[Killed by Death]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

He's not wrong. This is the reason Ham had a "no, Max" clause and begged Toto not to get Max - he knew he'd never have achieved much with MB if Max had the same car. Then again, the Ferrari is a better car than the RB and he's still eating Max's dust.

I don’t think Ferrari has a better car. Even if Max drove it he would still be hampered by the design problem requiring both drivers to lift and coast.

[fs1977]

This weekend the RB was the faster car, or at least Max his RB was the faster car. Yuki nowhere to be seen (he had a different floor so he says). But that's not the story of the season so far. I think Ferrari had the better car most of the weekends with some exceptions.

[M3WC]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Neither of them are hardcore racers - even Nor's comment about getting 'pushed' into the grass was hilarious since the track goes from 3 lanes to 2 there.
Mclaren are the the epitome of woke racing. They dont want to race, they dont want to hurt one another's 'feelings' (hence why the team wont celebrate if one of them win WDC). It's honestly a joke...and despite it being F1, I hope they do move to spec cars in a few years because it will truly redefine the field.

Zak Brown doing his best to hand out participation trophies. Piastri didn't undercut Lando, that was just a poor stop for Lando(which is part of F1). I hope Piastri doesn't end up regretting that decision.

[dfox]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Wasn't it Lando's choice to bring PIA in first for some reason to cover off LEC or maybe I misheard it.

Engineer: Lando, we will box this lap onto the soft tire
Lando: Do you want to box the other car first?
Engineer Yep, we'll do that, we'll swap it around so stay out
Lando: Only if he doesn't undercut, otherwise I'll box first
Engineer: There will be no undercut.

2024 Hungary was even referenced in the radio message to Oscar.

Oscar didn't deserve P2 and the team wasn't going to gift it to him on the back of a pit-stop mechanic.

[GuidoK]

Nice short analysis of the Norris-Piastri talks

Now Oscar's lead is still considerable, but what if he looses the WDC with 5 points or so?
I think McLaren meddles here too much in the fight between their drivers.
The pit stops are what they are imho and always a risk as anything can happen, Lando wanted it this way.

[dfox]

There was also so much discussion between the F1 commentators during lap 44/45, Jolyon specifically even saying "lando can just cover off Oscar at the click of his fingers really so long as the pit stop is good enough". Lando had a 3.7 second lead on Oscar at that point. Predicting the slowest pitstop of the race immediately before this all happened...

it reeks of someone scripting something from up above to try to create drama.

[dfox]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

Nice short analysis of the Norris-Piastri talks

Now Oscar's lead is still considerable, but what if he looses the WDC with 5 points or so?
I think McLaren meddles here too much in the fight between their drivers.
The pit stops are what they are imho and always a risk as anything can happen, Lando wanted it this way.

Guaranteed it's because of language that Mark Webber put into Piastri's contract with McLaren to avoid having them play favorites. And since they like both of their drivers, it needs to go both ways. 2024 Hungary was definitely that, and now the roles reversed but suddenly Piastri fans have amnesia.

"but pit stops are part of racing"... yeah, so is an undercut. Both are controlled by someone other than the drivers. Lando offered the priority pit stop only under the knowledge that he wouldn't be undercut by his teammate. End of story. Piastri fans need to stop their whining.

[Artemis]

It was all about psychology: Norris DNF'ed in Zandvoort because of some engine gremlin: goodbye WDC points. The pitstop issue wasn't because of Norris. Both the mechanic and Norris would have felt very bad. Only 3 points up for grabs: 18 points (P2) or 15 points (P3). If 8 points were up for grabs (P1 versus P2) the swap would have been harder to swallow. Piastri abided, but not wholeheartedly.

Rest assured that Piastri now has a voucher that he can redeem at any future race this season if he'd encounter a setback: "Guys, remember Monza. I abided."

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by dfox

2024 Hungary was definitely that, and now the roles reversed but suddenly Piastri fans have amnesia.

I thought Hungary 2024 was also a strategy fail from McLaren and said so here.
But true, Piastri's debt is now paid back, so now he can race Lando as a WDC is supposed to. No strings attached.

[dfox]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Rest assured that Piastri now has a voucher that he can redeem at any future race this season if he'd encounter a setback: "Guys, remember Monza. I abided."

Nah, I agree with Guidok - This was Piastri paying Lando back for his win in Hungary (even though a win is a lot larger of an ask than a P2-P3 swap, so Oscar still owes a little, if anything). The team even mentioned it in their radio message to Oscar. They're even. Although I could foresee this repeating again at some point, either direction.

Hungary was a strategy fail vs Imola being a pit crew fail. Same same but different. Not driver performance related, it was a team kerfuffle, so Stella needs to take this on the chin and fans need to stop the Lando hate...

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by dfox

Guaranteed it's because of language that Mark Webber put into Piastri's contract with McLaren to avoid having them play favorites. And since they like both of their drivers, it needs to go both ways. 2024 Hungary was definitely that, and now the roles reversed but suddenly Piastri fans have amnesia.

"but pit stops are part of racing"... yeah, so is an undercut. Both are controlled by someone other than the drivers. Lando offered the priority pit stop only under the knowledge that he wouldn't be undercut by his teammate. End of story. Piastri fans need to stop their whining.

Would be great to see them do some grudge racing and take each out out a several times while Max wins and racks up that 25 points tally each time. I think it's improbably to see Max win his 5th in a row (then again it's only happened once in history) but you truly never know. Maybe a combo of the above, a few mishaps, and some engine failures and it happens. If they lose this WDC it will be the biggest flop in F1 history.

