[NorwegianBlue]

Ive always been a swap out the summer tires for the winter tires kind of fellow, and have long had a general disdain for all seasons as being ok at everything but not really good at anything.

With the advent of the all-weather tire category (possibly best represented by the Michelin CrossClimate 2) I'm beginning to rethink this strategy since these tires actually have decent snow grip without giving up performance elsewhere. I saw a review of the CrossClimates as part of a winter tire test and it placed mid-pack while way outperforming the winter tires in all other performance categories. And this is just one model on the market.

That said, size is going to be the big problem here and I'm not sure if any all-weather tires are going to be offered for larger wheels.

I've compromised with the wheels on my car -- I'm running 21" summers and 19" CrossClimates in the winter. I'm in an area with very little snow, but it can get very cold (we hit single digits for the better part of a week a couple of times). So I've got the all-weather rubber for the colder weather, plenty of snow traction for my needs, and it pretty much outperforms snow tires everywhere else -- especially noise.

If all-weathers became available for my 21" staggered wheels, I would be sorely tempted. I've put them on my Volvo wagon year round and no longer swap tires on it.

[puckybadger]

Originally Posted by jad03060

In my earlier years, I drove enough so I never had to worry about tires getting too old, but in the industry, they consider a 6-year old tire ready to be retired, regardless of the quantity of tread on it. So, beware, sometimes the tires you might see that have a good price, could be an older production date - it's always a good idea to check first. It's best to try to get fresh ones, regardless, and that might cost you a little more sometimes. Winter tires tend to get made starting in the spring for early fall delivery what with shipping times, in preparation for the upcoming season, and summer performance tires tend to be made in the winter...all-seasons tend to have their own dedicated lines and can be made all year. Those are generalizations, but the tire manufacturers realize for best results, they should try to be offering recent stock to their customers. Now, not all dealers are all that honorable...they want to get rid of their old stock.

Tire Racks policy is first in, first out.
A question on an insurance policy application for "garage" policies wants to know if you sell new tires over 3 years old.
All USDOT tires have a date stamp indicating week/year manufactured

[cptcolo]

Originally Posted by robbin58

All, I'm currently awaiting build/delivery of a X6 m60i with 747M wheels (tire sizes of 275/35R22 front, 315/30R22 rear). It is going to be delivered with performance non-run flat tires. I live in Michigan, where in certain years we can receive a considerable amount of snow. I'm going to need different tires in the snowy months, and I see two options: 1) All season all year around, or 2) Winter/Snow tires in the cold months alternated with Summer/Performance tires in the warm months. Does anyone have any thoughts on this, or know of a definitive advantage to one option over the other? Thanks.

Since you have the 22" wheels, there really aren't a lot of options. You can get the gold standard Michelin Pilot Sport 4S max performance summer tire and a winter tire. It must be said a summer tire will get almost no grip when it gets cold and there is snow / rain / ice. It looks like Pirelli makes the P Zero All Season for the 22", but it doesn't look to be reviewed that well... So if you are staying with the 22" wheels, going with a summer / winter set seems like the way to go.

I went through this same search when I got my car, and personally I just went with the 20" style 740M wheels. There are tons of options for the 20" wheels and they are a square so you can do a full tire rotation. The 20" wheels are generally cheaper and have more sidewall too which results in a better ride. The 22" do look cooler / more bling though.

[jad03060]

At least when I lived there decades ago, Germany built and maintained their roads quite well. Those built back before the war were built strong enough to act as emergency landing fields, so had substantial foundations, and partly for that reason, less prone to frost heaves and potholes. The US doesn't build their roads with the same basic philosophy, so they don't last as long, and to save some money, also don't maintain them to the same level of excellence. That may have changed, but is one reason why larger wheels can offer a decent ride there, where the state of our typical roads here may not - their roads tend to be smooth. It is also fairly common, and often required, that your tires must match the vehicle's capabilities and the weather conditions there. It would be unusual to see someone running around in the winter with summer performance tires on their vehicles.

Lots of the US never sees significant ice or snow on their roads, but a good portion of the country does see temperatures where summer performance tires will lose some significant capabilities over more suitable choices. IOW, most of Florida could probably operate just fine year-round with summer performance tires, but someplace like North Dakota could not along with many states in between.

[IS350]

I’m actually looking for all-seasons for the 21in staggered setup. A Tirerack rep suggested using the front sized tire: 275/40/21 on all 4 corners, anyone tried this, to have more tire options?

[MtgMaster]

Unless you drive in the snow (not snowing but in the snow) a decent amount during winter, I would Not get winter tires and go with all season. If you’re in an area where you could have warmer days (maybe 50 plus) the winter tires are mush and to me are unsafe. All seasons will get you home fine in light snow assuming you aren’t in a rural area and roads are plowed. For me, pushing your car a little too hard in the dry with winter tires which is easy to do is more dangerous than being careful getting home when it snows on all seasons.

[slicky]

Originally Posted by IS350

I’m actually looking for all-seasons for the 21in staggered setup. A Tirerack rep suggested using the front sized tire: 275/40/21 on all 4 corners, anyone tried this, to have more tire options?

