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      07-09-2019, 04:28 PM   #1
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Drive Belt Failure

Had an interesting experience a couple of weeks ago. Normal drive on an 80 km/h road. Warning message telling me the car was overheating. Pulled over and turned off and back on. Message gone. Drive for another 100 metres and another message pops up telling me the battery is unable to charge and to pull over immediately.

BMW Assist towed the car to the nearest dealer and a colleague picked me up to take me to the meeting I had scheduled. Nearest dealer turned out to be complete jerks who when I called at the end of the day to get an update said they hadn't gotten around to looking at the car and probably wouldn't for a couple of days since I "had no appointment," and suggested I shouldn't bother calling them again but rather wait for them to call me when they'd had a chance to look at the car. Luckily BMW Assist agreed to tow the car to my local dealer, who now tell me the drive belt needs replacing.

Parts are on order from Germany and apparently could take another 5-10 business days, so all told I could be without the car for almost a month by the time they're done. At least I have an X1 loaner (which has made me realize just how flaky the wireless carplay is in the X5, since in the X1 it connects every time no problem...).

A pretty cra**y situation for a car that is six months old and only has 6,400 kms on the clock.
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      07-09-2019, 04:42 PM   #2
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I had an '08 A4 with less than 200 miles have the timing belt jump and borked the engine on a bridge.
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      07-09-2019, 04:42 PM   #3
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Unfortunate situation. What immedialty comes to mind is I read again & again on the forum that basic parts like your drive belt. or a water pump, ect have to be ordered from Germany. As the G05 X5 has been on the marker for a year now how can this be that parts are not stocked & available in he USA? There is no good reason or excuse for this.
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      07-09-2019, 06:14 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by mrjoed2 View Post
Unfortunate situation. What immedialty comes to mind is I read again & again on the forum that basic parts like your drive belt. or a water pump, ect have to be ordered from Germany. As the G05 X5 has been on the marker for a year now how can this be that parts are not stocked & available in he USA? There is no good reason or excuse for this.
Sorry to hear. Please keep us informed.

Whom was the jerk dealer? Whom is yours that seems to be good?
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      07-09-2019, 06:23 PM   #5
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BMW has no excuse for not stocking the parts in the US. Stupid.
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      07-10-2019, 11:42 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by mrjoed2 View Post
Unfortunate situation. What immedialty comes to mind is I read again & again on the forum that basic parts like your drive belt. or a water pump, ect have to be ordered from Germany. As the G05 X5 has been on the marker for a year now how can this be that parts are not stocked & available in he USA? There is no good reason or excuse for this.
Yes, 100% agree. The dealer is telling me this is normal because it's a "brand new model," but as you say that really isn't true any more. To be without my vehicle for this long is a bit ridiculous, and just seems like poor planning.
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      07-10-2019, 11:43 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by LexxM3 View Post
Sorry to hear. Please keep us informed.

Whom was the jerk dealer? Whom is yours that seems to be good?
Policaro in Brampton was the dealer I was frustrated with. BMW Toronto have at least been good in keeping me informed with updates, and genuinely the parts supply issue seems to be out of their control.
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      07-11-2019, 06:17 AM   #8
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I was told the same thing when they had to replace my KAFAS camera. I think it is potential stall tactic to "buy" them more time in getting the repair done. Especially since if the car is manufactured in South Carolina, you would think most of the incidental parts would be sourced here in the US. In fact my window sticker indicates 40% of the parts come from US, Canada or Mexico. Now if it were the engine then that would make more sense that it would come from Germany but a belt?!?
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      07-11-2019, 10:49 AM   #9
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Just to chime in on parts.

Manufactures do NOT store parts at the assembly plants for dealer services...

Keep in mind most of the parts are actually produced by third party builders. BMW does not produce its own frame they source that from companies such as Magna. Obviously we don't have a list of what they actually produce and what they source out.

Dealers utilize BMW Supply Chain to gather the needed parts from the manufactures of said parts. Most dealers keep limited inventory of commonly replaced parts, so with a new model such as the GO5 they maintain what has previously know from other models and things new to the GO5 are rarely ordered ahead of time in prep to be replaced bc there is no supporting data for that. Now a days electronics DOA is very rare so ordering costly parts to sit on a shelf does not make sense. Why pay for something you might not use or you might use??? Keep in mind dealers pay for the parts they store or have on site ahead of a warranty repair.

