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      11-06-2019, 08:03 AM   #89
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Originally Posted by natahoa View Post
I own the car and have a loan. Monthly payment is $1,200, so I’m coming up on $2,400 in payments with no car to show for it.

If I traded it now it would prob cost me about $10k. In another year, the value would be closer to the remaining loan. But I plan to talk to some dealers and see what they can do for me. Then I can decide on the timing of a trade.

I am in the US. I’ve only experienced braking intervention once, at driving speed going forward. Clearly it doesn’t work at slow speed in reverse.
Traded two 2018 Q7s, one with less than 2,000 miles and one less than 15,000, for 2020 BMWs. Took about a $50k bath combined and worth it, to me. Your mileage may vary. Going in reverse and trading out of BMW for a less expensive car may mean less out-of-pocket for you, but you will take a depreciation hit on a new car.
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      11-06-2019, 08:07 AM   #90
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Originally Posted by randybobandy View Post
I was too lazy to go back and reach a bunch of the replies, but is your insurance covering it? I would assume the damage is much more than your deductible. Do you have a rental vehicle under your policy? I can see why the dealership might not do the loaner, as it isn't their problem (other than the parts delay). I went through the same thing with the windshield. I guess there was some fault with something to do with the heating. It took about 3-4 weeks, which seemed crazy. The only rational explanation I received was that they are cranking these vehicles out, so the replacement parts are few and far between.

I wouldn't take the bath on trading the car in. It's a great vehicle, which caught you on a bad day. You would be hard pressed to find something else, especially after taking the hit on the trade. Hoping it won't be too long for you!
Yes insurance is covering it. I have other cars and don’t need a rental. My problem is the sheer incompetence of a wildly popular production car, and it can’t be repaired.

I mean, bumpers get damaged all the time. BMW should be able to provide replacements without crazy delays.

I’m over the tech that doesn’t work or takes an engineering degree to figure out, the incompetence of buggy tech, and a company that doesn’t care enough to make sure it has adequate common replacement parts available in a reasonable period of time.

FAR FAR FAR from a “luxury car” experience. Very very far.

It is a very nice car, but I can buy many other very nice cars. First and last BMW and any other German car, for sure.

I have NO clue how long this will take. I hope I have the damn car back by Christmas as I’m planning a road trip that week and would prefer to drive my expensive new “luxury” car instead of my aging Highlander.
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      11-06-2019, 08:17 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by Paladin1 View Post
Traded two 2018 Q7s, one with less than 2,000 miles and one less than 15,000, for 2020 BMWs. Took about a $50k bath combined and worth it, to me. Your mileage may vary. Going in reverse and trading out of BMW for a less expensive car may mean less out-of-pocket for you, but you will take a depreciation hit on a new car.
Thanks! That is a LOt. You must’ve HATED those cars. I’d probably buy Lincoln, or possibly even Cadillac or Buick - which I’d never thought I’d even consider. I’m also considering pickup trucks, they can be tricked out pretty nice these days.

I can afford it, but it grinds on me to be paying so much each month, with no car to drive. The hits just keep adding up.

I think if I put a dealer on notice that I want a specific car, they might alert me when they get a car that the buyer can’t take, turned in nearly new, or something like that. That is how we got a nice deal on our Honda odyssey years ago. Someone ordered and then didn’t want it.

It’s a project I didn’t expect. Car shopping really kinda sucks. I’m just so terribly frustrated.
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      11-06-2019, 08:35 AM   #92
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Originally Posted by natahoa View Post
Thanks! That is a LOt. You must’ve HATED those cars. I’d probably buy Lincoln, or possibly even Cadillac or Buick - which I’d never thought I’d even consider. I’m also considering pickup trucks, they can be tricked out pretty nice these days.

I can afford it, but it grinds on me to be paying so much each month, with no car to drive. The hits just keep adding up.

I think if I put a dealer on notice that I want a specific car, they might alert me when they get a car that the buyer can’t take, turned in nearly new, or something like that. That is how we got a nice deal on our Honda odyssey years ago. Someone ordered and then didn’t want it.

