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      09-07-2020, 09:30 PM   #1
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Bowers and Wilkins sound system upgrade

Is it worth it? What's your take on this? Trying to decide if there is a big different between the base system and this ?
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      09-07-2020, 10:45 PM   #2
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I had the B&O in my previous F85 and the B&W in my previous F90 and thought both were great. Now have it in my F95 and I would not order it again. This system in the F95 in my opinion is severely lacking, no bass unless you turn it way up n the equalizer, The system is very quiet and I don't listen to it loud but need to turn it up to 2/3 to 3/4 to hear it. This seems the same regardless of media used. Id try the HK but have not heard it yet in the F95
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      09-08-2020, 12:03 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mswaz View Post
I had the B&O in my previous F85 and the B&W in my previous F90 and thought both were great. Now have it in my F95 and I would not order it again. This system in the F95 in my opinion is severely lacking, no bass unless you turn it way up n the equalizer, The system is very quiet and I don't listen to it loud but need to turn it up to 2/3 to 3/4 to hear it. This seems the same regardless of media used. Id try the HK but have not heard it yet in the F95
Hi. Did you turn "both volume up"?

If I use apple, I need to boost volume on my watch because sometimes it reduces volume like -30-50%

H&K si loud, B&W should be louder and more everything - clear, high, mid, bass etc.

I have HK in 540i and love it. Expect that BW in f95 would be much better..
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      09-08-2020, 06:04 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by sarperb View Post
Is it worth it?
Yes it is but asking if it is worth it is like saying "is the X5M worth the premium over an M50i". Some people will not feel it is and others will. My personal opinion is you will utilize and appreciate the audio system far more often than you will utilize what the X5M motor has to offer. If you can justify the motor you can justify the audio package and in my opinion you will not regret it. Go for it!
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      09-08-2020, 08:00 AM   #5
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I had the HK in my G05 X5 and B&W in X5m and B&W is absolutely worth it. I listened to them side by side yesterday while taking my aftermarket wheels off the X5.
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      09-08-2020, 08:20 AM   #6
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Have HK in my X5MC and am more than satisfied with it. Unless you are planning to blast the music or listen to it loudly, IMO no need to spend extra $ for BW system.
I prefer to listen to the engine music anyway and when I want real music, HK does the job.
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      09-08-2020, 08:47 AM   #7
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In have had both in the G05 and G07. The HK system is good and should be the bare minimum of audio system at this price point. The HK has low end but lacks any refinement and clarity. This in turn can muddy up the soundstage.
The B&W is in a completely different league anyway you want to look at it. It is possibly THE best factory audio system you can get at any price point. I have owned B&O in Audi, etc.. B&W is better equipment and fine tuned that one step further for BMW.
The clarity and spatial separation is breathtaking. The lows are punchy and full yet still so clear. You can hear the mallet strike the bass drum where in the HK system you just get a thump. Surround sound with the B&W is probably the best you will ever hear in a car. You can also fine tune the B&W system to such spectacular levels providing you have the ear for this level of adjustment.
I am a professional and have a degree in acoustic engineering. The opportunity to even get a audio system this refined is so rare that you really have to get it at this price point of a vehicle. Its a opportunity to become a audiophile if you are not one already. The HK is great if you are price point shopping your family rig and on a tight budget. If this is a halo vehicle for you, then B&W should be the first option you check off. Hope this helps.

FYI:I use B&W speakers in our studio’s control rooms and have a ground up $150k media room in my home and use B&W speakers.





Last edited by MystroX5; 09-08-2020 at 09:02 AM..
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      09-08-2020, 09:07 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MystroX5 View Post
In have had both in the G05 and G07. The HK system is good and should be the bare minimum of audio system at this price point. The HK has low end but lacks any refinement and clarity. This in turn can muddy up the soundstage.
The B&W is in a completely different league anyway you want to look at it. It is possibly THE best factory audio system you can get at any price point. I have owned B&O in Audi, etc.. B&W is better equipment and fine tuned that one step further for BMW.
The clarity and spatial separation is breathtaking. The lows are punchy and full yet still so clear. You can hear the mallet strike the bass drum where in the HK system you just get a thump. Surround sound with the B&W is probably the best you will ever hear in a car. I am a professional and have a degree in acoustic engineering. The opportunity to even get a audio system this refined is so rare that you really have to get it at this price point of a vehicle. Its a opportunity to become a audiophile if you are not one already. The HK is great if you are price point shopping your family rig and on a tight budget. If this is a halo vehicle for you, then B&W should be the first option you check off. Hope this helps.

