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      10-02-2020, 11:41 AM   #67
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Originally Posted by jad03060 View Post
By code, on certain types of devices, you can only utilize 80% of the circuit capacity. So, as was said, if you have a device capable of drawing 40A, that's 80% of a 50A circuit. You must have both the wiring and the protection (fuse or circuit breaker) appropriate for the circuit.

A 32A circuit therefore requires a 40A circuit.

As a circuit is providing power, things heat up. Heating up, even the supply wiring, also increases the resistance, which creates more heat...you need a buffer when the device will be on a long time.
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      10-25-2020, 05:01 PM   #68
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Jalopnik - Over 25% of US EV owners install their own level 2 charger without an electrician.

I would assume it's a similar percentage for PHEV owners. It was really pretty simple.
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      10-25-2020, 08:32 PM   #69
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It's generally just three wires in the US:
- L1
- L2
- ground

Not that hard once you've run the wiring and installed the breaker. If you don't know what you're doing, it's much safer to pay someone, or, in my town and per my condo bylaws, you're required to use a licensed electrician to do wiring changes, so I paid for it to be done. Had him do some other things while he was there that I'd been putting off.
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      10-26-2020, 10:06 AM   #70
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Originally Posted by X5 45e View Post
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Originally Posted by RocketGoBoom View Post
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Originally Posted by Finito84 View Post
Amazing level of detail, but I am not an expert on anything electricity related.

I talked last week to my trusted electrician who has been fixing things here and there since we bought a house last year. He told me to get the Juice box 48 as I plan to get a 100% electric vehicle for my wife next year. He is doing something to the electric box, moving around the breaks, and pulling cable through the house to the garage. Sorry for the lack of details.
The Juice Box is also a good option at $600 to $700, depending on the power level. I would encourage everyone to do either the 40 amp ($619) or 48 amp ($659) version.

It is only $40 more for the 48 amp version, so go for that if you do it.

https://evcharging.enelx.com/products/juicebox

And I would encourage every BMW EV or PHEV owner to also get this adapter so you can recharge your BMW at any Tesla destination charger. They are in practically every luxury hotel around and many different destinations. And they are often free to use. Stores and hotels install the Tesla chargers and add them to the charging maps in order to attract Tesla customers.

https://ev-lectron.com/collections/e...-adapter-black
Nice tip for the Tesla destination charger. I can confirm that. I used it a lot this holiday. And usually free. When staying in a hotel for some days and full charging a couple of times you save some euros. The ones with a white sticker are for all brands the red ones are programmed to be used by Tesla only.

And in Europe we get the same Mennekes plug as Tesla so we can use it without adapter.

In my experience they don't show on the bmw charge app or idrive navigation but you can find them on the Tesla app
Re: comment on Europe. Are you advising that the Tesla and BMW charging cables fully compatible. So we can simply use a Tesla Walsall Connector without adapter? Thanks
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      10-26-2020, 01:02 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Witney View Post
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Originally Posted by X5 45e View Post
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Originally Posted by RocketGoBoom View Post
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Originally Posted by Finito84 View Post
Amazing level of detail, but I am not an expert on anything electricity related.

I talked last week to my trusted electrician who has been fixing things here and there since we bought a house last year. He told me to get the Juice box 48 as I plan to get a 100% electric vehicle for my wife next year. He is doing something to the electric box, moving around the breaks, and pulling cable through the house to the garage. Sorry for the lack of details.
The Juice Box is also a good option at $600 to $700, depending on the power level. I would encourage everyone to do either the 40 amp ($619) or 48 amp ($659) version.

It is only $40 more for the 48 amp version, so go for that if you do it.

https://evcharging.enelx.com/products/juicebox

And I would encourage every BMW EV or PHEV owner to also get this adapter so you can recharge your BMW at any Tesla destination charger. They are in practically every luxury hotel around and many different destinations. And they are often free to use. Stores and hotels install the Tesla chargers and add them to the charging maps in order to attract Tesla customers.

https://ev-lectron.com/collections/e...-adapter-black
Nice tip for the Tesla destination charger. I can confirm that. I used it a lot this holiday. And usually free. When staying in a hotel for some days and full charging a couple of times you save some euros. The ones with a white sticker are for all brands the red ones are programmed to be used by Tesla only.

And in Europe we get the same Mennekes plug as Tesla so we can use it without adapter.

In my experience they don't show on the bmw charge app or idrive navigation but you can find them on the Tesla app
Re: comment on Europe. Are you advising that the Tesla and BMW charging cables fully compatible. So we can simply use a Tesla Walsall Connector without adapter? Thanks
Yes we can they are both Mennekes 2. But only the destination chargers off course.

The ones with white stickers are released for all brands. The red ones Tesla only.
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      10-26-2020, 01:51 PM   #72
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The 45e is limited to 16A maximum current, regardless of the applied voltage and will draw a maximum of 3700W. To get that max, you need something like 232vac and that 16A (power=volts*amps and can't exceed 3700W - think of the vehicle like it's a smart 3700W light bulb, but limited to 16A).