It’s a project I didn’t expect. Car shopping really kinda sucks. I’m just so terribly frustrated.
Completely understand the frustration. Came from a BMW background just prior to the Audis, and the Q7s were great cars in many ways, but less dependable tech than BMW for me. A lot less. The clincher was the dual clutch transmission and - IMO - extremely dangerous lag on acceleration. So much so that you had to factor it in with every stop, with more than one close call, and one too many for me. The Germans do have their individual and expensive quirks. I also had a run of Lexus SUVs - easy to repair, and almost never needing it, but like driving your living room couch. And waaay back, Buick and Pontiac, which to be frank I despised. Best of luck on your search!
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      11-06-2019, 08:43 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by natahoa View Post
Yes insurance is covering it. I have other cars and don’t need a rental. My problem is the sheer incompetence of a wildly popular production car, and it can’t be repaired.

I mean, bumpers get damaged all the time. BMW should be able to provide replacements without crazy delays.

I’m over the tech that doesn’t work or takes an engineering degree to figure out, the incompetence of buggy tech, and a company that doesn’t care enough to make sure it has adequate common replacement parts available in a reasonable period of time.

FAR FAR FAR from a “luxury car” experience. Very very far.

It is a very nice car, but I can buy many other very nice cars. First and last BMW and any other German car, for sure.

I have NO clue how long this will take. I hope I have the damn car back by Christmas as I’m planning a road trip that week and would prefer to drive my expensive new “luxury” car instead of my aging Highlander.

I can only imagine...they is the one crappy thing, you would think they repair parts would be readily available. I would just keep hounding the point of contact at BMW...I think it'll be sooner than you think for everything to get worked out. The tech is slowly working itself out. Trust me...I was about ready to torch the car a few months back. It is getting there.

This is my second BMW, and it took me some time getting adjusted to it. Coming from an F80 M3, the tech was simple...and it was a solid, purpose built car. I don't know if that has to do with the build quality (I swear the built stuff better outside of the US) or if they just put more effort into the M cars. It was a HUGE change, as I felt like I was driving a boat compared to other SUVs and obviously the M3.

I went for a comfort built vehicle, and to BMW's credit, that is what I got. It's the disparity between X5 to X5 and all the kinks and what not that come up. Some of us are more particular about the vehicle, but a lot of people lease and just say "oh F it, it's done in 3 years". I hope that's not the mentality BMW takes, but I have faith.

I'll get off my soapbox and keep hoping for the best. But I will say, this vehicle has grown on me. Everything is well thought out, and technology aside...BMW builds a "brick sh*t house" when it comes down to the actual vehicle. Hell, look at all the BS with the 2020 Ford Explorers...I cannot even imagine how pissed I would be with the crap they just rolled out...and those vehicles are not much cheaper than the X5...
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      11-06-2019, 08:57 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by randybobandy View Post
I can only imagine...they is the one crappy thing, you would think they repair parts would be readily available. I would just keep hounding the point of contact at BMW...I think it'll be sooner than you think for everything to get worked out. The tech is slowly working itself out. Trust me...I was about ready to torch the car a few months back. It is getting there.

This is my second BMW, and it took me some time getting adjusted to it. Coming from an F80 M3, the tech was simple...and it was a solid, purpose built car. I don't know if that has to do with the build quality (I swear the built stuff better outside of the US) or if they just put more effort into the M cars. It was a HUGE change, as I felt like I was driving a boat compared to other SUVs and obviously the M3.

I went for a comfort built vehicle, and to BMW's credit, that is what I got. It's the disparity between X5 to X5 and all the kinks and what not that come up. Some of us are more particular about the vehicle, but a lot of people lease and just say "oh F it, it's done in 3 years". I hope that's not the mentality BMW takes, but I have faith.

I'll get off my soapbox and keep hoping for the best. But I will say, this vehicle has grown on me. Everything is well thought out, and technology aside...BMW builds a "brick sh*t house" when it comes down to the actual vehicle. Hell, look at all the BS with the 2020 Ford Explorers...I cannot even imagine how pissed I would be with the crap they just rolled out...and those vehicles are not much cheaper than the X5...
Agree with all. I thought the X5 was priced very well, and yes I could easily spend as much or more on a Lincoln or a Cadillac. One of my biggest problems in selecting a car is that I live in a small city. No Lexus, Acura, or other luxury dealers. Just Lincoln, GM and MB. My BMW dealer is 90 minutes away.

