[Auricom]

Originally Posted by Marty in NY

...I think Auricom has a diagram of what the inside of the Multi-contour seats look like. There's a lot going on inside those seats, especially yours that have cooling

Qsilver7 has a general BMW seat ventilation diagram:

https://g05.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...93&postcount=9

Here's the breakdown of G05 456 Comfort seats with heating or heating/vent/massage. Enjoy the pics.

[10101X5]

Originally Posted by Marty in NY

Well, I was joking with LexxM3 about the headrest The seat uses air bladders (bags) that when inflated, create the bulge in your lumbar area that pushes against your back. I think Auricom has a diagram of what the inside of the Multi-contour seats look like. There's a lot going on inside those seats, especially yours that have cooling. Anyway, I mean it works like most other cars to increase/decrease and move up/down the lumbar bulge so I was just saying to be sure when you think you have the lumbar all the way retracted, keep your finger on the button a bit longer just to be sure the air bag is fully deflated. You've probably already played with this so maybe its a matter of adjusting the seat back and tilt function of the seat bottom in conjunction with the lumbar to find the sweet spot for you. I know for me, 99% of the cars out there just don't seem to put the air bag in the right place for me but after a while, I find the sweet spot and it works.

.

It's funny but yes, I did do that -- keep pushing the button hoping to deflate more. When you said "air bags", I thought you meant the air bags.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by Marty in NY

Were/are you in marketing?

Actually that was one of my MBA concentrations.

[Marty in NY]

Originally Posted by fe03h20

I got IvoryW/NB Merino on 1 month old car.
A few of my fat-ass kids could’ve been sitting there…but i don’t see anything troubling.
Cellulite -free i would say.

Thanks for posting! Just as neat and tidy as on the BMW website - love it. Keep the kids out or put them on a diet

[Beefcake]

Perfect anti-wrinkle crème on my seats 🤭

[BMPHIL]

It looks like BMW has got rid of the wrinkles, so much for the people who posted that they were intentional to make the seats more comfortable.

[Marty in NY]

Originally Posted by BMPHIL

It looks like BMW has got rid of the wrinkles, so much for the people who posted that they were intentional to make the seats more comfortable.

Hold on, BMW stated they were in fact intentional and they made them more comfortable by allowing the "extra" material within the pleats to expand thereby satisfying more people, big and small.

For me, it was the inconsistency (sloppiness) that was annoying and very much the fact that no where on any of the BMW sites did they show the rear seats with any sort of wrinkles at all, they were all smooth, void of pleats/wrinkles. Had they all been consistent and modest, I would not take this position.

Anyone can choose to believe or disbelieve what they said, was it a cover up for poor quality control that left the factory? Dunno but BMW has put pleats/wrinkles or whatever you want to call them in several of their cars over the years, as many other luxo brands have and you tend to see this in their higher end cars. For me, if they cannot control their seat supplier's quality, then simply remove what they cannot do - i.e.: pleats/wrinkles. I am hoping this is the direction they have gone in which is why I revived this topic so we could see the 2021 rear seats.

Here's a pic of my '94 840, complete with seat wrinkles, they all had them, 840's, 850's, CSi's. Its marketed as a luxo indicator Keep in mind, these seats are not on a new car but the rears are basically new, well because no human of any normal size can fit back there or would want to for very long. I think the longest I lasted back there was 30 minutes before begging my wife to pull over so I could get back up front The bottom pic is of the drivers seat, I decided to refinish it and took a pic once I had it out of the car and the headrest removed.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by BMPHIL

It looks like BMW has got rid of the wrinkles, so much for the people who posted that they were intentional to make the seats more comfortable.

Some people never learn.

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by BMPHIL

It looks like BMW has got rid of the wrinkles, so much for the people who posted that they were intentional to make the seats more comfortable.

Maybe BMW got rid them because of the complaints of a vocal few cosmetic-obsessives?

Wouldn't be the first time a company made a product worse for all because of an OCD vocal few; that's a possibility too right?

[zhangyi17]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

Maybe BMW got rid them because of the complaints of a vocal few cosmetic-obsessives?

Wouldn't be the first time a company made a product worse for all because of an OCD vocal few; that's a possibility too right?

I wouldn't be surprised that BMW NA has ppl monitoring these forum looking for feedback

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

Maybe BMW got rid them because of the complaints of a vocal few cosmetic-obsessives?

Wouldn't be the first time a company made a product worse for all because of an OCD vocal few; that's a possibility too right?

I believe you hit the nail on the head. Even though the idea was to solve a problem that was evident and complained about in the previous series, the complaints about the current seats were likely just as plentiful so this MY they decided to remove the ruching/gathering/wrinkles. Not sure how much difference in comfort there will be. If the wrinkles are back in the LCI we will know people were complaining again.

[BMPHIL]

You hold on Marty, it wasn't BMW who said the wrinkles were intentional it was fools on here. If you have proof of BMW saying it I will apologise, my proof is in this thread. Turtle boy was one of them and he will never learn.

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by BMPHIL

You hold on Marty, it wasn't BMW who said the wrinkles were intentional it was fools on here. If you have proof of BMW saying it I will apologise, my proof is in this thread. Turtle boy was one of them and he will never learn.

Nice prove-a-negative sir-when-did-you-stop-beating-your-wife formulation there.

But now let's move back to reality - Marty doesn't have to prove shit because it's a reasonable & fair assumption if BMW delivered them that way across many vehicles, they designed them that way and intended to despite your preferences otherwise.

Eg., "the first 2,000 vehicles had Michelins, but now they have contis! FLAWSSS! it proves EVERYTHING! BMW never intended to use Michelins! SEE?!?!" Sounds a bit conspiracy-theory right?