[Straykiwi]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Would be great to see them do some grudge racing and take each out out a several times while Max wins and racks up that 25 points tally each time. I think it's improbably to see Max win his 5th in a row (then again it's only happened once in history) but you truly never know. Maybe a combo of the above, a few mishaps, and some engine failures and it happens. If they lose this WDC it will be the biggest flop in F1 history.

As they say, "pride cometh before a fall." McLaren dominance is not guaranteed and the other teams are just waiting for a misstep. I don't believe RBR has solved all of the RB21's problems but they are on a path that looks ominous for McLaren (and Ferrari/Mercedes). They have proven on low downforce circuits they are the fastest car on the grid. All they need to do is at least gain parity in other areas and Verstappen will exploit it. I think the WCC is safely sewn up but as far as the WDC is concerned, it ain't over till its over.

[Rono63]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Would be great to see them do some grudge racing and take each out out a several times while Max wins and racks up that 25 points tally each time. I think it's improbably to see Max win his 5th in a row (then again it's only happened once in history) but you truly never know. Maybe a combo of the above, a few mishaps, and some engine failures and it happens. If they lose this WDC it will be the biggest flop in F1 history.

As aggressive as Max drives and how hard he pushes the RB21, he may have some DNFs.

I will say it was impressive how fast Max and the RB21 was.

One thing I don’t understand is why McLaren doesn’t reduce their down force on these high speed races. Maybe some of the Ferrari things rubbing off on them.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Rono63

As aggressive as Max drives and how hard he pushes the RB21, he may have some DNFs.

I will say it was impressive how fast Max and the RB21 was.

One thing I don’t understand is why McLaren doesn’t reduce their down force on these high speed races. Maybe some of the Ferrari things rubbing off on them.

I think it's likely a couple things; their car even with the extra downforce isnt as good in high speed corners, the drivers arent near Max's level to control a car with that level of wing, and probably would have too much tire wear by dropping the wing (as more downforce equals less tire deg).

One thing that should worry everyone is that they have found some good steps. And it should worry the grid that Mekies is actually an engineer who knows how to design and speak in a way Horner could not. Obviously, weekends like this show you Max still stands way above any other in the field - as Toto said, he 'made everyone else look silly' and he is right. There is a marked difference in his ability vs anyone else. It translates to any car, any setup. He is just a freak in the ability to make even slow cars fast. Further, did you see what his tires looked like during the race? I have no idea how he was able to keep putting distance between himself and the two Mclarens when they were almost split on the inner edge. Anyone else would have been in the wall keeping that pace level with tires that worn.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Rest assured that Piastri now has a voucher that he can redeem at any future race this season if he'd encounter a setback: "Guys, remember Monza. I abided."

not just a voucher, imagine say without team discussion of any sort, someone gets passed because of the slow pitstop, whines about in on team radio, and then gets a free pass. or safety car. or whatever back luck!

[G30M]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Would be great to see them do some grudge racing and take each out out a several times while Max wins and racks up that 25 points tally each time. I think it's improbably to see Max win his 5th in a row (then again it's only happened once in history) but you truly never know. Maybe a combo of the above, a few mishaps, and some engine failures and it happens. If they lose this WDC it will be the biggest flop in F1 history.

they are not that type of racer, so they won't do that. not sure who you're thinking of ... they give back position immediately at a team radio call.

[G30M]

did RB use an angle grinder to dominate in Monza or they have a team of elves building parts and driving in the middle of the night to deliver?

https://www.gpblog.com/en/tech/f1-te...inate-in-monza

[Davil]

It was Max that pushed them to do this. I recall in the coverage it was mentioned that the team didn’t want to make the change. Very impressive.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by Davil

It was Max that pushed them to do this. I recall in the coverage it was mentioned that the team didn’t want to make the change. Very impressive.

ok, let's go with angle grinder! shave some weight, add some new paint, nothing to see!

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by G30M

did RB use an angle grinder to dominate in Monza or they have a team of elves building parts and driving in the middle of the night to deliver?

https://www.gpblog.com/en/tech/f1-te...inate-in-monza

I was going to put this pic on myself but you beat me to it..the magic touch that couldn't work for the Larens
..and I have a song for that.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

I think it's likely a couple things; their car even with the extra downforce isnt as good in high speed corners, the drivers arent near Max's level to control a car with that level of wing, and probably would have too much tire wear by dropping the wing (as more downforce equals less tire deg).

One thing that should worry everyone is that they have found some good steps. And it should worry the grid that Mekies is actually an engineer who knows how to design and speak in a way Horner could not. Obviously, weekends like this show you Max still stands way above any other in the field - as Toto said, he 'make everyone else look silly' and he is right. There is a marked difference in his ability vs anyone else. It translates to any car, any setup. He is just a freak in the ability to make even slow cars fast. Further, did you see what his tires looked like during the race? I have no idea how he was able to keep putting distance between himself and the two Mclarens when they were almost split on the inner edge. Anyone else would have been in the wall keeping that pace level with tires that worn.

So it may not exactly have been Fionagate but this that made the man in the Far East make the call.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

- as Toto said, he 'make everyone else look silly' and he is right.

Russell: Give me 5 year contract
Toto: One.
Russell: Give that to Kimi.
Toto: .. still dreaming of Max ...

Mercedes have no driver for 2026 ... for now ...