I think I will be better served if I can get a car serviced locally. On the other hand, A new car shouldn’t need much service. Having a minor collision is not something you plan for. But with other brands, they could be done closer to me, and I HOPE much more quickly. And possibly at a dealer that would let you have a loaner.

Trucks, on the other hand, are sold everywhere here. They don’t come with luxury car badges and can be serviced anywhere. But a really tricked out truck will cost as much as a luxury SUV. I want a comfortable luxury ride, and I think a lot of trucks can meet that Bill these days. I’ve never driven them to find out.

So my shopping list is wide open, but I’m dreading the chore of checking them all out and dealing with the sales reps.

Basically, I am in total analysis paralysis.
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      11-06-2019, 09:16 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by natahoa View Post
Agree with all. I thought the X5 was priced very well, and yes I could easily spend as much or more on a Lincoln or a Cadillac. One of my biggest problems in selecting a car is that I live in a small city. No Lexus, Acura, or other luxury dealers. Just Lincoln, GM and MB. My BMW dealer is 90 minutes away.

I think I will be better served if I can get a car serviced locally. On the other hand, A new car shouldn’t need much service. Having a minor collision is not something you plan for. But with other brands, they could be done closer to me, and I HOPE much more quickly. And possibly at a dealer that would let you have a loaner.

Trucks, on the other hand, are sold everywhere here. They don’t come with luxury car badges and can be serviced anywhere. But a really tricked out truck will cost as much as a luxury SUV. I want a comfortable luxury ride, and I think a lot of trucks can meet that Bill these days. I’ve never driven them to find out.

So my shopping list is wide open, but I’m dreading the chore of checking them all out and dealing with the sales reps.

Basically, I am in total analysis paralysis.
Wow - you are in the boondocks! Lived in White Plains for about 5 years, and at least Passport was only about 30 minutes away. And we didn't have to drive over the Bay. May explain some of your delays, but not all....
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      11-06-2019, 09:18 AM   #96
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Originally Posted by Paladin1 View Post
Traded two 2018 Q7s, one with less than 2,000 miles and one less than 15,000, for 2020 BMWs. Took about a $50k bath combined and worth it, to me. Your mileage may vary. Going in reverse and trading out of BMW for a less expensive car may mean less out-of-pocket for you, but you will take a depreciation hit on a new car.
Holy smokes a $50k bath!
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      11-06-2019, 09:22 AM   #97
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Holy smokes a $50k bath!
Two cars, but yeah. Pricey luxury options don"t hold their value more than about 20 feet off the lot....
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      11-06-2019, 09:25 AM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natahoa View Post
Agree with all. I thought the X5 was priced very well, and yes I could easily spend as much or more on a Lincoln or a Cadillac. One of my biggest problems in selecting a car is that I live in a small city. No Lexus, Acura, or other luxury dealers. Just Lincoln, GM and MB. My BMW dealer is 90 minutes away.

I think I will be better served if I can get a car serviced locally. On the other hand, A new car shouldn’t need much service. Having a minor collision is not something you plan for. But with other brands, they could be done closer to me, and I HOPE much more quickly. And possibly at a dealer that would let you have a loaner.

Trucks, on the other hand, are sold everywhere here. They don’t come with luxury car badges and can be serviced anywhere. But a really tricked out truck will cost as much as a luxury SUV. I want a comfortable luxury ride, and I think a lot of trucks can meet that Bill these days. I’ve never driven them to find out.

So my shopping list is wide open, but I’m dreading the chore of checking them all out and dealing with the sales reps.

Basically, I am in total analysis paralysis.

I had a 2014 Ford F-150 with the off-road package. I miss that truck, and got rid of it since it didn't fit in the garage. If this isn't an issue, I would seriously consider an F-150. They are on price point with a lot of these luxury vehicles, and drive like a charm. I always tell people looking for cars to see what is around. No matter where you go...there's always either a Ford, Chevy, or Dodge (yuck).

