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      10-24-2020, 04:05 PM   #1
videoman535i
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40i vs 45e horsepower

For fun I went to config a '21 model but I was stopped in my tracks when I noticed the horsepower ratings between the 40i and 45e, 335 vs. 282 respectively.

Even if the electric motor couldn't be used to augment the maximum horsepower, I would have still expected the combustion engine to maintain its 335hp rating.

The 0-60 time of 5.3s is still the same for both.

Is the 45e's six detuned to maximize mileage?
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      10-24-2020, 04:19 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by videoman535i View Post
For fun I went to config a '21 model but I was stopped in my tracks when I noticed the horsepower ratings between the 40i and 45e, 335 vs. 282 respectively.

Even if the electric motor couldn't be used to augment the maximum horsepower, I would have still expected the combustion engine to maintain its 335hp rating.

The 0-60 time of 5.3s is still the same for both.

Is the 45e's six detuned to maximize mileage?
Suspect it has been de-tuned to protect the sales of the 40i or maybe 50i models?
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      10-24-2020, 04:29 PM   #3
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I believe the combined HP for the 45e is 394 hp or so. It's a tricky equation when calculating the gas engine w electric motor.
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      10-24-2020, 04:35 PM   #4
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In reality, while the indicated battery level may reach zero, because of the buffer and regen, the electric motor can still be used for short bursts to augment acceleration and to smooth out lag from when the turbo is coming up to speed. The 45e ends up feeling faster and achieves better economy in the process.
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      10-24-2020, 04:37 PM   #5
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The low speed torque of 45e is much higher than 40, due to the electric motor. Overall power output is also higher. The driving experience of 45e is comparable to 50, IMHO.
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      10-24-2020, 04:47 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by videoman535i View Post
For fun I went to config a '21 model but I was stopped in my tracks when I noticed the horsepower ratings between the 40i and 45e, 335 vs. 282 respectively.

Even if the electric motor couldn't be used to augment the maximum horsepower, I would have still expected the combustion engine to maintain its 335hp rating.

The 0-60 time of 5.3s is still the same for both.

Is the 45e's six detuned to maximize mileage?
Not sure why they did that, my Cayenne E Hybrid V6 is rated the same 335hp as the base models (455hp combined with electric motor). That said, hybrid systems never really get to zero battery, as the engine/regenerative braking will recharge them somewhat. I had a 45e on order, and did drive it when it came in, much quicker feeling than the 40i I had last time my G01 was in for some work.
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      10-24-2020, 05:12 PM   #7
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IF BMW kept the same HP from the I6, when you add in the electric motor, you'd be pushing up against the V8. As it is, it's in the middle. Detuning the engine could improve the overall efficiency, too.

I think it's purely a marketing and regulation thing and I'm sure a tuner could untap the detuning if you really wanted that.
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      10-24-2020, 07:56 PM   #8
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If you live in the USA with the $7,500 tax credit, I cannot imagine why anyone would NOT buy the 45e version.

The xDrive AWD option costs $2,300.
The Plugin Hybrid option costs another $3,700.
So a total of $6,000 more.

So the $7,500 tax credit completely pays for the two options. I cannot imagine why anyone would get xDrive without the Plugin option.

I wanted the xDrive option because of the heavy afternoon rains we get in Florida. I like AWD when the roads are wet. The 45e is just a no brainer with the tax credit.
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      10-25-2020, 01:34 AM   #9
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The ICE has been adapted with some stronger components to protect it when accelerating with a cold engine. I think the down tune is done for the same reason.

I don't know if there is any commercial reason. Even if the HP were similar between the 45e and the 50i I think the latter is chosen for the V8.
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      10-25-2020, 04:33 AM   #10
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Hey, it's better than the last hybrid X5. That thing came with a tiny 4 cyl engine.

Still, I'm with Rocket. If you're in the US, it's available with the $7500 tax credit. I'm comparing apples to apples. Hybrid is AWD only. So an Xdrive40i vs the hybrid is only $3700 more. With the tax credit, it's a no brainer.

If OP is in San Jose, then the hybrid also gets the carpool sticker. That's a double no brainer.

Then you get into the increased options and engine performance due to the electric motor. (In the US) Unless you're leasing and thus not getting the tax credit, why the hell would you pick the 40i over the 45e?
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      10-25-2020, 04:47 AM   #11
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I had the f15 40e and now the g05 45e. It is a world off difference.