So, if you had a 16A 120vac EVSE, you could only get to about half of its maximum charging rate. You'd need a 20A 120vac receptacle to get that 16A, though, and those aren't as common in a residence. So, for the US, they supply a unit that will plug into any 120vac socket in the home, whether it's a 15 or 20A one. Because of the length of time it is likely to be on, the US electrical code requires you to derate the line to 80%, which on a typical home, would be 12A, but to provide a little margin for say, you turning on a light in the garage on the same circuit, the unit provided only supplies 10A max.

In the US, 240vac devices tend to be on a dedicated circuit, so you can make them whatever size you want.
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      10-29-2020, 10:42 PM   #73
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So ...

I have a water heater and a dryer in my garage...

Can I 'tap' into these 220 lines to install my wall charger ?

OR

Do I need to run a new line all the way to the main fuse box ?

I know second option is better but if option 1 is ok, that would make it simpler for my application

If anybody has knowledge on this.. I figured it would be here.
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      10-29-2020, 11:37 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philooo View Post
So ...

I have a water heater and a dryer in my garage...

Can I 'tap' into these 220 lines to install my wall charger ?

OR

Do I need to run a new line all the way to the main fuse box ?

I know second option is better but if option 1 is ok, that would make it simpler for my application

If anybody has knowledge on this.. I figured it would be here.
Yes, you can use your existing 220 line as long as you buy a level 2 charger fitting the type of 220 plug you have on that outlet...
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      10-30-2020, 12:21 AM   #75
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Generally, it's a one or the other on a line like that. IOW, running the EVSE and say the water heater at the same time would likely trip the breaker. Most WH are hardwired, so there may not be an easy way to ensure it will not try to turn on to heat the water.

You'd have to know the gauge of wire and the size of the breaker and match things up to be safe. Most WH are on a 25-30A circuit. Say it was 30A, using the 80% rule in the US, you could put a max of a 24A EVSE on the line. You could safely swap between the WH and the EVSE with a transfer switch, but charging overnight, you may not have a full heat tank in the morning of the WH if you used any in the evening.

Now, a dryer is usually wired with a plug, so swapping the EVSE in would work fine if the cord lengths would get the plug to your vehicle to begin charging. Same rules apply about max capacity, but a dryer may be on a larger circuit (but not necessarily).
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      11-10-2020, 02:17 PM   #76
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Not electricity literate here.

Can you plug the charging cable into a 220-240v outlet without ANY additional hardware, just as you can with the 110-12-v outlet?

If you can, assuming you can use the max. 16amp setting, how long would it take to fully charge, 7-8 hours?

If you can't what hardware (charging unit) would be sufficient?
Thanks!
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      11-10-2020, 02:22 PM   #77
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If you're thinking about plugging it into an existing dryer outlet, you may want to check if that's the same connection type on the level 2 charger.
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      11-10-2020, 02:34 PM   #78
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Can you plug the charging cable into a 220-240v outlet without ANY additional hardware, just as you can with the 110-12-v outlet?
No, you can't. The cable that is supplied with the car is just for 120v.

If you haven't already, read this thread in its entirety. There is a ton of good information there. Personally, I installed a Chargepoint Flex charger. It can go up to 40 amp with my install. We are planning to get a full EV as the other car next year so this charger will work for both cars, although not at the same time. It works great with the 45e. The 45e draws 16 amps from it and recharges in about 5 hours.
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      11-10-2020, 02:46 PM   #79
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Thanks Spencer518 for that. I did read the entire thread and learn a lot, especially the adapter plug for the J1772. Onward!
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      11-10-2020, 06:21 PM   #80
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While there are a few aftermarket 120-240 compatible EVSE devices out there, the one supplied with your BMW is not one of them.

The plug that goes into the vehicle is the same. The EVSE itself has a small power supply and logic board that runs it for things like the idiot lights, and the interlock signals. The power devices would have to also be able to handle the increased voltage as well as the internal power supply. IOW, no, it's not a universal power supply that can be plugged in anywhere. It would be nice, in that doubling the voltage from 120-240 vac would double the power delivered out of it. It would also rely on the user, potentially, being smarter.
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      11-10-2020, 10:48 PM   #81
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Going through this right now as well. Luckily my electrical meter is on the outside wall of the garage and my main panel is on the interior wall. Rather than stuffing another breaker into the current panel, decided to add a dedicated panel with a 160amp circuit. Short run from that panel to where I want the capability/headroom to add two 60amp chargers. Know that it's overkill for the 45e but would rather take advantage of the 30% tax credit on equipment/install and future proof vs. redo everything in the future.
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      11-11-2020, 12:38 AM   #82
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My townhouse has a 100A panel, and no real cost effective way to make it larger...so, one does what one has to! It was a stretch to put in a 32A unit on a 40A breaker. That maxed out my i3, and also does the new x5. Who knows where I'll be for the next one. Basically, put as large a one you feel comfortable installing. MOre may not buy you anything right now, but who knows down the road. The labor is likely to be more than the delta to do it twice.
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      11-14-2020, 10:50 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RocketGoBoom View Post
I just made a quick video and uploaded it to YouTube showing my new 2021 X5 xDrive45e using my Tesla Wall Connector.



