[theblackfalcon]

My wife ran into my son's school today to drop off his lunch. The portico where you park is basically flat from what I can tell. She pulled car in driving forward... says she hit park then off. Got out of the car walked behind it. Walked in the glass doors next to the car, handed secretary the lunchbox and turned around and the car was gone. It was about 300' away. It had rolled backwards and scrapped 2x other cars. She said when she got in the car the P was illuminated?

Question I have is... what scenarios is this possible. Assuming her memory is wrong... if she got out of the car and left it in D... when you open the door does the car shift to P by itself or N? She said if you leave the car in N it will chime/alarm that you have done such.

Any thoughts on what might have happend? Or is there a potential glitch in the matrix and I should ask BMW to pull the data to see if car is not parking correctly.

[jiggie]

First I've heard of such a thing. She put the car in Park, it was Locked and doors closed and it just rolled away? Does the school have footage by chance that you can take to the dealership? The 45e turns itself off and puts itself in park when you open the door as is, so something is def. weird.

[theblackfalcon]

Car was not locked, key was in her purse still. She was stepping away for 30 seconds and getting right back in. I called service adviser at BMW and he said she must have put it in N. She says the car notifies her if in N and you open the door. My memory is that the spot is almost flat. Almost like the car isn't holding park. I'm going to experiment with it tonight. The video from school is weird, because the car rolled away at a very slow crawl.

[COKen]

No idea what would cause that and I'm not trying to be critical, but that is why I always use my parking brake.

[taek]

Actually one of the more common complaints on this forum about the 45e is that you cannot keep it running while stepping out quickly, the engine always shuts itself off when you open the door.

[JMD]

Here's a short story. I bought a brand new 2012 535i Sport and after having owning it for a few weeks, I was in a rush to get to my Credit Union before it closed,...I parked the car,...and immediately jumped out and forgot to 1) put it in Park,...or 2) active the E-Park,...and or 3) engage Auto-Hold, etc. Anyway, I jumped out of the car,...and just as I took a step or two,...the car started rolling backwards. I was lucky to be able to open the door quickly and jump in and smash the BRAKES. As a result of this, an immediate lesson was learned and that is to ALWAYS ensure I see "P" in the gauge cluster before exiting the vehicle,...or just KILL the engine and the car will automatically engage "P" (Park).

I suspect your wife wanted to see "P" mentally, yet the vehicle wasn't in Park. Now is it possible that this is an issue that can happen? The answer is yes! However, it should be happening to hundreds to thousands of cars across many manufacturers as many use ZF transmissions, etc.

[Mattl0806]

In the school video, when she comes to a stop and puts the car in park and gets out, can you see any tiny body movement? We all brake to a stop and put the car in park afterwords and in my experience there is usually an additional fractional move the car makes btw the parking brake and the pedal brake. Maybe you can see this on video?

[Guy Fleegman]

Originally Posted by JMD

Here's a short story. I bought a brand new 2012 535i Sport and after having owning it for a few weeks, I was in a rush to get to my Credit Union before it closed,...I parked the car,...and immediately jumped out and forgot to 1) put it in Park,...or 2) active the E-Park,...and or 3) engage Auto-Hold, etc. Anyway, I jumped out of the car,...and just as I took a step or two,...the car started rolling backwards. I was lucky to be able to open the door quickly and jump in and smash the BRAKES. As a result of this, an immediate lesson was learned and that is to ALWAYS ensure I see "P" in the gauge cluster before exiting the vehicle,...or just KILL the engine and the car will automatically engage "P" (Park).

I suspect your wife wanted to see "P" mentally, yet the vehicle wasn't in Park. Now is it possible that this is an issue that can happen? The answer is yes! However, it should be happening to hundreds to thousands of cars across many manufacturers as many use ZF transmissions, etc.

I had a similar experience when my 45e was new and I was still scratching my head over how it all worked. This was in my driveway, which is a slight incline. I had left the car in N and it began rolling backwards. Fortunately the door was still open and it was slow enough that I could jump in the car before it rolled into the street.

What I learned: Don't rely on the car to tell you it's in N. This car is always so quiet I never know whether it's running or not. In a situation like your wife's it would have been easy to get distracted.

[altern8]

Originally Posted by Guy Fleegman

I had a similar experience when my 45e was new and I was still scratching my head over how it all worked. This was in my driveway, which is a slight incline. I had left the car in N and it began rolling backwards. Fortunately the door was still open and it was slow enough that I could jump in the car before it rolled into the street.

What I learned: Don't rely on the car to tell you it's in N. This car is always so quiet I never know whether it's running or not. In a situation like your wife's it would have been easy to get distracted.

omg something similar happened to me with my 45e about a week old. coming from a audi, the park button is right around where my old shifter used to be. it didnt help that my instrument display had the P display in the tiniest possible font. ever since that scare, im always double checking if im in park and have updated the display to show the P symbol more prominently.