The sound of the 4 vs 6 cylinder

With a depleted battery the 40e was really lacking power. In the 45e I don't have that feeling anymore. I don't know if it is because the battery is bigger and doesn't get depleted so fast? the 6 cylinder? better battery management?

Overall superior feeling in quality and power.
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      10-25-2020, 03:30 PM   #12
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I leased the 2019 I'm driving now, a first for me and I'm thinking I'd probably lease again, so the I wouldn't get the credit. I don't have to commute anymore so I don't need the sticker.

I'll need to make the decision when the 2022 model comes along. Maybe the 45e will be the only one available by then.
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      10-25-2020, 06:00 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Husker4theSpurs View Post
I believe the combined HP for the 45e is 394 hp or so. It's a tricky equation when calculating the gas engine w electric motor.
Nothing tricky here [IMG][/IMG]

The ice is detuned to 282bhp, so 53bhp less than 40i.

A remapped 45e takes the ice to 400bhp (same as remapped 40i) and total output becomes comparable to M50i.
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      10-26-2020, 12:26 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RocketGoBoom View Post
If you live in the USA with the $7,500 tax credit, I cannot imagine why anyone would NOT buy the 45e version.
No third row. Same issue with the M50i and the M, the only way to get a 3rd row in the US is to get the 40i.
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      10-26-2020, 01:33 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by ND40oz View Post
No third row. Same issue with the M50i and the M, the only way to get a 3rd row in the US is to get the 40i.
Do you find it useful? I didn't. Same with Tesla and their "third row" on non-Model X and many other vehicles. A lot of these 3rd rows really aren't useful, even if you still have tiny kids.
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      10-26-2020, 02:16 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by codex57 View Post
Do you find it useful? I didn't. Same with Tesla and their "third row" on non-Model X and many other vehicles. A lot of these 3rd rows really aren't useful, even if you still have tiny kids.
My kids used it in the XC90 when grandma and grandpa visit, they'll do the same in the X5. I did not order it in our E70 but since then we've gone from 1 to 3 children so it does get used now.

I still feel the X7 is a little too big for our needs and was hoping the SQ7 would put pressure on BMW to at least release the X5 M50i with the 3rd row but it hasn't so far.
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      10-27-2020, 04:43 AM   #17
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Don't forget the weight penalty for the hybrid system - about 150kg or thereabouts if I recall correctly.
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      10-27-2020, 08:23 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sjak92 View Post
Nothing tricky here [IMG][/IMG]

The ice is detuned to 282bhp, so 53bhp less than 40i.

A remapped 45e takes the ice to 400bhp (same as remapped 40i) and total output becomes comparable to M50i.
Are you saying there is a tune for 45e (remapped)?
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      10-27-2020, 08:28 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atlas View Post
Don't forget the weight penalty for the hybrid system - about 150kg or thereabouts if I recall correctly.
300kg of batteries:

https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-reviews/bmw/x5-suv/

The weight of 3-4 extra people all the time - no thanks.
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      10-27-2020, 08:49 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ND40oz View Post
No third row. Same issue with the M50i and the M, the only way to get a 3rd row in the US is to get the 40i.
beat me to it. This was one of the things I was thinking also when I read that. I have to do some research but there may be some other options also.
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      10-27-2020, 01:49 PM   #21
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Honestly, the weight is well hidden. Well centered, and this mamoth is quite agile with active steering and electric response / boost.

You really feel it only in tight curves and hard breaking. But at that level, 250kgs more or less should not make a difference. If you go for a 2.2t vehicules, you're good for a 2.5t. I've been in a Q7 Hybrid, 60TFSie... well it's an oil tanker compared the the X5. I have a Nissan Patrol long - fully habitable that is 3t+. I was driving an A4 before... and a Caterham with a bike engine for track days. I know what's heavy and light, and I'm good with the X5 because I know it's heavy but it's still nimble and it's the best in its class of weight.

If you don't like weight don' go for an SUV

If you really need more power here is an example of what's on the market now ... Latest publication from a ECU tuning company close to where I live: Stage 1 = 512 PS / 831 NM ...

But I'm on a lease... so not for me.
And actually, I wouldn't use them. It's way fast enough for the size.
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      10-27-2020, 02:17 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sahajesh View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by atlas View Post
Don't forget the weight penalty for the hybrid system - about 150kg or thereabouts if I recall correctly.
300kg of batteries:

https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-reviews/bmw/x5-suv/

The weight of 3-4 extra people all the time - no thanks.
Thank you for the link.

Very helpful
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