I am partial to SUVs now, given the fact I feel like I have more room...I consider SUV to be a wagon vs a truck more like a sedan. I'll tell you what...I never once took the truck off road, or really hauled dirt, mulch, or rocks...so I felt I was being the definition of a tool. Going to BMW, apparently I am still a tool, just a different type. But I can live with that!
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      11-06-2019, 09:33 AM   #99
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Two cars, but yeah. Pricey luxury options don"t hold their value more than about 20 feet off the lot....
I guess if the lag was bad to the point of being unsafe, then safety trumps avoiding negative equity.

To that point when we were cross shopping the Q8 with the X5, we also noticed quite a bit of lag in the Q8 which kind of spoiled that experience for us. Didn't realize it was an issue with the Q7's as well.
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      11-06-2019, 10:05 AM   #100
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https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/sho...diagId=51_A199

You can find the part # of the pieces you need. Google the part # and certain BMW dealers might have it in stock. Might be able to help your dealer out.
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      11-06-2019, 10:10 AM   #101
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Exclamation The latest: they are reshaping my old bumper. !!!

Well, seems like I might get my car back soon.

Now they plan to reshape the old bumper and put it back on the car. I guess they really have no hope of getting a replacement one any time soon.

I’m curious what the cost will be, and if they still plan to replace it eventually. I’ll report back when I find out.
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      11-06-2019, 10:13 AM   #102
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Originally Posted by randybobandy View Post
I had a 2014 Ford F-150 with the off-road package. I miss that truck, and got rid of it since it didn't fit in the garage. If this isn't an issue, I would seriously consider an F-150. They are on price point with a lot of these luxury vehicles, and drive like a charm. I always tell people looking for cars to see what is around. No matter where you go...there's always either a Ford, Chevy, or Dodge (yuck).

I am partial to SUVs now, given the fact I feel like I have more room...I consider SUV to be a wagon vs a truck more like a sedan. I'll tell you what...I never once took the truck off road, or really hauled dirt, mulch, or rocks...so I felt I was being the definition of a tool. Going to BMW, apparently I am still a tool, just a different type. But I can live with that!
I agree. Those things are massively popular and just about the right size for me. I don’t have a garage so not a problem.

I’ll also look seriously at the Lincoln Aviator. It is more of a truck chassis than an SUV but I want to drive one. The Lincoln Nautilus is my go-to SUV at the moment.
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      11-06-2019, 10:16 AM   #103
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Originally Posted by kthankzbye View Post
https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/sho...diagId=51_A199

You can find the part # of the pieces you need. Google the part # and certain BMW dealers might have it in stock. Might be able to help your dealer out.
Tried that, searched the internet myself and I even asked them to look for a bumper off a crashed car. They simply can’t be had for 2019 models. 2018 yes, 2019 not a chance.

Consider how MANY bumpers need to be replaced on ANY car! It is probably the most common thing replaced. It is crazy not to have them in production for collision repairs.
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      11-06-2019, 11:13 AM   #104
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Originally Posted by wtwo3 View Post
I guess if the lag was bad to the point of being unsafe, then safety trumps avoiding negative equity.

To that point when we were cross shopping the Q8 with the X5, we also noticed quite a bit of lag in the Q8 which kind of spoiled that experience for us. Didn't realize it was an issue with the Q7's as well.
Enough that I thought it was unsafe, and spouse almost got T-boned once. Loved the on-road cruising performance, interior was top-notch, and the tech that was dependable was great. But couldn't live with wondering when I might slip up, plus the new Audi lineup has the dual-screen Tesla/Volvo clone setup, and BMW retained REAL buttons, so keeping the cars and trading for another manufacturer in a couple of years was not an attractive option.
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      11-06-2019, 01:31 PM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natahoa View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by kthankzbye View Post
https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/sho...diagId=51_A199

You can find the part # of the pieces you need. Google the part # and certain BMW dealers might have it in stock. Might be able to help your dealer out.
Tried that, searched the internet myself and I even asked them to look for a bumper off a crashed car. They simply can’t be had for 2019 models. 2018 yes, 2019 not a chance.

Consider how MANY bumpers need to be replaced on ANY car! It is probably the most common thing replaced. It is crazy not to have them in production for collision repairs.
You'd be very familiar with this problem if you owned a Tesla. It's so bad with Tesla that insurance companies are jacking up rates and in some cases refusing to quote new Teslas.