[kwickag]

I Just don't understand why so many people are so averse to using the parking brake, it isn't just BMW owners, I see it everywhere. Even when I pick up my cars from service the parking brake isn't engaged.

[neocryte]

Originally Posted by taek

Actually one of the more common complaints on this forum about the 45e is that you cannot keep it running while stepping out quickly, the engine always shuts itself off when you open the door.

Exactly this. I didn't know you could open the door without it automatically going into Park. Maybe if you put it in Neutral first, it doesn't switch to Park automatically when you open the door??

[theblackfalcon]

Originally Posted by Mattl0806

In the school video, when she comes to a stop and puts the car in park and gets out, can you see any tiny body movement? We all brake to a stop and put the car in park afterwords and in my experience there is usually an additional fractional move the car makes btw the parking brake and the pedal brake. Maybe you can see this on video?

Let the comments commence.

[theblackfalcon]

Originally Posted by neocryte

Exactly this. I didn't know you could open the door without it automatically going into Park. Maybe if you put it in Neutral first, it doesn't switch to Park automatically when you open the door??

She said normal behavior is push the P button. Hit stop and get out of the car. She thinks she would have noticed the Neutral chime. I actually think there is a somewhat a design failure when P is just that small bush button on the back of the stick. I wish it was a firmer shift into P position. Before this happened, I have always felt uncomfortable with the P and shutoff in this car because so many items continue to run and it being electric there is almost little noticeable difference between running and stopped.

[theblackfalcon]

[neocryte]

Ugh, that's frustrating - glad nobody got hurt, and damage hopefully minimal! Def try to re-create it... see if you can put it in Neutral, open the door... and see if it remains in Neutral vs going to Park.

[rmorin1249]

Originally Posted by theblackfalcon

Oops!

[PandaSPUR]

Around 8s in the first video, it looks like "P" did engage.. you see your wife stop the car, then it rolls back a tiny bit and stops as expected.

Strange :\

Hm there is a brief time period where shes still in the car after 8s. Maybe she got distracted by something, took care of it, and then hit P again as she finally got out of the car. Forgetting that she already hit it once, thus disengaging it?

[JMKBMWX5e]

I totally agree about the tiny park button. I think it should be bigger/easier.

[nZtiZia]

pressing the P button doesn't engage/disengage Park when done subsequently. once in P, always in P unless the gear level is moved. (truth be told, coming from Audi, the BMW steptronic shifting 'directions' weren't that intuitive for me at first.)

maybe muscle memory got the best of her? as she came to a stop, instead of pressing the P button to park, she shifted the gear level UP from D which is how we used to shift into Park with the old school automatic gear selector (see photo), but doing so on the Steptronic shifter puts it into Neutral. still, the vehicle would chime that it’s in Neutral upon opening the door

[kwickag]

Everything in the manual says if you put it in P the car won't roll, but if you don't it will if the parking brake isn't engaged. Since the P light was on when she got to the car, it may very well be a software error that didn't engage Park and since the Parking brake wasn't set it rolled. You may never be able to recreate it.

[Chonkapotamus]

Does your wife have the brake hold enabled? The answer to that question will probably go a long way towards determining whether it was a fault or very understandable user error. I just spent some time in my garage trying to replicate this, and with the brake hold on it is IMPOSSIBLE to get the car to roll, even if you shift into neutral. The car is parked, and stays parked, until you hit the gas again.

But if the brake hold is off, this is shockingly easy to replicate. Bring the car to a stop with your foot on the brake. Push the gear shift lever with a single finger, just above the park button, with the same light pressure you'd use on the park button. The car goes into neutral. You don't need to squeeze the side button like you do for reverse or drive. At this point, the car will roll if on an incline and you take your foot off the brake.

Yes, it chimes if you open the door to tell you you're in neutral, but it's just a chime. If the music is on and she's grabbing for the lunch she's bringing in, and the car is standing still, it'd be way too easy to miss that the car is telling you it's in neutral.

EDIT: Also, she says it was in park when she got back in -- from the video that's after it had a rear-end collision. Does anyone know if these cars put themselves into park after an impact? I assume so, but that might be a question to ask BMW as well. If yes, then the fact it was in park when she returned to the car is neither here nor there on whether it was in neutral when it rolled.

If it were me, I'd still have the dealer check the car for fault codes -- it's possible something failed. But if there aren't codes I would chalk this up to user error and TERRIBLE human factors engineering. A car that turns itself off when you open the door should also apply the parking brake when you shift into neutral, and affirmatively make you turn the parking brake off if you want it to roll, e.g. in a failure situation. I'd consider filing a report with NHTSA as a design defect issue, as it may be the car was operating as designed but still hazardous.

[RickObe]

Originally Posted by altern8

have updated the display to show the P symbol more prominently.

How did you update the display to show the P more prominently??