Using this adapter for the Tesla to J-1772 connection.
This adapter is great for all X5 45e owners to buy regardless, because there are thousands of these Tesla wall connectors all over the place in useful destinations. Tesla calls them "Destination Chargers". And they are free. At most you have to pay valet parking fees at hotels, which you would likely pay regardless.

https://ev-lectron.com/collections/e...-adapter-black
Great stuff, thanks. I've got the Tesla Nema 1450 plug coming out of my 240 powered wall outlet. Is there a better adapter I can use at the wall to charge my upcoming 45e, besides the adapter you mentioned, which plugs into the car?

Also, any of you consider a lease, to insulate yourself from some of the depreciation, even though it means forgoing the $7,500 tax credit?
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      11-17-2020, 04:06 PM   #84
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My setup was as follow:

~80 ft run from the main - 3/4 inch conduit + connectors $60
6 gauge which is rated at 55 Amp - future proof even though 45e can do 16 Amp - (200 ft 6-guage black $130, 100ft 10-gauge white/neutral $25)
50 Amp breaker - $10
Nema 6-50R - $10
Siemens VC30GRYU 30 Amp Level 2 Charger $270 (used) - overkill for 45e but future proof / good enough. In case will just replace charger for 40/50 Amp.

Total ~ $500


PS. I'm still upset that BMW included 10A charger instead of 16A as its max. Cheap
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      11-17-2020, 04:34 PM   #85
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PS. I'm still upset that BMW included 10A charger instead of 16A as its max. Cheap
Same! I've been using the included "mobile charger" for my Model 3 for 2 years now. I only just bought a wall charger for it (and at $500, it's FAR cheaper than any other similar option). I'm going to be ghetto and use the Tesla Mobile Charger for the 45e. It'll require a $200 Lectron adaptor (see RocketGoBoom's video), but $200 is the cheapest way to go. Plus, it'll give me the ability to use Tesla destination chargers out in the wild. I thought about future proofing, but I don't know whether I'll replace the BMW with another Tesla or not so I didn't want to buy a wall unit just yet.
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      11-17-2020, 05:41 PM   #86
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PS. I'm still upset that BMW included 10A charger instead of 16A as its max. Cheap
Everyone in the USA has 15A receptacles...not that many have 20A ones. A device capable of 16A requires a plug that will only fit into a 20A receptacle...so, there would be LOTS of people annoyed when they could not plug it in at all. At least in the USA, it's really intended as an emergency backup, or, say, if you're visiting someone and want to plug it in.

It's not cheap...it's practical. Now, it could have been a 12A device, and they did that on some of their earlier EVs, but if that garage circuit shares power with say the garage door opener, or you plug in a power tool, or even turn on the lights, you'd be much more likely to pop the breaker, so they dropped it down to a 10A device.

The included EVSE, at least in the USA, is only useful in an emergency, or you don't use your vehicle that often, and can wait for it to become fully recharged.
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      11-17-2020, 06:01 PM   #87
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Everyone in the USA has 15A receptacles...not that many have 20A ones. A device capable of 16A requires a plug that will only fit into a 20A receptacle...so, there would be LOTS of people annoyed when they could not plug it in at all. At least in the USA, it's really intended as an emergency backup, or, say, if you're visiting someone and want to plug it in.

It's not cheap...it's practical. Now, it could have been a 12A device, and they did that on some of their earlier EVs, but if that garage circuit shares power with say the garage door opener, or you plug in a power tool, or even turn on the lights, you'd be much more likely to pop the breaker, so they dropped it down to a 10A device.

The included EVSE, at least in the USA, is only useful in an emergency, or you don't use your vehicle that often, and can wait for it to become fully recharged.
I could swallow that... if it came with a 3 kW battery. This thing's got 24 and they're bragging about 50+ miles of range in Europe. That's Level 2 territory.
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      11-17-2020, 06:07 PM   #88
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I could swallow that... if it came with a 3 kW battery. This thing's got 24 and they're bragging about 50+ miles of range in Europe. That's Level 2 territory.
So, you want them to supply a level 2 device? I'm not sure what you're asking. Given the US 120-vac receptacles that every home/office has, you really can't choose a device that will only plug into a 20A circuit, or, even one that might plug into a dryer socket. Now, there are some multi-voltage devices they could choose, but that is not the norm in the industry, either.

It's not as bad in places where a 220-240vac socket is the norm.
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