise why weld that extra piece of metal in the bracket making it more costly? I took a video of the rotation too, if you don’t see it it’s because I can’t upload it.

[phillipeino]

The results are in... The U-pin in the upward position does in fact open the valve completely.

[blackoutF15]

Originally Posted by phillipeino

The results are in... The U-pin in the upward position does in fact open the valve completely.

Thanks for confirming that, it’s good to know definitively. But I can’t believe bmw would build the X5M comp with such weak sound. With the stock exhaust even with valves fully open on m2, it is still quiet, doesn’t sound like an M car to me.

[Skilly]

interesting - so a comment and a question.

The comment - this would mean the bracket design on the OEM likely is preventative of the valves fully closing and set up to prevent damage.

The question - during M1 sport exhaust etc, is the U pin in that upright 'full open' position or does it back off and not allow full open without the EVM? In other words does an EVM actually make a difference from factory settings?

[blackoutF15]

Originally Posted by Skilly

interesting - so a comment and a question.

The comment - this would mean the bracket design on the OEM likely is preventative of the valves fully closing and set up to prevent damage.

The question - during M1 sport exhaust etc, is the U pin in that upright 'full open' position or does it back off and not allow full open without the EVM? In other words does an EVM actually make a difference from factory settings?

I think it probably depends on the rpm and drive mode, so stock is conditional which you have no control over it. The aftermarket evm allows you to open fully or tilt on demand on any drive mode. If you don’t press the close button, it will be open permanently. Oem commands are bypassed.

[Skilly]

This thread is a little wonky.

The only way to open the flaps fully (100%) is through manipulation with a code tool, or an EVM. Revving and pulling the electrics wouldn't do it - the stock open setting isn't 'open' and is modular depending on a number of parameters.

The only thing that's missing here is, now we know what full open is (thanks to the scope!), can the U-pin be manually moved to that position and held permanently? Guessing you would have to unplug the flap controller before doing that, and unclear if that would risk damage to the controller, etc.

[blackoutF15]

Originally Posted by Skilly

This thread is a little wonky.

The only way to open the flaps fully (100%) is through manipulation with a code tool, or an EVM. Revving and pulling the electrics wouldn't do it - the stock open setting isn't 'open' and is modular depending on a number of parameters.

The only thing that's missing here is, now we know what full open is (thanks to the scope!), can the U-pin be manually moved to that position and held permanently? Guessing you would have to unplug the flap controller before doing that, and unclear if that would risk damage to the controller, etc.

Yes pulling the U pin out at that pictured position should do it. Or just simply leave the plug off from the actuator and leave the pin in. The pin is the machenical component that links the driving force (rotating) from the actuator axle to the one attached to the valve. There is no direct connection between the 2 axles as you can see the piece of metal inbwteen cuts them off. Either pulling the U pin out or leaving unplugged would serve the same purpose- making them independent from another

I would think leaving actuator unplugged would be safer than pulling out the pin choice because not allowing over working the module for 0 purpose

[Skilly]

Originally Posted by blackoutF15

Yes pulling the U pin out at that pictured position should do it. Or just simply leave the plug off from the actuator and leave the pin in. The pin is the machenical component that links the driving force (rotating) from the actuator axle to the one attached to the valve. There is no direct connection between the 2 axles as you can see the piece of metal inbwteen cuts them off. Either pulling the U pin out or leaving unplugged would serve the same purpose- making them independent from another

I would think leaving actuator unplugged would be safer than pulling out the pin choice because not allowing over working the module for 0 purpose

This seems to be getting lost in translation.

Pulling the U-pin out (as in remove it) doesn't make sense to me, now we know its not restricting 'full open'. Since it's a visual representation of what status is on the valve, seeing it facing up in the middle if the bracket, it let's us know it's open.

The question is can you manually move it, or does it require coding. I think that these are free flowing but likely move around without being locked in place by the actuator. Which means you need to have the actuator mirror that full open position before its unplugged - wondering if that can be done without damaging it.

Aside from EVMs or coding, Ive seen some people pin them (AKA spot weld) with other set ups. Typically I have seen that when its vacuum controlled rather than electronics.

[blackoutF15]

Originally Posted by Skilly

This seems to be getting lost in translation.