So what's NOT reasonable is, "but I don't like it so it MUST be a FLAW! It's just gotta be you guys!"

So YOU prove they're undesigned flaws - and if you can't then it's just a factless foundation-free accusation that kinda moves it into crank territory.

In short, you should be apologising until you can prove design flaws.

[TurtleBoy]

GrussGott don't even waste your time. The overwhelming majority of folks know that the non-smooth rear seats were there by design. A minority of folks realized that the only possible explanation for the wrinkles/ruching/gathering was that they were intentional but given this was an on-going fun thread liked to argue it was some type of mass conspiracy/incompetency by all levels in various departments at BMW and Magna. Then there is the extreme minority, of which BMPHIL is the poster child, which refuses to use any logic or consider all the data and information that has been presented when discussing the issue. All they are interested in is saying it is definitely not by design. Unfortunately when asked to present a scenario how that could be possible all one hears is crickets.

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

GrussGott don't even waste your time.

buh buh buh PEOPLE ARE WRONG ON THE INTERNET!

[mitch57]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

GrussGott don't even waste your time. The overwhelming majority of folks know that the non-smooth rear seats were there by design. A minority of folks realized that the only possible explanation for the wrinkles/ruching/gathering was that they were intentional but given this was an on-going fun thread liked to argue it was some type of mass conspiracy/incompetency by all levels in various departments at BMW and Magna. Then there is the extreme minority, of which BMPHIL is the poster child, which refuses to use any logic or consider all the data and information that has been presented when discussing the issue. All they are interested in is saying it is definitely not by design. Unfortunately when asked to present a scenario how that could be possible all one hears is crickets.

According to BMPHIL we are in the minority here and are members of a rare group. https://g05.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...&postcount=818

[Marty in NY]

Originally Posted by BMPHIL

You hold on Marty, it wasn't BMW who said the wrinkles were intentional it was fools on here. If you have proof of BMW saying it I will apologise, my proof is in this thread. Turtle boy was one of them and he will never learn.

I contacted Bernard Kuhnt, BMW NA CEO about this issue and was informed on Feb 11, 2020 "The seat concept was intentionally changed to a less tight and softer look which ultimately adds to the comfort of the seat"

I think their intentions were good but they failed on the execution. Apology accepted

[amphiprion]

Originally Posted by Marty in NY

Hold on, BMW stated they were in fact intentional and they made them more comfortable by allowing the "extra" material within the pleats to expand thereby satisfying more people, big and small.

For me, it was the inconsistency (sloppiness) that was annoying and very much the fact that no where on any of the BMW sites did they show the rear seats with any sort of wrinkles at all, they were all smooth, void of pleats/wrinkles. Had they all been consistent and modest, I would not take this position.

Anyone can choose to believe or disbelieve what they said, was it a cover up for poor quality control that left the factory? Dunno but BMW has put pleats/wrinkles or whatever you want to call them in several of their cars over the years, as many other luxo brands have and you tend to see this in their higher end cars. For me, if they cannot control their seat supplier's quality, then simply remove what they cannot do - i.e.: pleats/wrinkles. I am hoping this is the direction they have gone in which is why I revived this topic so we could see the 2021 rear seats.

I agree with all of your points above. There were some awful examples of the inconsistency you mentioned and us long-time fans of this beloved thread remember them well. If they can’t execute it well, I’d rather see them remove it.

PS- Set a date for this thread and the LCI…

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by amphiprion

I agree with all of your points above. There were some awful examples of the inconsistency you mentioned and us long-time fans of this beloved thread remember them well. If they can’t execute it well, I’d rather see them remove it.

PS- Set a date for this thread and the LCI…

I think this was probably the best example of the inconsistency and very bad seats that got delivered. This was BigSanj 's, he refused delivery.

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by Marty in NY

I contacted Bernard Kuhnt, BMW NA CEO about this issue

Holy shit really?

Did he answer and if not did a specific person answer? I'm kinda impressed they responded and were detailed!

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

I think this was probably the best example of the inconsistency and very bad seats that got delivered. This was BigSanj 's, he refused delivery.

Man, kinda hard to tell from the pics, but I wouldn't have had a problem with that unless the left and right sides were visually different ... it looks like maybe they are but hard to tell.

I have a lot of leather stuff (from days gone by!) and that looks pretty cozy so I might've thought "Fancy!" - like Marty's '94 840 looks way fancier to my eye than super stiff leather ... I guess I'm a lover of 80s Bavarian style.

EDIT: Oh! I should add, I was once invited to a private town hall tour in a small German town in the alps (they had records going back to the 1500s!) - anyway, all the furniture was fancy overstuffed wrinkly leather like Marty in NY's 840.

[OzzieJeff]

Originally Posted by LexxM3

Uhm … don't read the rest of this post and don't look at the zoomed picture if you're really OCD and/or just don't want to know, but …

… what's up with that headrest!?

Self inflicted? They fold in like airplane seats...

[BMPHIL]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

Nice prove-a-negative sir-when-did-you-stop-beating-your-wife formulation there.

But now let's move back to reality - Marty doesn't have to prove shit because it's a reasonable & fair assumption if BMW delivered them that way across many vehicles, they designed them that way and intended to despite your preferences otherwise.

Eg., "the first 2,000 vehicles had Michelins, but now they have contis! FLAWSSS! it proves EVERYTHING! BMW never intended to use Michelins! SEE?!?!" Sounds a bit conspiracy-theory right?

So what's NOT reasonable is, "but I don't like it so it MUST be a FLAW! It's just gotta be you guys!"

So YOU prove they're undesigned flaws - and if you can't then it's just a factless foundation-free accusation that kinda moves it into crank territory.

In short, you should be apologising until you can prove design flaws.

Get a life and admit you are wrong.