[fundamentals]

gotta ya.

[mobilejo]

Originally Posted by fundamentals

First off I'm not bashing anything so let's get that straight. I had some questions and I was asked where I got the info from period the end. Don't accuse me of bashing the motor.

That escalated quickly

He wasn't pointing the finger at you

[fundamentals]

Getting the M50i Monday.

[BMWZ4]

Originally Posted by fundamentals

Getting the M50i Monday.

Enjoy your new wheels. Congrats.

[zhangyi17]

Originally Posted by fundamentals

Getting the M50i Monday.

Congrats

[Edubya]

N63 previous gen in 50i, and what is new in the M50i:

Enhancements to the engine relative to the 50i's unit include a block made of a new aluminum alloy, a viscous damper on the crankshaft, stronger pistons and piston rings, and an iron coating on the cylinder walls.

BTW, I'm wondering if OP ever had any issues.

[FCX5]

Originally Posted by fundamentals

I'm about to purchase a2020 X5M50i and I have heard that there have been MAJOR issues with this engine after searching the web.

It's not only one acticle but several that talk about the major issues that have not been addressed by BMW.

I would be very interested to hear some feedback before I spend 90K

I understand that people may not want to discuss issues like this because this after all a pro BMW forum but I rather be safe than sorry.

Thanks for your input.

If you lease like 80% of BMW buyers, it's a non issue. I have a 7 year, unlimited warranty on mine, so if it breaks down after that, I'll see. In general, BMW has improved their reliability if you go by CR's most recent report.

BTW, if you are here, you know you want the 50i. LOL.

[Edubya]

found this an interesting article as well. Does point out original N63 issues, but goes on to provide a much clearer picture.

https://bmwtuning.co/bmw-n63-vs-n63t...tu2-vs-n63tu3/

[texasrr]

I left BMW after my last experience with that motor. Within a span of 98 days the service shop in Houston had it for 56. Most of the time without a loaner or rental. I had no issues from 30K miles till 70K and then it all fell apart.

Below are all the issues I had with the engine and the Houston Midtown Service Shop

They pulled the entire engine out to replace the lower timing cover gaskets, rear main seal and replaced the transmission fluid. Replaced crankcase ventilation lines since they cracked from heat and replaced bank 2 fresh air pipe. Found out 5 weeks later they put the engine back in incorrectly and crushed one of the engine mounts. They replaced that. When I picked my car back up the damaged the tailpipes and scuffed/scratched the kidney grills. When they repainted the tailpipes they got black overspray on my white car and didn't remove the kidney grills when they repainted them. I had black overspray on my hood and windshield. Also had the thruster arms replaced and had one engine coil replaced.

7 days later another coil went out. Was able to have the warranty company replace all coils. They wanted $550 to change spark plugs. I was able do to it myself with OEM plugs for $50. One plug they used when replacing the first coil was a non OEM plug the BMW service shop installed. They also broke my o2 sensor, so they replaced that. When I picked the car up my car was very loud and when I popped the hood they forgot to put the engine cover back on.

11 days after that I had a drivetrain malfunction pop up. The bank 1 high pressure fuel pump failed and fouled all 4 injectors and spark plugs. I brought the car in with 3/4 of a tank and they gave it back to me with 15 miles left.

3 days after that my wheel stopped telescoping and a noise was coming from the front wheel when turning at slow speeds. They replaced the front strut mounts and shocks. The wheel wasn't telescoping due to the rain sensor and BDC module for the rear window heater. They placed both. They also replaced the engine mounts since they reinstalled the engine incorrectly and crushed the two bottom mounts. They also replaced the two front wishbones. During this time I had the AC fixed and they installed a defective blower motor and reinstalled all the trim incorrectly causing all sorts of noise.

Thank god for a warranty, because all of this was $27,305 in repairs and I didn't have a car for 56 out of 98 days. I'm happy some of y'all didn't have these issues, but I'm not dealing with this motor ever again.

[scungilio]

^^^^^^That's good, glad to hear that there is one less person out there bidding up the price of the current TTV8 X5s which have been bringing a premium over MSRP.
These V8s sell as fast as they can be built.
I've had one for 2 years now and will be buying another next year.

[mmm50i]

Originally Posted by fundamentals

Getting the M50i Monday.

Congrats! You won't be disappointed

[-Vanguard-]

20K+ miles on my X6MC with the S63 and its been rock solid.

Never had oil burned or any faults/issues.