As for parts from overseas well BMW actually has many companies it works with overseas that produces the parts for their cars. Hence why parts come from there to dealers as well as the the assembly plant here in the states. Its very simple and common practice to perform lean manufacturing styles not to store un-needed parts at locations just to make delivery quicker. They are not like Amazon......


Ok my rant is over!!!
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      07-11-2019, 11:02 AM   #10
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I ordered a carb for the grand kids scooter from china and got it in two days via dhl. They could provide better service if they wanted to.
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      07-11-2019, 11:09 AM   #11
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They might not have a stock of them sitting around due to production demand and rely on the third party to ship direct. I'm not saying they cannot due better I mean who doesn't have room to improve!!! Just looking at pointed out the process that companies use often. Example my dealer knew the GO5 was going to have some growing pains thus ordered some extra items at their cost. Example was windshield no one in PHX had one and safelite said 2-3 weeks lead time. My dealer had 6 in stock and they typically only carry 3 of any given model.... Places can do better they always can but the dynamic amount of parts needed who can guess what is needed... Don't forget to add in production issues from a third party can also cause delays. Such as the belt on the thread, they use the same machine to make MANY styles of belt and to run a one off is extremely costly so they might of had to wait till the company switched over for another order of such belts. That should red light a dealer and they should know to have belts on hand (wear and tear item dealer should carry).
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      07-11-2019, 11:23 AM   #12
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Thanks for the detailed explanation, Tenac. I'm sure the dollars and cents all work out and this supply chain has been studied and worked (well, one would hope).

It just seems strange that every single part in an X5 is being manufactured in vast quantities to support production of X5s in South Carolina. One would think that it would be more efficient to have an extra 1% (or whatever) manufactured for inevitable replacements and warranty items. One would also think that BMW would have storage for spare parts in the US where a large percentage of X5s are sold and on the road, instead of shipping each part as needed from Europe to the US. And from a customer service standpoint, it would be better for BMW to have a customer without their new X5 for one day instead of the weeks on end you hear about on this forum waiting for parts.

It seems totally ridiculous to me that headlights, belts, windshields, etc. take weeks to secure when there are vast quantities of them in South Carolina. These items regularly are damaged in car accidents, from road debris, just simply failing, etc. and in not insignificant quantities considering the number of X5s on the road.

But what do I know... I'm being the definition of an armchair CEO
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      07-11-2019, 11:32 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X5_CC View Post
Thanks for the detailed explanation, Tenac. I'm sure the dollars and cents all work out and this supply chain has been studied and worked (well, one would hope).

It just seems strange that every single part in an X5 is being manufactured in vast quantities to support production of X5s in South Carolina. One would think that it would be more efficient to have an extra 1% (or whatever) manufactured for inevitable replacements and warranty items. One would also think that BMW would have storage for spare parts in the US where a large percentage of X5s are sold and on the road, instead of shipping each part as needed from Europe to the US. And from a customer service standpoint, it would be better for BMW to have a customer without their new X5 for one day instead of the weeks on end you hear about on this forum waiting for parts.

It seems totally ridiculous to me that headlights, belts, windshields, etc. take weeks to secure when there are vast quantities of them in South Carolina. These items regularly are damaged in car accidents, from road debris, just simply failing, etc. and in not insignificant quantities considering the number of X5s on the road.

But what do I know... I'm being the definition of an armchair CEO
The concerns are valid for sure. My only thought would be since the X5 sale numbers might be higher than supply chain can maintain at quality. I think if you look back at many first year model changes you will find this to be common, and maybe some dealers didn't do their homework when ordering wear and tear parts ahead of time, and assumed will we sell the I6 or V8 model already so no need to worry about that.. But in reality the pulley's can be different and many other items... Small over sights like this can leave customers stranded due to how the parts are set to be built and arrive. I am trying to provide a perspective other than angry customer perspective... lol
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      07-11-2019, 11:48 AM   #14
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Personally speaking, BMW is not new to the game of auto sales. I find it unacceptable that owners cars are down while waiting for parts. When designing products, part of the job is predicting spares usage at various points along the ownership experience. Predictors are assigned to each part based upon failure rates and design-to-wear life's and that algorithm then goes to procurement. Procurement is linked with sales so they know where the products are going and in what quantity and therefore order the parts and send them to the spares warehouses around the globe.