Very surprising that BMW can't come up with common parts for a car in production for over a year.
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      11-06-2019, 01:37 PM   #106
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Well, seems like I might get my car back soon.

Now they plan to reshape the old bumper and put it back on the car. I guess they really have no hope of getting a replacement one any time soon.

I’m curious what the cost will be, and if they still plan to replace it eventually. I’ll report back when I find out.
Looking at your bumper damage there's no way that bumper repaired/reshaped will look right. Plastic might be plyable when heated but the level of damage on yours is beyond repairable.

Are you at a BMW shop or private? I'd be surprised if a BMW approved body shop would allow that out the door.

Horrible experience you've had. Sorry.
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      11-06-2019, 02:51 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by natahoa View Post

I think I will be better served if I can get a car serviced locally. On the other hand, A new car shouldn’t need much service. Having a minor collision is not something you plan for. But with other brands, they could be done closer to me, and I HOPE much more quickly. And possibly at a dealer that would let you have a loaner.
natahoa,
Pertaining to what you said...above, how many accidents do you believe you "might" be in per year compared to how many times you will drive your X5 per year? My guess, without knowing your driving style, is 1 to 1000. Meaning that you "might" have a fender bender, your fault or not, one in every 1000 times you drive the X5. Don't let this unfortunate experience drive you away from your X5.
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      11-06-2019, 03:43 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natahoa View Post

I think I will be better served if I can get a car serviced locally. On the other hand, A new car shouldn't need much service. Having a minor collision is not something you plan for. But with other brands, they could be done closer to me, and I HOPE much more quickly. And possibly at a dealer that would let you have a loaner.
natahoa,
Pertaining to what you said...above, how many accidents do you believe you "might" be in per year compared to how many times you will drive your X5 per year? My guess, without knowing your driving style, is 1 to 1000. Meaning that you "might" have a fender bender, your fault or not, one in every 1000 times you drive the X5. Don't let this unfortunate experience drive you away from your X5.
I agree. And in my 22 years driving BMWs, I've never had any issues getting body parts quickly (the only one I recall is a friend's 3 series convertible, probably 10 years ago, that had a delay getting a convertible top mechanism. But even then I think he waited 3 weeks or so.)

Your experience is definitely strange, however I have heard of others with X5's having parts delays. Something is up with the parts chain in this model. BMW may have changed the way they're handling parts, obviously whatever they changed isn't working well..

And don't be so convinced another brand is better. I have family members in other brands and they've had worse issues with GM, Ford and Audi.
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      11-06-2019, 04:35 PM   #109
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Sorry it happened. For such an expensive car. It should have brake in that situation. My Lexus NX300 brakes while reversing in low speed if it senses an object in the way. Ridiculous this doesn't.
Yup. This experience really has solidified my decision not to get another BMW. Next car will be a Lexus or Lincoln, since both of those can be serviced near where I live.

I know I’d take a terrible Financial hit, but I’m seriously considering trading in this car for one of those in the coming months. This is so so so unacceptable.
I agree. This is my 13th BMW but probably my last one. My wife's 2009 RX350 has never had a single problem in 10 years. Only oil/filter changes and a set of front brake pads. I'm leasing and glad I am. Will also look at Lexus or Lincoln when my lease is over.
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2019 X5 40i MSport Alpine White/Coffee (my 13th BMW)
2015 Mercedes SL400; 2009 Lexus RX350
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      11-06-2019, 04:55 PM   #110
natahoa
Retired soccer mom
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Drives: x5 40i 2019
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Rural Eastern MD (Eastern Shore/Delmarva)

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Quote:
Originally Posted by claykin View Post
Looking at your bumper damage there's no way that bumper repaired/reshaped will look right. Plastic might be plyable when heated but the level of damage on yours is beyond repairable.

Are you at a BMW shop or private? I'd be surprised if a BMW approved body shop would allow that out the door.

Horrible experience you've had. Sorry.
It is at the BMW collision center. I know the bumper won’t look like new, but I’ll have a car to drive until the replacement bumper shows up. I was surprised also, but after five weeks they are feeling my pain. Im Grateful that they were willing to do that.

I hope to see the car by Friday and will post pics.
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