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      04-21-2020, 05:42 PM   #1
stanoman
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Purchase questions on 2020 X5 M50i

I've been a Ford owner for years. I'm used to working with Ford dealerships on new car purchases.

I'm working with a BMW dealership in New Hampshire on a 2020 X5 M50i. When I first contacted the dealership, the sales rep told me that the M50i's were the same as the xDrive50i.
All of the 2020 BMW X5 models with an eight cylinder engine are designated as M50i.
I simply left the "M" off in my email.
I sent this reply:
I'm confused by your emails. From my understanding, and according to the BMW web site, the X5 xDrive40i is a 3 liter Twin Turbo 6 cylinder.

The X5 xDrive50i is a 4.4 liter Twin Turbo V-8.

The X5 M50i is a 4.4 liter M Performance Twin Turbo V8.

Is the web site incorrect?
Can anyone help me understand why this sales representative and I were out of sync? He followed up with several quotes for 40i's before I explained again that this was a 6 cylinder and I am interested in the 8 in the M50i. Is the coordination between BMW, their web site and dealerships this "off"?

I may be dealing with a sales rep that's new or half-assing it. But I don't want to make any assumptions.
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      04-21-2020, 06:10 PM   #2
TurtleBoy
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For 2020 there is both an xDrive50i and an M50i. They will be dropping the xDrive50i starting next year. My guess is rather than being confused, your salesman is trying to sell what they have on the lot since no one knows when production will start up again and what model year they will be doing.

Last edited by TurtleBoy; 04-21-2020 at 06:35 PM.. Reason: Grammer
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      04-21-2020, 11:09 PM   #3
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Yes, there are differences...in general, the BMWUSA.com website is accurate, but I'd say the best source for factual data is the Ordering and Pricing Guides:
- Ordering Guide: https://batxcr1.bmwcenternet.com/lib...eringGuide.pdf
- Pricing Guide: https://batxcr1.bmwcenternet.com/lib...ide_Retail.pdf

While they can be a bit challenging at first, once you understand them, they're sort of the "bible" for figuring-out special orders and in general, a number of the Forum participants will know the differences in details better than almost any salesperson at a BMW dealership. So, take a look at them and ask questions out here in the forum RE Option 4M5 is and you'll get answers quickly!

My experience is that the general sales folk interchange the 50i and M50i naming on a regular basis. However, as you'll see in the Ordering/Pricing guides, there are quite a few differences. On the engine front, while the V8 is in the same family, they're slightly different engine codes. The 50i is an N63B44M3 and the M50i is an N63B44T3. The M50i outputs additional HP (523 vs. 456) (and I think additional torque, 750 vs. 650). (Engine reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_X5_(G05))

I wasn't aware of the notion that the 50i will go away for MY2021, but it wouldn't be surprising, as BMW in general is getting rid of a lot of variation in their model lines...my assumption was that the reason they'd done it for the G05 was to allow someone that wanted to tow (trailer, boat, etc.) and wanted the V8 could get an X-Line, Off-Road package, etc., as those aren't available (and I wouldn't think they'd be added...) with the M50i.

I just recently bought a G06 (X6) and went the M50i route, but in the G06, that's the only V8 option...the straight 50i doesn't exist in that line.
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      04-22-2020, 05:43 AM   #4
stanoman
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Thanks for your replies. The sales rep has located an X5 M50i for me with mostly what I wanted. The whole "it's the same thing" disappeared after the initial argument. I just wanted to see what others thought about what might be behind the behavior.

Luckily, I'm doing this all via phone and email. They asked me to sign a purchase and sale agreement and pay a 2K deposit for the swap. But initially told me that they could not include the VIN on the P&S agreement because they don't know it. I used cars.com and found what appeared to be the exact same vehicle they found, and asked if they would simply include the VIN. The salesman said that wasn't the vehicle. I asked how he knew that it wasn't the same vehicle if he didn't know the VIN, he said it wasn't the dealership. At this point, he was raising his voice with me. Clearly frustrated. This is not where I wanted our discussions to go.

When I began politely thanking him for his time and wishing him well in the future. He said he'd have his manager call me.

