[BlkGS]

Summer tires start to lose.grip at 60-65 degrees ambient temps depending on the tire. By 40 they're very slippery. By 30, they can be damaged. 20? Forget about it.

[Coercion Shaman]

I live in the south and I can feel the difference in the tires through winter. Just sayin'. I don't want to swap out tires so I put on all season.

[MartieNYBK]

tire rack has PIRELLI P ZERO ALL SEASON 2,500 for a set of four for 22" wheels. I wonder if changing just the tires to all season would do the trick? or do I definitely need to buy 20" rims and tires?

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by MartieNYBK

tire rack has PIRELLI P ZERO ALL SEASON 2,500 for a set of four for 22" wheels. I wonder if changing just the tires to all season would do the trick? or do I definitely need to buy 20" rims and tires?

Since you said you don't get much snow you will be fine.

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

Summer tires start to lose.grip at 60-65 degrees ambient temps depending on the tire. By 40 they're very slippery. By 30, they can be damaged. 20? Forget about it.

No no no. If ground is dry, summer will out grid all season and winter down to 0C/32F at least. Above 40F, the same car with summer will run circle around all season. The real issue for summer tire is wet + cold or ice. Reason is at say 40F or so, wet surface won't allow tire to warm up. If temperature is at 60F range, even in drechned surface, summer will win by big margin because the channels in summer pattern will dissipate water much more efficiently. Winter tire's grid is low to begin, it just doesn't degrade much in cold + wet.

[BlkGS]

It boils down to of you absolutely MUST get somewhere in snow/ice. If not, all season tires will be fine. But there's always the chance of the one time...

[matowi]

I can add from own experience - last year in late April we had a sudden snowfall and temperatures dropped to 3-5C (mid-30sF if I’m not too off with my mental math)

Snow turned into slush about 2cm (1 inch) deep. My 7 x-drive on summer tires (PZeros 4) was hardly staying in straight line, and took miles to stop from speeds that in 50-60kmh range (~40mph). I can’t remember another time when my palms were so sweaty, and when I’d been so stressed/focused while driving.

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by eelnoraa

No no no. If ground is dry, summer will out grid all season and winter down to 0C/32F at least. Above 40F, the same car with summer will run circle around all season. The real issue for summer tire is wet + cold or ice. Reason is at say 40F or so, wet surface won't allow tire to warm up. If temperature is at 60F range, even in drechned surface, summer will win by big margin because the channels in summer pattern will dissipate water much more efficiently. Winter tire's grid is low to begin, it just doesn't degrade much in cold + wet.

That's not true. Some summer tires may work that way, but others will literally come apart in chunks at cold. Sport Cup 2s for instance. Some summer tires are closer to a 3 season tire, but they don't handle high heat well. They're usually regarded as lower performance summer tires. Some all season tires have more grip than cheap summer tires. It really all depends.

Given the fact that there's like 5 sets of tires that fit these cars anyways, and these.cars have giant tires to boot, I'd run all season tires if I thought I would deal with cold.

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

That's not true. Some summer tires may work that way, but others will literally come apart in chunks at cold. Sport Cup 2s for instance. Some summer tires are closer to a 3 season tire, but they don't handle high heat well. They're usually regarded as lower performance summer tires. Some all season tires have more grip than cheap summer tires. It really all depends.

Given the fact that there's like 5 sets of tires that fit these cars anyways, and these.cars have giant tires to boot, I'd run all season tires if I thought I would deal with cold.

Cup 2 is NOT a typical summer tire people put on their car for street use, right? It is super stiff and noisy. Low tread wear. I am not sure beside you or a few others, many even know what they are. It is toward specialty/track tire categories already. None of the X5 summer tire options are in the same categories as Cup2. I have used Cup2 in winter track event in Button Willow. Morning temperature, especially first session of the day, it can easily be at high 30s/low 40s. No tread block ever come off, but then I also have to state, maybe tire already warm up after 1st warm up lap.

Take a more street friendly good summer, PS4s, absolute no tread block won't come off at 40F. I have always been using summer in my E39/E46/E82. I drive them daily. E46 being my commuter, it has PS4s currently. My morning temperature can easily be 40F even in March, and mid 30s in winter. Never in my 20+ year usage of summer tire, I ever see tread block come off due to 40F kind of temperature, not to mention 60F. Less grip at 40F than in 60F, sure.

Now I have see tread blocks come off even for all reason, but they are all because old/aged tires, which should be replaced to begin with. But it is another story.

[TurtleBoy]

While you start to lose grip earlier, you likely won't have any damage until it is freezing or below. I think all of the manufactures warn against using summer tires in the cold both from a safety point of view as well as a chance of damaging the tires.

[iceburgh]

It is honestly absurd that more people in the northeast don't move to winter tires in the winter. As many others have pointed out, it isn't so much a function of snow but temperature. Stopping distances and overall grip deteriorate considerably as temperatures drop. Meanwhile, people will spend 10-40k+ extra on various performance specs but they can't put the HP to the ground when the tires don't work. Not to mention the liability they are on the road.

At the very least, it is worth considering some of the high quality all weather options now available. I put a set of Nokian WRG5s on my wife's car and they've been tremendous. Maybe not a performance option given the sidewall flex, but lovely for her. Have been killing all conditions in CT.

