[Xeno]

Originally Posted by UKMS

I fully understand the dealer stance could be frustrating but it does raise a question as to why ? Do you have constructive dialogue with them or is it fractious ?

I still say that lack of OTA is not a 'disaster' IMHO and questionable whether a law suit for such an issue would get anywhere. A class action law suit for brake failures, fires, engine failures etc I get, but lack of software update I'm not so sure. Of course only my humble opinion.

Over the years I've had my fair share of frustrations with cars, some have taken a long time to resolve but I've always found that building positive relationships and dialogue generally works. Perhaps it hasn't in your situation.

Thanks, so your response is to create an imaginary scenarios that absolves my dealer??? That is quite an assumption about my identity which would apparently shock you

I bought 5 X5s from my dealer and have had a good relationship up until a few months ago when they stopped taking cares of my cars. I still have a 2008 X5 and now I take it elsewhere due to their failures over the last few months.

In the meantime, you must reckon with the reality that some issues that impact our vehicles are not being resolved by our dealers. I have an early edition special order and have concluded they want to abandon the first generation G05s so I should have keep my F15 that had very few issues.

[UKMS]

Originally Posted by Xeno

Thanks, so your response is to create an imaginary scenarios that absolves my dealer??? That is quite an assumption about my identity which would apparently shock you

I bought 5 X5s from my dealer and have had a good relationship up until a few months ago when they stopped taking cares of my cars. I still have a 2008 X5 and now I take it elsewhere due to their failures over the last few months.

In the meantime, you must reckon with the reality that some issues that impact our vehicles are not being resolved by our dealers. I have an early edition special order and have concluded they want to abandon the first generation G05s so I should have keep my F15 that had very few issues.

Apologies but I don't really fully understand your response but can assure you I'm not creating anything imaginary.

Sounds like you've moved to a new dealer because the old one didn't meet your expectations and now the new dealer is also failing to meet them ? .... have I understood this correctly ?

[Xeno]

Originally Posted by UKMS

Apologies but I don't really fully understand your response but can assure you I'm not creating anything imaginary.

Sounds like you've moved to a new dealer because the old one didn't meet your expectations and now the new dealer is also failing to meet them ? .... have I understood this correctly ?

Same dealer, but their response to issues related to the G05 is unlike anything I saw with the previous X5s. They would prefer to deflect software issues to a 'genius' who knows less than folk on this board. The current service manager has no interest in addressing such concerns telling me the 'big' issue one client had was BT connection for their smartphone.

[UKMS]

Originally Posted by Xeno

Same dealer, but their response to issues related to the G05 is unlike anything I saw with the previous X5s. They would prefer to deflect software issues to a 'genius' who knows less than folk on this board. The current service manager has no interest in addressing such concerns telling me the 'big' issue one client had was BT connection for their smartphone.

Sounds like the old one is pretty bad ....... hopefully the new dealer will get you all sorted with the upgrade.

[mitch57]

Originally Posted by UKMS

Apologies but I don't really fully understand your response but can assure you I'm not creating anything imaginary.

Sounds like you've moved to a new dealer because the old one didn't meet your expectations and now the new dealer is also failing to meet them ? .... have I understood this correctly ?

I think you may be pacifying posters frustrations with paying a substantial amount of money for a vehicle and not getting what's been promised and advertised.

Additionally, the fact remains that numerous owners across the globe have complained to BMW about advertising and claiming a feature is in fact working and functional when in fact it has, to date, never been a functional feature of any BMW ever with iDrive 7. This is still happening over 1.5 to 2 years since they first claimed that this is a feature of the vehicle.

Basically, this is a case of "False Advertising" at a minimum. Seems to me that you feel as if stated claims and functions of a vehicle that don't work as claimed is not a problem as long as the vehicle is functional and the lack of the stated feature doesn't harm the vehicle.