His manager called me a few minutes later and said that it was incorrect that I should not sign a P&S Agreement without a VIN. "I'm sorry to seem like I'm telling you you're wrong, but that's not true." In effect, saying that the lawyer I'm working with on a Lemon Law case is wrong and the articles I've read on this topic in internet forums are also wrong. When I explained that I was not comfortable signing it without the VIN or paying the 2K deposit without the VIN, he said he'd see what he could do.

I received an email with a new P&S agreement that included the last 7 digits of the VIN 10 minutes later. It matched the VIN from the vehicle I found on cars.com.

Is my lawyer wrong about including the VIN on the P&S agreement? What is the dealer's motivation for hiding the VIN and dealership? Why are they telling me that they don't know the VIN?

Each time I've been through this with Ford, they will verify the car by sending me a PDF of the full window sticker of the one they found, which includes the full VIN and even the dealership that has it.
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      04-22-2020, 11:39 PM   #5
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Can't say right/wrong on the purchase and sales agreement not having a VIN. I've only done a purchase in-person and any purchase agreement has had the VIN on it. However, my last 2 BMWs have been special orders, so I knew the VIN well before the sale...

It certainly doesn't seem unreasonable to me. You should know what your buying and the "We don't know the VIN." doesn't really seem legitimate. If they're getting the vehicle from another dealer, the VIN is known in the system...they're listed everywhere.
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      04-23-2020, 12:31 PM   #6
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You're not being unreasonable. They may be hiding the VIN from you because they clearly know you're smart and may be able to track down that vehicle (like you did without even having the VIN) and go directly to the dealer that has the car in inventory. That's the only thing I can think of.
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      04-24-2020, 09:27 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 512systems View Post
You're not being unreasonable. They may be hiding the VIN from you because they clearly know you're smart and may be able to track down that vehicle (like you did without even having the VIN) and go directly to the dealer that has the car in inventory. That's the only thing I can think of.
Agree with this...and to be honest, given your dealer’s behavior thus far, I probably wouldn’t do business with them. The irony of them being coy is that it may lead you to deal directly with the dealership that has the car and just arrange shipping through them...exactly what they were trying to avoid. I just don’t see the value of dealing with your current dealer if they are just getting in the way.
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      04-24-2020, 06:13 PM   #8
stanoman
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Thanks for the thoughtful responses, everyone.

I let the dealership know that I'm not happy with the "rocky start" we got off to and have decided to continue shopping.

I'm comfortable with the relationship I have with my local Ford dealership and their service department. This is part of the reason I want to build a good relationship with the BMW dealership. I'm concerned that I won't get the same treatment from a BMW service department from a dealership where I didn't purchase the vehicle. Is that something I need to be concerned about?
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      04-24-2020, 06:47 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stanoman View Post
Thanks for the thoughtful responses, everyone.

I let the dealership know that I'm not happy with the "rocky start" we got off to and have decided to continue shopping.

I'm comfortable with the relationship I have with my local Ford dealership and their service department. This is part of the reason I want to build a good relationship with the BMW dealership. I'm concerned that I won't get the same treatment from a BMW service department from a dealership where I didn't purchase the vehicle. Is that something I need to be concerned about?
Hopefully they will come back and apologize, say they want your business, and give you a bit more off.

Having your BMW serviced at a dealership it was not purchased from should not be a problem. The service department will be happy to take your (or BMW's in the case of warranty/incl paint) money and treat you like the customers who purchased from them.
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      04-30-2020, 10:11 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stanoman View Post
Thanks for the thoughtful responses, everyone.

I let the dealership know that I'm not happy with the "rocky start" we got off to and have decided to continue shopping.

I'm comfortable with the relationship I have with my local Ford dealership and their service department. This is part of the reason I want to build a good relationship with the BMW dealership. I'm concerned that I won't get the same treatment from a BMW service department from a dealership where I didn't purchase the vehicle. Is that something I need to be concerned about?
+1 on the above comment.... the dealer franchises are very dependent on their nps scores... you will get the best service they are capable of if you buy the car there or not. (What they are capable of.... your mileage my vary)

Agree with most of the above you were in the right... without a vin they could theoretically hand you any x5.

Your best bet if you don't want to deal with their nonsense is A. Contact the dealer you found the car at. B shop around... casual plug there is a forum member who regularly contributes that works at a dealer in nh.
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