FYI:I use B&W speakers in our studio's control rooms and have a ground up $150k media room in my home and use B&W speakers.




Agreed. It's not over boosted like some other Audio systems. My burmester in C63S sounded like crap until it broke in and now it sounds reasonable. B&W is just much better but they are at different price points. C class doesn't offer the high end burmester option.

I consider myself a "junior" audiophile. B&W's in my office, Martin Logan's in living room and Klipsch RF7iii in the theater room.
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      09-08-2020, 11:46 AM   #9
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Have you seen side by side comparison of what the Burmester audio is compared to the H/K?

https://w205audio.wordpress.com/2016...rmester-audio/

Many C-Class people swapped out their Burmester for aftermarket bits.
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      09-08-2020, 11:54 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by iconoclast View Post
Have you seen side by side comparison of what the Burmester audio is compared to the H/K?

https://w205audio.wordpress.com/2016...rmester-audio/

Many C-Class people swapped out their Burmester for aftermarket bits.
I've been through that site. There was an update to amps for the FL C63 models. Significant improvement. Lots of people complained about the lack of bass which I didn't understand at all then realized the changes made for the Facelift models.
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      09-08-2020, 11:57 AM   #11
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Good to know. I did not know there was a revision. It was seriously lacking for a "premium" audio package but glad to read MB stepped and addressed it.
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      09-08-2020, 12:02 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarperb View Post
Is it worth it? What's your take on this? Trying to decide if there is a big different between the base system and this ?
without going into too much detail like the other posters, if you like listening to music in the car, then I highly recommend the Bowers and Wilkins. I had an X7 loaner car the other day with the HK and although it's a good system, it is no where near the quality of the BW. once I tweaked the equalizer settings, the system has exceeded my expectations. it's much louder, clearer and more high quality than the HK. it also looks much cooler at night with the lights and diamond tweeters.

go for it. you'll regret it if you don't.
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      09-08-2020, 12:30 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by jokerswld34 View Post
without going into too much detail like the other posters, if you like listening to music in the car, then I highly recommend the Bowers and Wilkins. I had an X7 loaner car the other day with the HK and although it's a good system, it is no where near the quality of the BW. once I tweaked the equalizer settings, the system has exceeded my expectations. it's much louder, clearer and more high quality than the HK. it also looks much cooler at night with the lights and diamond tweeters.

go for it. you'll regret it if you don't.
There is a good point. The "cool factor" of those beautiful brushed metal speaker grills during the day and awesome lit up speakers at night is off the charts if you are aiming to impress visually.
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      09-08-2020, 01:06 PM   #14
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Not a fan of the ambient lighting and sunroof. I disable all the lighting and "bling" because I feel like I am in a limo going to the Prom.
One of my favorite features of the old school SAAB vehicles was "Night Panel" where everything went black except the speedometer.

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      09-08-2020, 03:20 PM   #15
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There is a good point. The "cool factor" of those beautiful brushed metal speaker grills during the day and awesome lit up speakers at night is off the charts if you are aiming to impress visually.
love the speakers at night!!

(music isn't the coolest, probably!!)
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      09-08-2020, 08:18 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MystroX5 View Post
In have had both in the G05 and G07. The HK system is good and should be the bare minimum of audio system at this price point. The HK has low end but lacks any refinement and clarity. This in turn can muddy up the soundstage.
The B&W is in a completely different league anyway you want to look at it. It is possibly THE best factory audio system you can get at any price point. I have owned B&O in Audi, etc.. B&W is better equipment and fine tuned that one step further for BMW.
The clarity and spatial separation is breathtaking. The lows are punchy and full yet still so clear. You can hear the mallet strike the bass drum where in the HK system you just get a thump. Surround sound with the B&W is probably the best you will ever hear in a car. You can also fine tune the B&W system to such spectacular levels providing you have the ear for this level of adjustment.
I am a professional and have a degree in acoustic engineering. The opportunity to even get a audio system this refined is so rare that you really have to get it at this price point of a vehicle. Its a opportunity to become a audiophile if you are not one already. The HK is great if you are price point shopping your family rig and on a tight budget. If this is a halo vehicle for you, then B&W should be the first option you check off. Hope this helps.