I can see waiting for parts that ended up very low on the expected replacement algorithm but even those parts may be required in the case of accidents.

That's the way its supposed to work and the way I would expect BMW to work. Spares should be at the warehouses in parallel with the sales of the cars.
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      07-11-2019, 11:51 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tenac View Post
Just to chime in on parts.

Manufactures do NOT store parts at the assembly plants for dealer services...

Its very simple and common practice to perform lean manufacturing styles not to store un-needed parts at locations just to make delivery quicker. They are not like Amazon......
Ahh yes JIT inventory. That brings me back to my masters b-school days!
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      07-11-2019, 11:57 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty in Bgm View Post
Personally speaking, BMW is not new to the game of auto sales. I find it unacceptable that owners cars are down while waiting for parts. When designing products, part of the job is predicting spares usage at various points along the ownership experience. Predictors are assigned to each part based upon failure rates and design-to-wear life's and that algorithm then goes to procurement. Procurement is linked with sales so they know where the products are going and in what quantity and therefore order the parts and send them to the spares warehouses around the globe.

I can see waiting for parts that ended up very low on the expected replacement algorithm but even those parts may be required in the case of accidents.

That's the way its supposed to work and the way I would expect BMW to work. Spares should be at the warehouses in parallel with the sales of the cars.
It is from my understanding BMW does not host Spare Parts Warehouses anywhere, they practice lean manufacturing and rely on the dealer network to host spares at dealer cost. I don't disagree it should be better for timing and response. Maybe they lack that direction when it comes to getting customer parts to dealers... say they use a chain now that just receives parts, where they should be using another method to escalate parts for warranty work.... I had my entire secondary and intercooler system replaced on my GO5 and at first I was told 4-6 weeks but the SA called tascara for a case and my parts arrive in less than two. By the way I never would have thought they would have those parts in stock..... lol belts YES for sure but its most likely a dealer mistake there.
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      07-11-2019, 12:04 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tenac View Post
Just to chime in on parts.

Manufactures do NOT store parts at the assembly plants for dealer services...

Keep in mind most of the parts are actually produced by third party builders. BMW does not produce its own frame they source that from companies such as Magna. Obviously we don't have a list of what they actually produce and what they source out.

Dealers utilize BMW Supply Chain to gather the needed parts from the manufactures of said parts. Most dealers keep limited inventory of commonly replaced parts, so with a new model such as the GO5 they maintain what has previously know from other models and things new to the GO5 are rarely ordered ahead of time in prep to be replaced bc there is no supporting data for that. Now a days electronics DOA is very rare so ordering costly parts to sit on a shelf does not make sense. Why pay for something you might not use or you might use??? Keep in mind dealers pay for the parts they store or have on site ahead of a warranty repair.

As for parts from overseas well BMW actually has many companies it works with overseas that produces the parts for their cars. Hence why parts come from there to dealers as well as the the assembly plant here in the states. Its very simple and common practice to perform lean manufacturing styles not to store un-needed parts at locations just to make delivery quicker. They are not like Amazon......


Ok my rant is over!!!


I don't think I stated or implied that manufacturers would store parts for dealer services. The original thread referenced a drive belt replacement which had to come from Germany. It my opinion that seemed odd since we were not talking about a critical or proprietary piece of equipment that BMW would want or need to keep tight controls over. I also understand that dealers do not like to keep surplus inventory on hand given the carrying cost of such items. My point is that I believe the "it has to come from Germany" probably byes them more time to source the part.