Only issue I have is my power adjust steering column start to click when moving up and down but thats about it. Its being replaced under warranty.

But engine/tranny is amazing.

[Dgjo2022X5MC]

What all the others have said + let it rip.

Enjoy one of the last V8 powered machines.

Follow maintenance schedule and you'll be fine.

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by Edubya

N63 previous gen in 50i, and what is new in the M50i:

Enhancements to the engine relative to the 50i's unit include a block made of a new aluminum alloy, a viscous damper on the crankshaft, stronger pistons and piston rings, and an iron coating on the cylinder walls.

BTW, I'm wondering if OP ever had any issues.

I don't think any of these are intended to solve the known issue of the original N63. Based on my understand of these components function, crank balancer is there to increase read line, forged piston is adaption from B58, it is there for higher boost. New cylinder wall coating is for higher redline and better efficiency (lower friction). These are all performance related update.

the typical issue for N63 is valve stamp seal. This is the cause of oil consumption. Now for people with 2-3 year old N63/S63, you won't see it. It takes time to cook the seal if the issue still exist. I don't think we know if the issue has been resolved just yet. The other big issue is rod bearing. This one also take time, typically 80-100K miles. More frequent oil change here helps from experience. It is still earlier to say if newer version of N63 has fixed this. My guess is it is not, because this is a known issue for E46 M3, E90 M3, E60 M5. If BMW intends to fix it, it should have been fixed long time ago. However, I would call this an expansive maintenance item, just do it before issue arise. The catch is there is no warming sign on rod bearing going out. If any one intend to keep this car for 7-10 years, 100K miles, be sure to talk to other N63 owners and get rod bearing done at a safe milage. The cost as of today is like ~$5000ish job. It can be done with engine in the car. It is a bummer thst we cannot have performance and reasonable maintenance at the same time tho.

[nordring]

Originally Posted by eelnoraa

The typical issue for N63 is valve stamp seal. This is the cost of oil consumption. Now for people with 2-3 year old N63/S63, you won't see it. It takes time to cook the seal if the issue still exist.

You would think with the lawsuit and the high cost of replacement, BMW would spend another $20 per car to source the best possible material (and design) for the valve stem seals...BUT then again with the hot-vee design, maybe its not easy to find materials material that will hold up to the high heat of the twin turbos? We shall see when the N63B44T3's starts hitting the 90-100K mark.

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by nordring

You would think with the lawsuit and the high cost of replacement, BMW would spend another $20 per car to source the best possible material (and design) for the valve stem seals...BUT then again with the hot-vee design, maybe its not easy to find materials material that will hold up to the high heat of the twin turbos? We shall see when the N63B44T3's starts hitting the 90-100K mark.

The issue is it is not catastrophic. Owners will start with very mild consumption, which even is noticeable, will appears to be acceptable. Modern BMWs don't even have dip stick, so owner probably won't notice oil level reduced until the warning comes (about 1ish quad low?). If that happens after the oil change interval, few will notice.. By the time the issue become significant enough, the car is out of lease or out of warranty. And I wonder out of all G05 sold in the states, about 60K units in 2021, what portion is M50i to begin with. Here is when I will ask TurtleBoy , he has the best chance of having correct information.

As of the material, yeah, I agree with you, it is not the material, but the hot Vee. Exhaust header is the hottest part of the engine. Other config with exhaust facing down ward to open space, there is still natual convection cooling. With Hot Vee, heat is trapped in. Operation condition is a lot harsher. Having that said, I think it is a known trade off by BMW. It is probably the only config they can come up with to reach the performance level. To make this issue worse, in order to replace the seal, the cams must come out, that meaning timing cover, chains, vanos, .. all the top end components need to come out, making this a very expansive job to replace a few very inexpensive parts.

Personally, I tend to keep cars for a long time. I am not brave enough to take on the N63 challenge myself.

[Scottdip]

I wonder if cars that operate in a cold climate for 6-7 months a year would last longer? I know here in Michigan my fan is RARELY running after I shut my car off from like October-April.

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by Scottdip

I wonder if cars that operate in a cold climate for 6-7 months a year would last longer? I know here in Michigan my fan is RARELY running after I shut my car off from like October-April.

From pure logical point of view, I don't see why, because engine operates more or less at the constant temperature. But if I have think dig into my memory, I seem to recall I see more seals and gaskets issue from cars from hot states. Purely wild guestimate tho.