FYI:I use B&W speakers in our studio’s control rooms and have a ground up $150k media room in my home and use B&W speakers.





Agreed. I thought some of the best I heard was in my S550 (Burmester), but this blows it out of the water. I originally wasn't planning on getting it since I wasn't that wow'ed by the B&O in my F85, but I'm glad i went for it. Clarity and spatial separation is what I first noticed as well and what I enjoy the most. I don't care much about bass, not that the system can't handle it.
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      09-09-2020, 12:39 AM   #17
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From my personal experience i've had different thoughts on the B&W on different BMWs.
The first time I ever heard it was on my brother's 2017 750. It was clear, crisp yet sometimes lacking bass. Then the 8er came out and I tried the system on that car and it differs from the Coupe to the GC. The ones on the Coupe sound much better, I don't know if it's because of the smaller cabin.
Then I tried it on the X6 M50i and I loved it. it was full of bass, crispiness and you could enjoy it even on the lower frequencies. I especially loved the 3d surroud sound which was lacking in the previous cars.
THEN I tried it on the 7er LCI. I don't know if it was the car itself as it was a loaner from the dealership but it was a disaster. It wasn't near as loud as it could be, felt a bit noisy and unclear (if that makes sense).
Now i'm driving an X7 M50i as a loaner (again, yes my car gets sent back to the dealership alot these days) and while I love it once again it does feel lacking on the lower notes.

It may be my unfortunate luck to have different experiences with the same brand but all in all I'd upgrade to the B&W.
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      09-09-2020, 06:14 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HMN View Post
From my personal experience i've had different thoughts on the B&W on different BMWs.
The first time I ever heard it was on my brother's 2017 750. It was clear, crisp yet sometimes lacking bass. Then the 8er came out and I tried the system on that car and it differs from the Coupe to the GC. The ones on the Coupe sound much better, I don't know if it's because of the smaller cabin.
Then I tried it on the X6 M50i and I loved it. it was full of bass, crispiness and you could enjoy it even on the lower frequencies. I especially loved the 3d surroud sound which was lacking in the previous cars.
THEN I tried it on the 7er LCI. I don't know if it was the car itself as it was a loaner from the dealership but it was a disaster. It wasn't near as loud as it could be, felt a bit noisy and unclear (if that makes sense).
Now i'm driving an X7 M50i as a loaner (again, yes my car gets sent back to the dealership alot these days) and while I love it once again it does feel lacking on the lower notes.

It may be my unfortunate luck to have different experiences with the same brand but all in all I'd upgrade to the B&W.
The B&W is a sophisticated, highly tuned audio system that can be adjusted to sound less than good. One of the first things I do when in the showroom is adjust each car I sit in to a reasonable adjustment. My SA loves it when I do this as most audio systems have been played with to the point they are sabotage. I have found many tone adjustments set all the way to their extremes which is a train wreck.

There is two separate ways to adjust the tone in the new B&W. Check those settings. A owner needs to fine tune the system to what they like with the eq. This sets the personality of the system. Then there is global bass and treble quick adjustments after the eq has been set. These two adjustments are for quick adjustments of the already set “personality” of the audio system. You can very easily make the entire system thumpy/pumpy windows down if that’s what you are into with the quick adjustments and then roll up the windows set the adjustments back to neutral and now you have a clean balanced system with the personality you set with the eq.

Last edited by MystroX5; 09-09-2020 at 06:40 AM..
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      09-09-2020, 08:21 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MystroX5 View Post
The B&W is a sophisticated, highly tuned audio system that can be adjusted to sound less than good. One of the first things I do when in the showroom is adjust each car I sit in to a reasonable adjustment. My SA loves it when I do this as most audio systems have been played with to the point they are sabotage. I have found many tone adjustments set all the way to their extremes which is a train wreck.

There is two separate ways to adjust the tone in the new B&W. Check those settings. A owner needs to fine tune the system to what they like with the eq. This sets the personality of the system. Then there is global bass and treble quick adjustments after the eq has been set. These two adjustments are for quick adjustments of the already set “personality” of the audio system. You can very easily make the entire system thumpy/pumpy windows down if that’s what you are into with the quick adjustments and then roll up the windows set the adjustments back to neutral and now you have a clean balanced system with the personality you set with the eq.
I have terrible sound understanding please come adjust mine!!! lol Or share your EQ settings for maybe a base line?
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      09-09-2020, 01:21 PM   #20
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I think the answer to you question of whether its “worth it” depends on how much the audio experience in a car is worth to you. For me, it is a huge part of my automobile experience so I always check the box for the highest end audio upgrade available for the car I’m buying. Over the years, I’ve been very pleased (B&O in my 2014 A7) and sometimes I’ve been underwhelmed (Burmester in 2017 911).