About to spec out a X5 x40i, and will likely go with the black 22s. Shortly after I will buy a set of Nokian R5s and 20" rims for the winter.

[MartieNYBK]

Why do you choose to buy 20" wheels and tires if you can just buy another set of 22" all season tires? Unless there is a lot of snow in CT. Here is NY it was snowing for a few days a couple of times but the snow cleaners usually clean up snow over night pretty quickly. I rarely had to drive in a snow.

[MartieNYBK]

Originally Posted by LuckyBrand

Most of the time if it was originally optioned with the 22s it automatically comes with a spare. At least that was the case when I specd mine. If it doesn't have one you can get one cheap. I think the 22s have a decent side wall. As has been said if you live in an area with craters everywhere they might not be a great option but I've personally never had any issues with 22s. Go big or go home. Knock on wood.

Wow, I just realized that you are from Michigan. How cold is it in winters and how much snow do you get? Are you doing ok with those 22"?

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by eelnoraa

Cup 2 is NOT a typical summer tire people put on their car for street use, right? It is super stiff and noisy. Low tread wear. I am not sure beside you or a few others, many even know what they are. It is toward specialty/track tire categories already. None of the X5 summer tire options are in the same categories as Cup2. I have used Cup2 in winter track event in Button Willow. Morning temperature, especially first session of the day, it can easily be at high 30s/low 40s. No tread block ever come off, but then I also have to state, maybe tire already warm up after 1st warm up lap.

Take a more street friendly good summer, PS4s, absolute no tread block won't come off at 40F. I have always been using summer in my E39/E46/E82. I drive them daily. E46 being my commuter, it has PS4s currently. My morning temperature can easily be 40F even in March, and mid 30s in winter. Never in my 20+ year usage of summer tire, I ever see tread block come off due to 40F kind of temperature, not to mention 60F. Less grip at 40F than in 60F, sure.

Now I have see tread blocks come off even for all reason, but they are all because old/aged tires, which should be replaced to begin with. But it is another story.

All depends who you ask. I agree with you, cup2s are cheater tires that are barely acceptable for street use. But the OEMs think they're a perfectly reasonable OEM tire. So who knows.

That said, in cold, a summer tires is still not better than a good all season tire.

[iceburgh]

Originally Posted by MartieNYBK

Why do you choose to buy 20" wheels and tires if you can just buy another set of 22" all season tires? Unless there is a lot of snow in CT. Here is NY it was snowing for a few days a couple of times but the snow cleaners usually clean up snow over night pretty quickly. I rarely had to drive in a snow.

Your focus on snow misses the point. It isn't snow, but temperature which is the main reason to switch tires in the winter.

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by sternalot

Your focus on snow misses the point. It isn't snow, but temperature which is the main reason to switch tires in the winter.

I cannot agree to this at all. Even lightest snow/slush accumulation on surface, summer tire will suffer long before the cold start to impact tracking.

[MartieNYBK]

Originally Posted by eelnoraa

I cannot agree to this at all. Even lightest snow/slush accumulation on surface, summer tire will suffer long before the cold start to impact tracking.

Maybe the best solution is to keep the nice looking 22" rims and just purchase 4 all season rated tires $2,500 bucks) and change them in like November and then swap back to summer tires in like March or April. I never had swapped tires on my car but it would probably less then 100 bucks to swap summer for all season tires.

Maybe a wheel alignment is needed too and those sensors.

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by MartieNYBK

Maybe the best solution is to keep the nice looking 22" rims and just purchase 4 all season rated tires $2,500 bucks) and change them in like November and then swap back to summer tires in like March or April. I never had swapped tires on my car but it would probably less then 100 bucks to swap summer for all season tires.

Maybe a wheel alignment is needed too and those sensors.

The best solution is to just run the all season tires year round. If you live in NYC it's not like you're gonna be able to push the car hard, where you would notice it.

I have all season tires on my TBSS and I live in Florida. It's not like AS tires are useless, they just typically have a slightly smaller max grip level, and will get greasy faster if pushed to the limit (like on a race track). I drive my cars hard, and I've never gotten AS tires to feel greasy on the road, even in a 5000lb beast.

[MartieNYBK]

These 22 inch tires are like 500 - 700 bucks each to replace (especially if you want to get a 2nd pair of all season 22 inch tires). Does anyone purchase warranty for Rims and Tires or for tires only and how much do people need to expect to pay for tire and rim warranty?

[MartieNYBK]

By the way I used to lease Ford Edge ST for three years back in 2010. No issues during the winter in NY with 22 inches that was an all season performance tire i think.

22 inches is fine during the winter. I guess you just have to get get decent all season tires.

[Photographer918]

Knocking on wood here, but in the last 20 months I’ve put 34,000 miles on two different X5s, including ~ 12,500 miles on 21 inch tires - no flats. The rest of the mileage was in 20 inch wheels with either winter or all season run flat tires….

[MartieNYBK]

My dealer has X5's with 20" wheels and 21" wheels. Dealer keeps telling me that I should get 21" wheels as they look better and it's not like I am living in Adirondack.

Although the majority on this forum seem to think that 20" is the best as there are options.