Pulling the U-pin out (as in remove it) doesn't make sense to me, now we know its not restricting 'full open'. Since it's a visual representation of what status is on the valve, seeing it facing up in the middle if the bracket, it let's us know it's open.

The question is can you manually move it, or does it require coding. I think that these are free flowing but likely move around without being locked in place by the actuator. Which means you need to have the actuator mirror that full open position before its unplugged - wondering if that can be done without damaging it.

Aside from EVMs or coding, Ive seen some people pin them (AKA spot weld) with other set ups. Typically I have seen that when its vacuum controlled rather than electronics.

Valid concerns. I myself do not support the “cost effective “ way, I have a sst evm installed. I’m interested in fhis topic because I wanted to validate whether bmw allows valves to be opened 100%, and they do apparently. Op was able to get the pin rotated to the end as photographed while in idle. As I said above, if anyone insists on the creative work around, leaving the plugs off would be safest given the actuators (driving force) are disabled permanently if you are able to get the pin to rotate and stay at its max position prior to unplugging. But then would you really want that? This means your valves are fully opened forever, on all drive modes, not to mention the morning cold start that are annoying to others but yourself. I see no point doing any of these homemade options personally. If bmw does provide this highly calibrated calculated engineering machenism to trigger the valves to close/tilt/open in various driving conditions to maximize performance and efficiency, why do something to remove that feature and flexibility end up impacting performance in negative way?

Anyhow, I’m going to throw in a plug here since you mentioned vacuum vm: I’ve got a brand new set of vacuum vm from Valvetronic Design for grabs. The kit came with my VD cat back that I decided not to install at the time because I’ve already got the sst evm on the car. From what I read, the vacuum system is more responsive and reliable than electronic when it comes to this particular use. My decision was made based on the extra hassle of running wires from bottom of car up to trunk interior which is required to install the vacuum module and a power connection via cigarette lighter plug on the interior sidewall of the trunk space. But rhe 2 remote key fobs are cool and fancy looking, I can tell the materials used and build are much better than sst. If anyone is interested, I can let them go for $250 way below the evm prices on the market but for a better quality product. Ask me for pics if you’re seriously interested only please.

[phillipeino]

Originally Posted by blackoutF15

Valid concerns. I myself do not support the “cost effective “ way, I have a sst evm installed. I’m interested in fhis topic because I wanted to validate whether bmw allows valves to be opened 100%, and they do apparently. Op was able to get the pin rotated to the end as photographed while in idle. As I said above, if anyone insists on the creative work around, leaving the plugs off would be safest given the actuators (driving force) are disabled permanently if you are able to get the pin to rotate and stay at its max position prior to unplugging. But then would you really want that? This means your valves are fully opened forever, on all drive modes, not to mention the morning cold start that are annoying to others but yourself. I see no point doing any of these homemade options personally. If bmw does provide this highly calibrated calculated engineering machenism to trigger the valves to close/tilt/open in various driving conditions to maximize performance and efficiency, why do something to remove that feature and flexibility end up impacting performance in negative way?

Anyhow, I’m going to throw in a plug here since you mentioned vacuum vm: I’ve got a brand new set of vacuum vm from Valvetronic Design for grabs. The kit came with my VD cat back that I decided not to install at the time because I’ve already got the sst evm on the car. From what I read, the vacuum system is more responsive and reliable than electronic when it comes to this particular use. My decision was made based on the extra hassle of running wires from bottom of car up to trunk [...]

I'm almost positive the valves are more for sound volume and not performance. You'll never see someone build a turbocharged car and put exhaust valves on it. That's because turbochargers don't like back pressure, which is why bigger, more free flowing exhaust systems are used. Leaving the BMW exhaust valve open is essentially removing the unnecessary back pressure from the turbocharger.

[blackoutF15]

Originally Posted by phillipeino

I'm almost positive the valves are more for sound volume and not performance. You'll never see someone build a turbocharged car and put exhaust valves on it. That's because turbochargers don't like back pressure, which is why bigger, more free flowing exhaust systems are used. Leaving the BMW exhaust valve open is essentially removing the unnecessary back pressure from the turbocharger.