Having that said, for older used cars, I will take one from hot states over cold states because of rust. This alone makes repairing and maintenance very difficult or impossible.

[nordring]

Originally Posted by Scottdip

I wonder if cars that operate in a cold climate for 6-7 months a year would last longer? I know here in Michigan my fan is RARELY running after I shut my car off from like October-April.

Mike Miller (BMW CCA's Technical Editor) offers a suggestion that all BMW V8 owners, who plan on keeping their cars a very long time: OPEN your hood upon arrival at your destination and then again when you return home.

Of course he understand that only a minuscule fraction of of owners would ever do this....but then again there is a very small faction of uber-enthusiast collectors that will do whatever it takes to keep their cars in top shop for a long as possible.

FWIW - I wouldn't expect here to pop their hood after every run. This is collector not a daily drive suggestion.

On a related note....if you anyone is looking at used vehicle with an N62 or N63 motor, there is a quick (but not foolproof) way to check on the health of the value stem seals. If you let the vehicle idle for 5 or 10 minutes, and then rev the engine in park, you will see a puff of bluish smoke if the valve stem seals are letting oil seep into the cylinders. If the exhaust is clear, valve stem seals are probably still in good shape.

I experienced this myself on an N62 motor that wasn't burring any oil yet...but I knew the valve stem seals were beginning to harden and wouldn't be long until I started burning oil and/or starting to prematurely load up the cat's.

[scungilio]

Why not dump out of a BMW V8 in 3 or 4 years if you are that spooked about it. Don't buy one in the first place if you are going to believe all the crap from some on internet forums who are obviously greenie, global warming, weasels who hate anything that is remotely close to a V8.

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by nordring

Mike Miller (BMW CCA's Technical Editor) offers a suggestion that all BMW V8 owners, who plan on keeping their cars a very long time: OPEN your hood upon arrival at your destination and then again when you return home.

Of course he understand that only a minuscule fraction of of owners would ever do this....but then again there is a very small faction of uber-enthusiast collectors that will do whatever it takes to keep their cars in top shop for a long as possible.

FWIW - I wouldn't expect here to pop their hood after every run. This is collector not a daily drive suggestion.

On a related note....if you anyone is looking at used vehicle with an N62 or N63 motor, there is a quick (but not foolproof) way to check on the health of the value stem seals. If you let the vehicle idle for 5 or 10 minutes, and then rev the engine in park, you will see a puff of bluish smoke if the valve stem seals are letting oil seep into the cylinders. If the exhaust is clear, valve stem seals are probably still in good shape.

I experienced this myself on an N62 motor that wasn't burring any oil yet...but I knew the valve stem seals were beginning to harden and wouldn't be long until I started burning oil and/or starting to prematurely load up the cat's.

I think if you see blue smoke in this case, considiton is not mild anymore. I am not aware N62 has this issue tho, I have a S62 myself from 2003, about 110k miles so far, very low mileage for the age. But I do use it on track from time to time, so it gets pushed hard. So far, no valve stem seal issue, no oil consumption, knock on wood. Without the turbo hot Vee, soft compoments do have easier lives.

Edit:

The hood open at destination make sense. People in track day do this between session to let car cool down too. We will find a shaded space, open hood, chuck the wheels instead of using parking break (let pads off rotor to avoid hot spots in rotor). More hardcore people will have a construction fan blowing toward hood too. So I guess it make sense that in colder climate is better for engines, components gets cool down quicker

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by scungilio

Why not dump out of a BMW V8 in 3 or 4 years if you are that spooked about it. Don't buy one in the first place if you are going to believe all the crap from some on internet forums who are obviously greenie, global warming, weasels who hate anything that is remotely close to a V8.

There are a few reasons. First it is the cost, the way I use performance cars, new car every 3-4 years because I need the reliability, get very expansive. I much prefer a maintain-able car. Second reason is newer cars are faster, but nowhere as enjoyable or satisfiable as older/rawer cars. I don't know if I am driving or the car is driving anymore. Anyone can go fast, anyone can pull one or two laps of time with very little skill involved. In other word, they are too easy. Third, I probably said it more than once before, straight line speed doesn't attract me at all. I prefer a mechanical balanced cars.
For cars with 500hp, I don't think more than a few can master the power. I certainly cannot. If I am using 250hp of the 500 available, why not just stick to a 250hp car? Having that said, we are also talking about a family SUV. The 389 from 45e is way more than I need for the intended usage too.