My point is that as to the parts which are supplied in the US or across one of our nearby borders you would think they would be able to supply the part more quickly and it would not have come from Germany. Some parts yes. So before you rant, you may want to read the post a little more closely.
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      07-11-2019, 12:12 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Espejo View Post
I don't think I stated or implied that manufacturers would store parts for dealer services. The original thread referenced a drive belt replacement which had to come from Germany. It my opinion that seemed odd since we were not talking about a critical or proprietary piece of equipment that BMW would want or need to keep tight controls over. I also understand that dealers do not like to keep surplus inventory on hand given the carrying cost of such items. My point is that I believe the "it has to come from Germany" probably byes them more time to source the part.

My point is that as to the parts which are supplied in the US or across one of our nearby borders you would think they would be able to supply the part more quickly and it would not have come from Germany. Some parts yes. So before you rant, you may want to read the post a little more closely.
I actually talk about that with the belt in my reply, it is possible they do not have "extra" from a production plant to supply to customers. The dealer should have this part pre-ordered for stock since it meets the wear and tear process. So my rant is more about the immediate opinion response about the company not performing at expectations. My post was more of a different perspective than most, which I understand is not liked by many. I pointed out possible roadblocks to such part or parts when model year one is release.
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      07-11-2019, 01:17 PM   #19
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I'm going back a bit but BMW did have spares warehouses in the US, one on each coast and I think one somewhere mid country. I ordered a headliner for my 8 Series back around 2003 and was told by a friend who works for BMW that their US warehouses didn't have any and it would have to come from a German warehouse. I placed the order and it was delivered in a week.

This also happened to a few other parts over the years. It could certainly be they have phased them out and pushed requirements onto their suppliers like many other businesses did. However, it makes sense to me that parts that have a high likelihood of being replaced would be stocked somewhere by someone. Probably with the rise of online orders from internet, sales have diminished the volume of BMW supplied parts. Heck, I now see a number of BMW dealerships selling via the internet, Amazon and eBay, which was not the case a decade ago.

Its still inexcusable to make owners wait for parts like drive belts, I don't care how new the car is...which by the way, the G05 is not new anymore, its a year old and BMW knew it was going into production five years ago.
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      07-11-2019, 01:26 PM   #20
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I get that supply chains are about balancing efficiency and convenience, but that would excuse the car being out of commission for a week, not a month as it now looks like it will be.
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      07-11-2019, 01:41 PM   #21
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I get that supply chains are about balancing efficiency and convenience, but that would excuse the car being out of commission for a week, not a month as it now looks like it will be.
Fully agree with the opinion. I am a bit more say forgiving or understandable whatever fits best... I would hope the lesson learned at the dealer keeps them on their toes to keep parts on stock that can wear or tear.... If you seen the TFL about their model 3 rear windshield that took 8 weeks to get in NOW that is nutz.... lol
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      07-11-2019, 03:25 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tenac View Post
Just to chime in on parts.

Manufactures do NOT store parts at the assembly plants for dealer services...

Keep in mind most of the parts are actually produced by third party builders. BMW does not produce its own frame they source that from companies such as Magna. Obviously we don't have a list of what they actually produce and what they source out.

Dealers utilize BMW Supply Chain to gather the needed parts from the manufactures of said parts. Most dealers keep limited inventory of commonly replaced parts, so with a new model such as the GO5 they maintain what has previously know from other models and things new to the GO5 are rarely ordered ahead of time in prep to be replaced bc there is no supporting data for that. Now a days electronics DOA is very rare so ordering costly parts to sit on a shelf does not make sense. Why pay for something you might not use or you might use??? Keep in mind dealers pay for the parts they store or have on site ahead of a warranty repair.

As for parts from overseas well BMW actually has many companies it works with overseas that produces the parts for their cars. Hence why parts come from there to dealers as well as the the assembly plant here in the states. Its very simple and common practice to perform lean manufacturing styles not to store un-needed parts at locations just to make delivery quicker. They are not like Amazon......


Ok my rant is over!!!
All well & good. But of course the G05 is not a new model , it has been on sale for a full year now. With thousands sold in the USA. So it still makes no sense whatever - from a business perspective or customer satisfaction to not stock basic parts in the USA.
And I would have to assume that it costs more to have a drive belt shipped from Germany than located stateside. And what about the cumulative costs of loaner cars for simple repairs held up for weeks since they have to be imported? And unhappy customers in typically a lower end loaner than their vehicle? Ridiculous business model.
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