Several issues with this. I assume that you want to use your OEM rear wheel. The 275 wide tire is out of spec for the 10.5" wheel.
The load index on a 275 tire is way under the OEM load index. The actual load carrying capacity of the tire may be ok, though. Need to compare the vehicle's weight on the door jamb with the load capacity of the tire. However, regardless how that math works out, no major tire retailer/installer is going to touch it. They will only look at the load index and are not going to be calculating the actual load rating. The 275 tire on a much too wide for it wheel will also look goofy.

[hufington]

Depends on where you will drive. I used to have Vredestein Quatrac Pro all seasons with severe snow service capability on my F15 and I was fine in deep and packed snow. But, I bought a house which has a long driveway and an incline of 11%. I could not go up or down that driveway with those snow service rated all seasons in my G05. Therefore, I switched to a dedicated set of winter tires and have absolutely no problems now.

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by slicky

Several issues with this. I assume that you want to use your OEM rear wheel. The 275 wide tire is out of spec for the 10.5" wheel.
The load index on a 275 tire is way under the OEM load index. The actual load carrying capacity of the tire may be ok, though. Need to compare the vehicle's weight on the door jamb with the load capacity of the tire. However, regardless how that math works out, no major tire retailer/installer is going to touch it. They will only look at the load index and are not going to be calculating the actual load rating. The 275 tire on a much too wide for it wheel will also look goofy.

Look aside, 275mm tire will absolutely fit 10.5” wheel. It is well within the fitment spec.

[slicky]

Originally Posted by eelnoraa

Look aside, 275mm tire will absolutely fit 10.5” wheel. It is well within the fitment spec.

You are right. I had it mixed up with some other option I was working out. Uncessesfully.
The load rating is still a potential issue. There is a lot less air in the 275 vs a 315 and therefore a lower load rating.

[IS350]

Originally Posted by slicky

You are right. I had it mixed up with some other option I was working out. Uncessesfully.
The load rating is still a potential issue. There is a lot less air in the 275 vs a 315 and therefore a lower load rating.

I appreciate your caution, I think the 275 is more than fine, with each tire being rated for around 2321 lbs, or, the rear axle capacity for both tires being 4643 lbs.

Have you heard of scenarios where the square setup posted other problems?

Originally Posted by hufington

Depends on where you will drive. I used to have Vredestein Quatrac Pro all seasons with severe snow service capability on my F15 and I was fine in deep and packed snow. But, I bought a house which has a long driveway and an incline of 11%. I could not go up or down that driveway with those snow service rated all seasons in my G05. Therefore, I switched to a dedicated set of winter tires and have absolutely no problems now.

Good to know, thanks. Has anyone else you know tackled your driveway successfully with anything but snow tires? I just wonder if something like the Michelin Cross Climate 2 may fend any better?

[jad03060]

I want to be able to get home if the weather turns funky, or out in an emergency, otherwise I tend to stay home, as I can. There's a huge difference between tires.

Your local conditions may suggest something other than the 'best' for winter use, but I look at it as insurance. Few people use all of the capabilities of their vehicle, but the tires chosen can make a big difference if you get into a nasty situation. Coming home one time, no snow, but encountered some black ice...a bunch of people off the road, I had no issues. Those that think their summer performance tires will get them through even a light dusting or a patch of black ice are deluding themselves.

[IS350]

I agree, good link, thanks.

[gofast182]

Originally Posted by eelnoraa

This is absolutely incorrect. The grip degrade, but it doesn't mean it isn't functional. You won't have the best lap time on track, but it works just fine at 45F for normal driving. We see 35F in winter evening and night all the time, and in my locations, we have no shortage of performance car with summer times, and no one here have a set of winter tires. I don't see car crashing in winters.

The important factor here is locations. Certain tire usage depend on the exact weather pattern, which is highly tight to location. In some area, when winter temp cross below 45F, it means temp will continue dropping for the winter, and maybe snow will come, then sure a separate set of winter to replace summer maybe prefer. But other locations, where winter temp fluctuant around 40-45F without snow with much higher day time temperature, such as in Central or South CA, let's not let the lawyer's talking get into reality

This is a myopic answer. Because others are driving on summer tires in cold weather and I don't see them crashing then it must be safe. That isn't right.

While it is possible to bring summer tires up to an acceptable operating temperature in *some* cold weather conditions, if you need to make an evasive maneuver or accelerate quickly before that happens (which can take a while depending on conditions), you, or other drivers, could be in real trouble.

At the end of the day it's a big, heavy X6 and if you feel you need summer tires to maximize performance, then you're probably ringing the wrong bell for what car to purchase.

Your post says you live in Detroit, so in a major metropolitan area I can't fathom that even after the worst storms roads aren't passable within 12-24h. Based on that I'd say all-seasons are the smart play and if you did feel the need for a second set then you'd add a set of dedicated winters. But summer tires on an X6, in Michigan, I just don't see a compelling reason.

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by gofast182

This is a myopic answer. Because others are doing it and I don't see them crashing on summer tires then it must be safe. That isn't right.

While it is possible to bring summer tires up to an acceptable operating temperature in *some* cold weather conditions, if you need to make an evasive maneuver or accelerate quickly before that happens, you, or other drivers, could be in real trouble.

....

Please don't take this out of context. The use of tires is highly location dependent. The blanket statement said if you drive under 40-45F your summer tire will not have grip or rubber will chip off, this is absolute incorrect. