[AndroidRobot]

I took some thermal images (320*240) of various items in the car to show their effectiveness.

Initial Cup Holder temp:434.4C ~110F
Cooled Cup Holder: ~8C ~46F
Heated Cup Holder: ~57C ~135F

Cooled seat (after 10 minutes) Outside temp 37C ~99F (original seat temp 44.9C ~112F: 28C ~84F after cooling

AC on Low (60F): Vent temp: 7.6C ~45F

I also took some pics of my engine static (after driving earlier, it was resting for 2hrs, then right after driving)

Link to pics since Bimmerpost isn't showing them: https://photos.app.goo.gl/aytBfUbahAwUiUwEA

[ElectroGeek]

Originally Posted by AndroidRobot

I took some thermal images (320*240) of various items in the car to show their effectiveness.

Initial Cup Holder temp:434.4C ~110F
Cooled Cup Holder: ~8C ~46F
Heated Cup Holder: ~57C ~135F

Cooled seat (after 10 minutes) Outside temp 37C ~99F (original seat temp 44.9C ~112F: 28C ~84F after cooling

AC on Low (60F): Vent temp: 7.6C ~45F

I also took some pics of my engine static (after driving earlier, it was resting for 2hrs, then right after driving)

Link to pics since Bimmerpost isn't showing them: https://photos.app.goo.gl/aytBfUbahAwUiUwEA

The geek in you is strong, I approve :-)

On the cup holders did you try running both in cooled mode to see what it would get to?


Also you would think with all of the tech, they would have ran a pipe with a valve to the vented seat intake so that if the AC is on it would open the valve and syphon some of the AC air to the seats, and if AC is off it would pull air from the cabin itself. This would have been very effective IMO.

[Marty in NY]

Originally Posted by ElectroGeek

The geek in you is strong, I approve :-)

On the cup holders did you try running both in cooled mode to see what it would get to?


Also you would think with all of the tech, they would have ran a pipe with a valve to the vented seat intake so that if the AC is on it would open the valve and syphon some of the AC air to the seats, and if AC is off it would pull air from the cabin itself. This would have been very effective IMO.

Ha ha ha, the force is strong in this one! Well, as you can see, there is a difference but what is it relative to? I mean it appears the features work to some degree but what is the degree? A dim flashlight in complete darkness is better than complete darkness but is it what you want?
We can only accept what BMW hands out, that doesn't mean its what we would want. Compared to normal non heated/cooled cupholders, the ones in the X5 are better, ...no? I think so, especially if you didn't have to pay extra for them because they were included in a package of other things you wanted.

[AndroidRobot]

Originally Posted by Marty in Bgm

Ha ha ha, the force is strong in this one! Well, as you can see, there is a difference but what is it relative to? I mean it appears the features work to some degree but what is the degree? A dim flashlight in complete darkness is better than complete darkness but is it what you want?
We can only accept what BMW hands out, that doesn't mean its what we would want. Compared to normal non heated/cooled cupholders, the ones in the X5 are better, ...no? I think so, especially if you didn't have to pay extra for them because they were included in a package of other things you wanted.

I put the static temp as a control before turning anything on if you look above at the pictures. I can take some more tomorrow if you'd like. I enjoy the cup holders, there's also a vent which blows cool air over the area while the cooled part is on.

[Marty in NY]

Originally Posted by AndroidRobot

I put the static temp as a control before turning anything on if you look above at the pictures. I can take some more tomorrow if you'd like. I enjoy the cup holders, there's also a vent which blows cool air over the area while the cooled part is on.

If my times comes, I will order them, I mean why not, what do I have to lose? I wouldn't use them for heating but keeping a water bottle cool over a long trip would be nice. Plus, I like the cool red and blue colors :-)

[AndroidRobot]

Originally Posted by Marty in Bgm

If my times comes, I will order them, I mean why not, what do I have to lose? I wouldn't use them for heating but keeping a water bottle cool over a long trip would be nice. Plus, I like the cool red and blue colors :-)

they do actually light up red or blue in use. I would say things do stay hotter or cooler over a trip based on experience. I had an OJ in mine and it was cold the whole road trip but there was definitely a gradient of coolness on the bottle

[AndroidRobot]

Originally Posted by ElectroGeek

The geek in you is strong, I approve :-)

On the cup holders did you try running both in cooled mode to see what it would get to?


Also you would think with all of the tech, they would have ran a pipe with a valve to the vented seat intake so that if the AC is on it would open the valve and syphon some of the AC air to the seats, and if AC is off it would pull air from the cabin itself. This would have been very effective IMO.

It's what happens when you order stuff late after a few drinks on Amazon. I'll test it with both on cool tomorrow showing both the normal temp and after 15-20min

[MPoweRo]

Ha ha nerdy and awesome - nerdsome?

Good stuff!

Could have used those warmed cup holders today, it was -4 degC in Canberra before driving back to Melbourne.

[natahoa]

When I was ordering, I liked the idea of the cooled/heated cup holders, but didn’t want the other stuff in the package. Which was a costly package.

My solution was to buy a 12-volt fridge for the car. I think it was $79. It lives in the cargo hold for the moment, but is small enough to put in the back seat for easy access when we take a trip. I haven’t really used it yet. But it will also be good for groceries in the summer heat.

But to do that, I have to remember to turn it on to cool down before I get to the grocery store.

We are taking a road trip to my daughter’s wedding at the end of July. My 90-year-old mother-in-law is attending also (she is flying) but both she and I have meds that need to be kept cool, so I also bought an AC plug so it can be used inside.

Haven’t tried that either. I really should test both functions, I guess.

[AndroidRobot]

Originally Posted by natahoa

When I was ordering, I liked the idea of the cooled/heated cup holders, but didn’t want the other stuff in the package. Which was a costly package.

My solution was to buy a 12-volt fridge for the car. I think it was $79. It lives in the cargo hold for the moment, but is small enough to put in the back seat for easy access when we take a trip. I haven’t really used it yet. But it will also be good for groceries in the summer heat.

But to do that, I have to remember to turn it on to cool down before I get to the grocery store.

We are taking a road trip to my daughter’s wedding at the end of July. My 90-year-old mother-in-law is attending also (she is flying) but both she and I have meds that need to be kept cool, so I also bought an AC plug so it can be used inside.

Haven’t tried that either. I really should test both functions, I guess.

Since they came with one of the many packages with my car it's nice. I would add them as a standalone option because the cupholders have proven to be very useful both in the warmer and cooler months.

Originally Posted by ElectroGeek

The geek in you is strong, I approve :-)
On the cup holders did you try running both in cooled mode to see what it would get to?

I tested them this morning for about 15min, peak low temp was 7.1C ~44.8F but I accidentally deleted the pics so I'll redo it and upload the pictures. The static temp was 35C ~ 95F

[omaralt]

my wife has the cooled/heated cupholders in her gls and IMO they're useless because on roadtrips we always use yeti cups or steel coffee mugs. completely ineffective on those types of cups. now on a paper cup they might be useful

[Tenac]

I have a issue with the word effectiveness in this thread. The images do show them working and what temps they get too, but they do not define the effectiveness when introduced to the actual media it will be in contact with. Its like taking a thermal image of a heat sink and saying that is how effective it is at cooling the CPU but not showing the connection between the too. Still great thread and details for sure, but like omaralt said I've had very poor luck in the past with the cup holders on a different brand to note... That is why I didn't have it on my list. The seats I know help a bit but nothing like some out there that actually pump the into a bladder design instead of a pass through like the G05 has.... IMO

[AndroidRobot]

Originally Posted by Tenac

I have a issue with the word effectiveness in this thread. The images do show them working and what temps they get too, but they do not define the effectiveness when introduced to the actual media it will be in contact with. Its like taking a thermal image of a heat sink and saying that is how effective it is at cooling the CPU but not showing the connection between the too. Still great thread and details for sure, but like omaralt said I've had very poor luck in the past with the cup holders on a different brand to note... That is why I didn't have it on my list. The seats I know help a bit but nothing like some out there that actually pump the into a bladder design instead of a pass through like the G05 has.... IMO

Would you like me to test the thermal conductivity of a paper 'Starbucks' cup with an amibent temp liquid, cooled one, and heated one? I'm happy to do so if you really care that much. They do work pretty well in my experience and I'll gladly test them as noted.

[Tenac]

Originally Posted by AndroidRobot

Would you like me to test the thermal conductivity of a paper 'Starbucks' cup with an amibent temp liquid, cooled one, and heated one? I'm happy to do so if you really care that much. They do work pretty well in my experience and I'll gladly test them as noted.

No No No don't need to go out of your way, I was just calling out my opinion of the comparison. I used the CPU heatsink example because I knew you would catch that quickly. Just the wording to me doesn't actually justify the testing performed, even though it is still a great write up.. No need to adjust anything for me, just another digital writer on the internet.

[VTENGR]

Originally Posted by Tenac

No No No don't need to go out of your way, I was just calling out my opinion of the comparison. I used the CPU heatsink example because I knew you would catch that quickly. Just the wording to me doesn't actually justify the testing performed, even though it is still a great write up.. No need to adjust anything for me, just another digital writer on the internet.

I disagree - his pictures show how effective the option would be - as a baseline. It's up to you to take that data and apply it to your specific circumstance using the laws of thermodynamics. AndroidRobot has provided us a key parameter eliminating one of the variables to calculate the effectiveness of a particular vessel. You would need to know the following:

1) desired temp of liquid
2) ambient temperate
3) temperate offset (heated/cooled cup holders)
4) volume of liquid
5) surface area of cup
6) insulation value of container

once you know all of that you can see how effective the cup holders are.

If you assume a container with zero insulation and a desired temperature of 42 degrees for a cold beverage, then you can calculate how long it would take that container to reach a temperature higher than 42 degrees, or whatever the threshold is for a "refreshing drink".

If you drink out of yetis or any highly insulated cups, these are worthless. However, if you drink out of water bottles or coffee cups these are quite valuable since those cups offer almost zero insulation properties - foam being the exception.

What would be interesting is to do a side by side with the hot cup holders and a grande Starbucks cup. With the temperate at time equals zero being 195 degrees and how long it will take for that to get to say 100 degrees. Since the heated cup holders will reduce the delta in temperature between the liquid and the ambient temperature, it will increase the time it takes the coffee to cool down. Of course, an adjustment would need to be made since some of the surface area of the cup will be exposed to ambient temperatures which will be lower than the heated cup holder.

[Tenac]

Originally Posted by VTENGR

I disagree - his pictures show how effective the option would be - as a baseline. It's up to you to take that data and apply it to your specific circumstance using the laws of thermodynamics. AndroidRobot has provided us a key parameter eliminating one of the variables to calculate the effectiveness of a particular vessel. You would need to know the following:

1) desired temp of liquid
2) ambient temperate
3) temperate offset (heated/cooled cup holders)
4) volume of liquid
5) surface area of cup
6) insulation value of container

once you know all of that you can see how effective the cup holders are.

If you assume a container with zero insulation and a desired temperature of 42 degrees for a cold beverage, then you can calculate how long it would take that container to reach a temperature higher than 42 degrees, or whatever the threshold is for a "refreshing drink".

If you drink out of yetis or any highly insulated cups, these are worthless. However, if you drink out of water bottles or coffee cups these are quite valuable since those cups offer almost zero insulation properties - foam being the exception.

What would be interesting is to do a side by side with the hot cup holders and a grande Starbucks cup. With the temperate at time equals zero being 195 degrees and how long it will take for that to get to say 100 degrees. Since the heated cup holders will reduce the delta in temperature between the liquid and the ambient temperature, it will increase the time it takes the coffee to cool down. Of course, an adjustment would need to be made since some of the surface area of the cup will be exposed to ambient temperatures which will be lower than the heated cup holder.

That is my point on the verbiage used. It doesn't define how the user actually uses the tech. All it is actually doing is showing it working and the parameters it works within not what impact it has on the media in which it interacts with. You also won't be able to do simple math to the desired temp unless you know the heat soak of the product being cooled or warmed.

[natahoa]

Originally Posted by AndroidRobot

Since they came with one of the many packages with my car it's nice. I would add them as a standalone option because the cupholders have proven to be very useful both in the warmer and cooler months.


I tested them this morning for about 15min, peak low temp was 7.1C ~44.8F but I accidentally deleted the pics so I'll redo it and upload the pictures. The static temp was 35C ~ 95F

Good to know.
When I bought my BMW, I was mostly interested in luxury features. I don’t care about rims, the way the lights look, chrome or other trim, and to me all SUVs basically look alike.

So I was mightily tempted to get that package, but I didn’t want the other features, and we rarely take long trips.

This car is my experiment. I’ve never had any of these features in a car before, so it is all new to me!

In four years, when the warranty expires, I will buy the car of my dreams and hope to keep it long term. Might not be a BMW, but in four years more cars will have all the Gee-whiz features, and they will be better vetted.

It’s gonna big a bigger car tho. Love me a big car. Maybe not navigator big, but I’m awfully tempted.

[VTENGR]

Originally Posted by Tenac

That is my point on the verbiage used. It doesn't define how the user actually uses the tech. All it is actually doing is showing it working and the parameters it works within not what impact it has on the media in which it interacts with. You also won't be able to do simple math to the desired temp unless you know the heat soak of the product being cooled or warmed.

I think a fair assumption would to use the thermodynamic properties of water to determine this. Most things we drink are primarily water based. Unless you're trying to heat or cool a ingot of metal, water would be the safe bet.

[natahoa]

Originally Posted by omaralt

my wife has the cooled/heated cupholders in her gls and IMO they're useless because on roadtrips we always use yeti cups or steel coffee mugs. completely ineffective on those types of cups. now on a paper cup they might be useful

That is my feeling also. I won’t use styrofoam because it adds a fair amount of poison to whatever you are drinking. I could prob get a 12-volt microwave to re-heat drinks, and a 12-volt ice-maker to cool them down.

Then I could just live in the car full time. I hate to cook and kitchens are wasted on me.

[Tenac]

Originally Posted by VTENGR

I think a fair assumption would to use the thermodynamic properties of water to determine this. Most things we drink are primarily water based. Unless you're trying to heat or cool a ingot of metal, water would be the safe bet.

Totally agree with this as well. But then we have to add the cup material and I'd say most (just my thoughts here) use metal water containers anymore and less plastic. Paper cup is really only for your coffee so that limits the scope.

[VTENGR]

Originally Posted by Tenac

Totally agree with this as well. But then we have to add the cup material and I'd say most (just my thoughts here) use metal water containers anymore and less plastic. Paper cup is really only for your coffee so that limits the scope.

This is true - venturing down the rabbit hole - but even still, a stainless steel container that's not insulated has almost no insulation properties. Steel, generally speaking, conducts heat very well - hence the use for heat sinks - copper even better. Most metals will have a high conductive rate.

[AndroidRobot]

Originally Posted by Tenac

That is my point on the verbiage used. It doesn't define how the user actually uses the tech. All it is actually doing is showing it working and the parameters it works within not what impact it has on the media in which it interacts with. You also won't be able to do simple math to the desired temp unless you know the heat soak of the product being cooled or warmed.

I don't mind changing the title per your request, consider it done.

Originally Posted by natahoa

Good to know.
When I bought my BMW, I was mostly interested in luxury features. I don’t care about rims, the way the lights look, chrome or other trim, and to me all SUVs basically look alike.

So I was mightily tempted to get that package, but I didn’t want the other features, and we rarely take long trips.

This car is my experiment. I’ve never had any of these features in a car before, so it is all new to me!

In four years, when the warranty expires, I will buy the car of my dreams and hope to keep it long term. Might not be a BMW, but in four years more cars will have all the Gee-whiz features, and they will be better vetted.

It’s gonna big a bigger car tho. Love me a big car. Maybe not navigator big, but I’m awfully tempted.

Ideally I wouldn't be driving and SUV but it's a necessity due to where I live.

Originally Posted by VTENGR

This is true - venturing down the rabbit hole - but even still, a stainless steel container that's not insulated has almost no insulation properties. Steel, generally speaking, conducts heat very well - hence the use for heat sinks - copper even better. Most metals will have a high conductive rate.

I could test one and find out. I'm well versed in heat sinks seeing how I've built about 30 computers over the years with custom liquid cooling