Your reference to the owner's manual listing options and features your car doesn't have has nothing to do with BMW's claim that my specific vehicle identified by VIN number "IS" equipped with OTA functionality even though it doesn't work. I suppose you could make the claim that having the capability, whether or not it works, absolves the manufacturer of any responsibility for it not working.

Here's another example for you. iDrive 7 has a slew of built in options and functionalities that are not enabled. Just take a look at all the traffic on people coding their vehicles to enable these hidden features and options. Can you imagine if BMW advertised and claimed that your vehicle had all of these hidden options and functionalities yet none of them worked because they weren't enabled/turned on? Would you be "OK" with that considering that you paid for all of those options yet none of them worked?

The OTA option is a "Paid" Subscription that will have to be renewed in 3 years. So now we have to pay for renewal of a feature we already paid for that has never worked from day one for any owner across the globe?

Seems to me that you must be a totally "Laid Back" individual who only sees the good and none of the bad when it comes to automobile manufacturers making false claims about their vehicle's options and features.

[UKMS]

Originally Posted by mitch57

I think you may be pacifying posters frustrations with paying a substantial amount of money for a vehicle and not getting what's been promised and advertised.

Additionally, the fact remains that numerous owners across the globe have complained to BMW about advertising and claiming a feature is in fact working and functional when in fact it has, to date, never been a functional feature of any BMW ever with iDrive 7. This is still happening over 1.5 to 2 years since they first claimed that this is a feature of the vehicle.

Basically, this is a case of "False Advertising" at a minimum. Seems to me that you feel as if stated claims and functions of a vehicle that don't work as claimed is not a problem as long as the vehicle is functional and the lack of the stated feature doesn't harm the vehicle.

Your reference to the owner's manual listing options and features your car doesn't have has nothing to do with BMW's claim that my specific vehicle identified by VIN number "IS" equipped with OTA functionality even though it doesn't work. I suppose you could make the claim that having the capability, whether or not it works, absolves the manufacturer of any responsibility for it not working.

Here's another example for you. iDrive 7 has a slew of built in options and functionalities that are not enabled. Just take a look at all the traffic on people coding their vehicles to enable these hidden features and options. Can you imagine if BMW advertised and claimed that your vehicle had all of these hidden options and functionalities yet none of them worked because they weren't enabled/turned on? Would you be "OK" with that considering that you paid for all of those options yet none of them worked?

The OTA option is a "Paid" Subscription that will have to be renewed in 3 years. So now we have to pay for renewal of a feature we already paid for that has never worked from day one for any owner across the globe?

Seems to me that you must be a totally "Laid Back" individual who only sees the good and none of the bad when it comes to automobile manufacturers making false claims about their vehicle's options and features.

I am laid back and it usually gets me a long way when dealing with difficult and frustrating situations. It's something that has served me well. It allows me to choose the right situations where I need to take a more robust approach and ramp things up.

As I've said it's a frustrating situation, it's one of those issues that some care deeply about such as yourself, some can't be bothered and others simply don't notice it's even a problem.

It doesn't make it right, dealers don't help by their approach sometimes, BMW don't help with inconsistent communication but also customers sometimes don't help with their approach and when I read you use language such as catastrophic, class action law suit, false advertising etc over a software update, being straight if you communicate like that with BMW or a dealer they will simply shut you out and not want to deal with you or at best communicate with boiler plate customer service responses. It doesn't mean you don't have a point or an issue it's just what happens.

[mitch57]

Originally Posted by UKMS

I am laid back and it usually gets me a long way when dealing with difficult and frustrating situations. It's something that has served me well. It allows me to choose the right situations where I need to take a more robust approach and ramp things up.

As I've said it's a frustrating situation, it's one of those issues that some care deeply about such as yourself, some can't be bothered and others simply don't notice it's even a problem.