What about efficient mode and eco mode? Wouldn’t that be counterproductive? All I’m saying is that why eliminate the flexibility when the car already does what you want it to do

[phillipeino]

Originally Posted by blackoutF15

What about efficient mode and eco mode? Wouldn’t that be counterproductive? All I’m saying is that why eliminate the flexibility when the car already does what you want it to do

I guess it all depends on what you want the car to do lol. For me, I wanted it a little louder at all times.

[boi222]

Does the sst evm produce any errors in the system ? Also, does anyone know if that works for the LCI models?

[Skilly]

Originally Posted by boi222

Does the sst evm produce any errors in the system ? Also, does anyone know if that works for the LCI models?

dont know SST but the Dinan version works across pretty much any BMW with electronically controlled valves. Should be no error code.

https://www.dinancars.com/products/e...arts/R660-0002

[boi222]

Originally Posted by Skilly

dont know SST but the Dinan version works across pretty much any BMW with electronically controlled valves. Should be no error code.

https://www.dinancars.com/products/exhaust-systems/exhaust-valve-accessories/parts/R660-0002

Thanks. Looks good but looks too evasive to install, seems to need to be routed internally

[blackoutF15]

Originally Posted by boi222

Thanks. Looks good but looks too evasive to install, seems to need to be routed internally

Way too difficult to install. The sst is very easy to install. 2 y cables from the module go to each side of the actuator, I took a chance and mount the module on top of the cross supporting bar right before the muffler. Most ppl run wires down to keep the module hidden in the trunk to prevent water damage. Zip tie everything to make sure all secure and no loose harness hanging. Everything is underneath the car. 10 mins install. No error code. Only thing is sometimes it doesn’t respond when pressing the remote inside of car. As I mentioned earlier, I got a set of Valvetronic Design kit, it uses vacuum technology which is more responsive and reliable for sale if you’re interested. Install is same except 1 extra simple step to plug the cig lighter power wire from module to the cig outlet on passenger side of the trunk wall.

[Skilly]

Originally Posted by boi222

Thanks. Looks good but looks too evasive to install, seems to need to be routed internally

Anything that needs power will need to route to it. These are all the same. This is pretty simple IMHO. Ground and ACC power....all located in the spare tire area.

[boi222]

Originally Posted by blackoutF15

Way too difficult to install. The sst is very easy to install. 2 y cables from the module go to each side of the actuator, I took a chance and mount the module on top of the cross supporting bar right before the muffler. Most ppl run wires down to keep the module hidden in the trunk to prevent water damage. Zip tie everything to make sure all secure and no loose harness hanging. Everything is underneath the car. 10 mins install. No error code. Only thing is sometimes it doesn’t respond when pressing the remote inside of car. As I mentioned earlier, I got a set of Valvetronic Design kit, it uses vacuum technology which is more responsive and reliable for sale if you’re interested. Install is same except 1 extra simple step to plug the cig lighter power wire from module to the cig outlet on passenger side of the trunk wall.

How would you run cables down from the trunk ? You have to take apart the trunk or there is a easy way to route cables from the trunk ?

[blackoutF15]

Originally Posted by boi222

How would you run cables down from the trunk ? You have to take apart the trunk or there is a easy way to route cables from the trunk ?

It’s pretty easy. You just left open the cargo floor panel as if you would access the battery then you were fine black Round rubber plugs in various places on the metal part of the floor. The rubber plug plugs the Hole that lead to the exterior bottom of the car. Pick one closest to where you’d like to to be fed.

[boi222]

Originally Posted by blackoutF15

It’s pretty easy. You just left open the cargo floor panel as if you would access the battery then you were fine black Round rubber plugs in various places on the metal part of the floor. The rubber plug plugs the Hole that lead to the exterior bottom of the car. Pick one closest to where you’d like to to be fed.

Do you have to unscrew anything to open the cargo floor panel ? If I recall correctly, it’s not exposed when you are just looking at the spare tire. Is it difficult to remove the floor panel ?

[blackoutF15]

Originally Posted by boi222

Do you have to unscrew anything to open the cargo floor panel ? If I recall correctly, it’s not exposed when you are just looking at the spare tire. Is it difficult to remove the floor panel ?

When you lift up the carpet floor panel to access spare tire, in front the spare tire there’s a black plastic cover that covers the batteries. There are maybe about 8 plastic rivets to hold the cover down. Pry them up with a flathead screw driver gently they pop out easily. Simple no real screws.