The interesting thing about the Burmester in my Porsche was that while I felt the power was more robust than any other system I’ve had - particularly for frequencies below 80 hertz (i.e. at the very low end) - the absence of full multi-frequency equalizer compromised my ability to ever sufficiently tune it for a satisfactory result. It was crystal clear, extremely powerful and you couldn’t get it to distort if you tried, but I never could get the frequencies balanced quite right having only a simple bass/treble gain at my disposal...a shame I think.

I must admit that I was initially underwhelmed by the B&W when I picked up my X5MC in July, but after spending quite a bit of time experimenting with adjustments to the EQ and a couple months of break-in for the speakers, it sounds quite a bit better now (and much much better than the HK in my old 2015 X5). I’m pretty happy with and would certainty check the box again.
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      09-10-2020, 02:02 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MystroX5 View Post
In have had both in the G05 and G07. The HK system is good and should be the bare minimum of audio system at this price point. The HK has low end but lacks any refinement and clarity. This in turn can muddy up the soundstage.
The B&W is in a completely different league anyway you want to look at it. It is possibly THE best factory audio system you can get at any price point. I have owned B&O in Audi, etc.. B&W is better equipment and fine tuned that one step further for BMW.
The clarity and spatial separation is breathtaking. The lows are punchy and full yet still so clear. You can hear the mallet strike the bass drum where in the HK system you just get a thump. Surround sound with the B&W is probably the best you will ever hear in a car. You can also fine tune the B&W system to such spectacular levels providing you have the ear for this level of adjustment.
I am a professional and have a degree in acoustic engineering. The opportunity to even get a audio system this refined is so rare that you really have to get it at this price point of a vehicle. Its a opportunity to become a audiophile if you are not one already. The HK is great if you are price point shopping your family rig and on a tight budget. If this is a halo vehicle for you, then B&W should be the first option you check off. Hope this helps.

FYI:I use B&W speakers in our studio's control rooms and have a ground up $150k media room in my home and use B&W speakers.




I love my H&K in 5er g30 but It misses something, somehow. I am audiophile so I hope the B&W in my incoming x5m comp going to be beast.
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      09-10-2020, 05:06 AM   #22
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I have the B&W in my 2020 X5M50i..... I've also recently driven a close friend's 2019 X5 40i with the Harman Kardon. Both G05 cars

The sound quality in the B&W is CONSIDERABLY better than the H/K system. Plus, they are very attractive at night when lit up.

I will say, I still think the B&W is lacking bass response. I'm actually building a custom stealth subwoofer box for it as we speak. But, the H/K is lacking in bass too. Those underseat subs (on both systems) just don't do the job in an interior as large as the X5. I'm not a rap music fan either.... even for modern rock and pop, it's lacking. The "quality" is excellent on the B&W. The "level" of bass is underwhelming though. It's not "bad"... I just expected more. If you listen to classical, jazz, classic rock, or anything that isn't too "bass-ey", it's perfect.

The CLARITY on the B&W is impressive though. Very impressive. It's a truly "immersive" experience. My friend's H/K at 1/2 volume was already starting to distort, whereas the B&W never distorts, even at full volume. It's always crystal clear at any level.

One of my fav albums of all time is the 2010 remastered NIN Pretty Hate Machine album. It's very "techno industrial", but also rock/metal. There are parts of that album I never knew existed, because I could never hear them on a "normal" stereo. It's like listening to the album for the first time again. Still though.... needs more bass. Not "better" bass.... just "more" bass. The highs are so perfect, so crystal clear, and so unusually audible compared to a normal stereo.... but the bass is just "ehhh". The sub box I'm building is minimal... nothing major.... just enough to compliment the bass, not make it overpowering. That's all the car needs to be perfect.

Is it worth the $3400 upgrade on a US spec car? Yes.

Is it worth (what I hear) $6000+ people are paying outside the US?? No, it isn't.
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