It doesn't make it right, dealers don't help by their approach sometimes, BMW don't help with inconsistent communication but also customers sometimes don't help with their approach and when I read you use language such as catastrophic, class action law suit, false advertising etc over a software update, being straight if you communicate like that with BMW or a dealer they will simply shut you out and not want to deal with you or at best communicate with boiler plate customer service responses. It doesn't mean you don't have a point or an issue it's just what happens.

You seem to assume a lot based on just words used in forums. I too have the same approach as you do based on the situation at hand. If you knew me and my background personally, I think you might have a different opinion instead of what you are perceiving in these forums. Just because I vent here and use, perhaps, exaggerated verbiage doesn't mean that's the way I project myself when dealing with people in general.

Writing versus speaking, whether via verbal conversation or in person, are very, very, different things. People assume FAR to much when reading text. People perceive very different meanings when reading text then they do when talking over the phone or talking in person. When talking over the phone or in person we can actually hear and see the human reactions based on vocal tone, facial expressions, physical posture and movements. You can't really do that with text. Yes, there's the emojis but that doesn't really project what we see or hear in person.

Text is static. It doesn't grow in size, huff and puff, scream, jump up and down, etc., while you're reading it. Unfortunately, text leaves way to much to interpretation by the individual reading it or writing it regardless whether or not that was the intent of the writer.

So, I think we actually have a similar approach to situations in the beginning and adapt to that situation based on the responses and attitude of those we are dealing with. I just happen to use the forums to do some of my venting instead of taking it out on some employee that works for a company.

At any rate, I sincerely hope that you don't experience any of the frustrations and empty promises that many of us BMW owners are dealing with.

All that being said, I absolutely LOVE my BMW. It is, so far, the best vehicle I've ever owned despite the problems I've had.

Keep reading the forums and I think you will see what others feel as well. Additionally, it's a known fact that forums are where those that are frustrated and unhappy go to vent and complain. Many, hoping to find others with the same frustrations and complaints. Misery loves company after all...

[Skeewiff03]

Originally Posted by UKMS

Out of interest, other than advertising and promotional material which is always heavy with disclaimers. Where have you got it documented that you WILL get OTA updates leading you to take issue with this.

BMW email makes reference to next update, not a remote update.
I am pretty sure they can get away with it by asking you to go dealer, again, to get the update.

[mrjoed2]

Anybody know if you can code fog lights on with parking lights with Bimmercode?

[MGDisco]

Originally Posted by mitch57

I think you may be pacifying posters frustrations with paying a substantial amount of money for a vehicle and not getting what's been promised and advertised.

Additionally, the fact remains that numerous owners across the globe have complained to BMW about advertising and claiming a feature is in fact working and functional when in fact it has, to date, never been a functional feature of any BMW ever with iDrive 7. This is still happening over 1.5 to 2 years since they first claimed that this is a feature of the vehicle.

Basically, this is a case of "False Advertising" at a minimum. Seems to me that you feel as if stated claims and functions of a vehicle that don't work as claimed is not a problem as long as the vehicle is functional and the lack of the stated feature doesn't harm the vehicle.

Your reference to the owner's manual listing options and features your car doesn't have has nothing to do with BMW's claim that my specific vehicle identified by VIN number "IS" equipped with OTA functionality even though it doesn't work. I suppose you could make the claim that having the capability, whether or not it works, absolves the manufacturer of any responsibility for it not working.

Here's another example for you. iDrive 7 has a slew of built in options and functionalities that are not enabled. Just take a look at all the traffic on people coding their vehicles to enable these hidden features and options. Can you imagine if BMW advertised and claimed that your vehicle had all of these hidden options and functionalities yet none of them worked because they weren't enabled/turned on? Would you be "OK" with that considering that you paid for all of those options yet none of them worked?

The OTA option is a "Paid" Subscription that will have to be renewed in 3 years. So now we have to pay for renewal of a feature we already paid for that has never worked from day one for any owner across the globe?

Seems to me that you must be a totally "Laid Back" individual who only sees the good and none of the bad when it comes to automobile manufacturers making false claims about their vehicle's options and features.

The statement that the RSU has never been, to date, a functional feature of any BMW with iDrive 7 isn't correct - a number of us on the forum have had RSU performed in January, myslef being one of them here in the UK, that updated the vehicle form 03/2019.xx to 07/2019/75.

https://g05.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1684555

Noting that that update was one step behind what was being updated by others on the forum at that time by the dealers (11/2019.xx) does mean that it is a couple of versions behind what can be updated in the dealers.

Also noted that the RSU doesn't seem to be available in the US, for whatever reason known to BMW, is still an issue for you that does seem to be unjust with other countries having already had the roll out.

Just waiting to see if there is a notification soon to update to the 11/2019.xx stable version now that 03/2020.xx is established. Or maybe, the RSU that was received in January was a once off, or maybe a once a year update, who knows?

Couple of pics from the app to show the completed update and the summary of what was included (note the UK date format is 10th January):

[mitch57]

Originally Posted by MGDisco

The statement that the RSU has never been, to date, a functional feature of any BMW with iDrive 7 isn't correct - a number of us on the forum have had RSU performed in January, myslef being one of them here in the UK, that updated the vehicle form 03/2019.xx to 07/2019/75.

https://g05.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1684555

Noting that that update was one step behind what was being updated by others on the forum at that time by the dealers (11/2019.xx) does mean that it is a couple of versions behind what can be updated in the dealers.

Also noted that the RSU doesn't seem to be available in the US, for whatever reason known to BMW, is still an issue for you that does seem to be unjust with other countries having already had the roll out.

Just waiting to see if there is a notification soon to update to the 11/2019.xx stable version now that 03/2020.xx is established. Or maybe, the RSU that was received in January was a once off, or maybe a once a year update, who knows?

Couple of pics from the app to show the completed update and the summary of what was included (note the UK date format is 10th January):

Attachment 2307577Attachment 2307578

Correct. I should have been more clear and stated that in the "US" this has never worked. I was aware of updates starting to roll out in Europe. However, in the US it never has and still doesn't work.

[randybobandy]

mitch57 I agree with your points. I think you got to be a pain in the ass with BMW, otherwise they will keep making up excuses. It is advertised and promoted that I don't need to take my fat ass to the dealership. They make reference to quality control of the software before they release it as an OTA. That alone tells me you will never see it. I've seen talk on here of a new app, which would be nice...Also, BMW seems to half ass a bunch of things instead of perfecting what they have already. There's too much difference between MY and region. The capabilities are there, but BMW doesn't seem to want to get going. It's not a disastrous issue, but a slap in the face. We paid for all these things that were included for 3 or 4 years depending on your lease or purchase. I was sold on this vehicle with it's technology and comfort. I am still impressed, but losing respect for BMW's software team. At the end of the day, i can get from point a to point b, but so can a shit ton of other vehicles...the "premium" we paid for BMW should included quality and follow through.

On a side note, now BMW can blame Coronavirus instead of the slow boat from Germany when they drag their ass.

[randybobandy]

mitch57 I agree with your points. I think you got to be a pain in the ass with BMW, otherwise they will keep making up excuses. It is advertised and promoted that I don't need to take my fat ass to the dealership. They make reference to quality control of the software before they release it as an OTA. That alone tells me you will never see it. I've seen talk on here of a new app, which would be nice...Also, BMW seems to half ass a bunch of things instead of perfecting what they have already. There's too much difference between MY and region. The capabilities are there, but BMW doesn't seem to want to get going. It's not a disastrous issue, but a slap in the face. We paid for all these things that were included for 3 or 4 years depending on your lease or purchase. I was sold on this vehicle with it's technology and comfort. I am still impressed, but losing respect for BMW's software team. At the end of the day, i can get from point a to point b, but so can a shit ton of other vehicles...the "premium" we paid for BMW should included quality and follow through.

On a side note, now BMW can blame Coronavirus instead of the slow boat from Germany when they drag their ass.

[russelldav]

I rejected BMW's initial response and asked them to be more specific on when RSUs would be rolled out. They just came back with some complete BS about it already being enabled in Canada. BBB has closed the case and my complaint is now a matter of public record.

As previously advised, RSUs are already enabled for vehicles capable of this feature, including your X5, and the first RSU is planned for release in the coming months. Although we empathize with your concerns, we are unable to advise on the exact date of the release as this information has not yet been publicly announced. We apologize for any disappointment this may cause.

Next step, class action lawsuit anyone? How can you get away with advertising a feature that does not work, and then not even having the decency to admit it!

[sward]

I got a notification yesterday that there was an update for my car. Updated it from 11/2019.55 to 11/2019.70. Took 20 minutes. M50d in Sweden.

[UKMS]

Originally Posted by randybobandy

mitch57 I agree with your points. I think you got to be a pain in the ass with BMW, otherwise they will keep making up excuses. It is advertised and promoted that I don't need to take my fat ass to the dealership. They make reference to quality control of the software before they release it as an OTA. That alone tells me you will never see it. I've seen talk on here of a new app, which would be nice...Also, BMW seems to half ass a bunch of things instead of perfecting what they have already. There's too much difference between MY and region. The capabilities are there, but BMW doesn't seem to want to get going. It's not a disastrous issue, but a slap in the face. We paid for all these things that were included for 3 or 4 years depending on your lease or purchase. I was sold on this vehicle with it's technology and comfort. I am still impressed, but losing respect for BMW's software team. At the end of the day, i can get from point a to point b, but so can a shit ton of other vehicles...the "premium" we paid for BMW should included quality and follow through.

On a side note, now BMW can blame Coronavirus instead of the slow boat from Germany when they drag their ass.

If you think the s/w and tech is bad on a BMW, drive a Range Rover or Land Rover for a while

[randybobandy]

My biggest problem with the whole debacle is that BMW clearly stated my software would be updated with the latest and greatest...hell, they will "charge" you for it after the 3 or 4 years of owning...if you lease, then cool...but you still paid into the RSU function. BMW states that I do not have to go to the dealership to keep it up to date, then sells it as some advanced technology. Ironically, I end up at the dealership more for the software than anything else. The vehicle is solid (minus a few annoying creaks and squeaks), but the software is lackluster.

Does it work 90% of the time? Sure, but I was fed a load of crap about this latest and greatest software. The release notes are a mess, the various incremental updates are all over the place. If it wasn't for this forum, I would have no clue and assume my software is the latest. Then, we settle on here for N-1, which again...BMW never said it would be a step back. I get the point some folks make about not wanting to release the newest version due to bugs. Well, why didn't BMW test it? This all falls on BMW, and it's BS for them to make excuses and never communicate anything regarding the updates or changes, etc.

BMW has really put the cart before the horse with the software. I would not have an issue being nitpicky if they did not use the language in their advertising or sales pitch with the software. Again, I am beating a dead horse, but it's funny for all of us to kind of accept it for what it is. My favorite ongoing issue is the chattering wiper blades. I feel like I've done way too much to try and fix it. None of my previous vehicles had this problem, which is funny since BMW overdid it with having to tuck away the blades. Sometimes you just need to chuckle at their reasoning.

Sorry for the rant and scattered mumbo jumbo...I made the mistake of checking in without breakfast. Hangry!

[mitch57]

Originally Posted by randybobandy

My biggest problem with the whole debacle is that BMW clearly stated my software would be updated with the latest and greatest...hell, they will "charge" you for it after the 3 or 4 years of owning...if you lease, then cool...but you still paid into the RSU function. BMW states that I do not have to go to the dealership to keep it up to date, then sells it as some advanced technology. Ironically, I end up at the dealership more for the software than anything else. The vehicle is solid (minus a few annoying creaks and squeaks), but the software is lackluster.

Does it work 90% of the time? Sure, but I was fed a load of crap about this latest and greatest software. The release notes are a mess, the various incremental updates are all over the place. If it wasn't for this forum, I would have no clue and assume my software is the latest. Then, we settle on here for N-1, which again...BMW never said it would be a step back. I get the point some folks make about not wanting to release the newest version due to bugs. Well, why didn't BMW test it? This all falls on BMW, and it's BS for them to make excuses and never communicate anything regarding the updates or changes, etc.

BMW has really put the cart before the horse with the software. I would not have an issue being nitpicky if they did not use the language in their advertising or sales pitch with the software. Again, I am beating a dead horse, but it's funny for all of us to kind of accept it for what it is. My favorite ongoing issue is the chattering wiper blades. I feel like I've done way too much to try and fix it. None of my previous vehicles had this problem, which is funny since BMW overdid it with having to tuck away the blades. Sometimes you just need to chuckle at their reasoning.

Sorry for the rant and scattered mumbo jumbo...I made the mistake of checking in without breakfast. Hangry!

I agree with all of your complaints. Overall, my vehicle works to my satisfaction in the technology department. However, companies that make false claims to features that we pay for rubs me raw!

Don't blow smoke up my ass telling me how great the feature is and how important it is to keep your vehicle up to date via OTA updates only to find out it doesn't work and doesn't even exist in the United States to date.

Several people from other countries have stated that they have gotten OTA updates and the updates have worked. They Do Not work in the United States and have never worked in the US.

When the no charge OTA updates expire after 3 years of ownership, I'm sure those that keep their cars will be raising a big stink if BMW tries to charge us a subscription fee to keep this option that has never worked. Especially, if they've never received an OTA update during those first 3 years.

My guess is that, like Apple Car Play, they will just continue to not charge owners for this option later on. If BMW does try to charge them for the OTA updates, owners that still have their cars will most likely revolt and someone will sue them.

[UKMS]

Originally Posted by russelldav

I rejected BMW's initial response and asked them to be more specific on when RSUs would be rolled out. They just came back with some complete BS about it already being enabled in Canada. BBB has closed the case and my complaint is now a matter of public record.

Next step, class action lawsuit anyone? How can you get away with advertising a feature that does not work, and then not even having the decency to admit it!

Why not go for it and see how far you get ? .... there is a lot of hot air blown about this issue and how it's illegal, false advertising etc etc .... if that's the case why doesn't someone do something about it ?

[LexxM3]

Originally Posted by UKMS

Why not go for it and see how far you get ? .... there is a lot of hot air blown about this issue and how it's illegal, false advertising etc etc .... if that's the case why doesn't someone do something about it ?

A Canadian, a "Brit in Dubai", and a Belgian walk into a US courtroom for a class action lawsuit against BMW "what"? BMW NA? BMW AG? Sounds like the start of a bad joke. Only our American friends are in a practical position to pull off a Class Action suit in US against BMW NA.

[UKMS]

Originally Posted by LexxM3

A Canadian, a "Brit in Dubai", and a Belgian walk into a US courtroom for a class action lawsuit against BMW "what"? BMW NA? BMW AG? Sounds like the start of a bad joke. Only our American friends are in a practical position to pull off a Class Action suit in US against BMW NA.

I don't need to do anything ....... I just see a lot of hot air expelled on here about this I'm asking why don't those in the US do something about it .... I suspect they can't

[LexxM3]

Originally Posted by UKMS

I don't need to do anything ....... I just see a lot of hot air expelled on here about this I'm asking why don't those in the US do something about it .... I suspect they can't

OP is Canadian. Americans certainly have grounds and a legal system to support them in such an action, but I suspect most ultimately have more important things to do. I'd love to see it, however — it would be nice to have BMW (and particularly BMW NA) arrogance be brought down a notch.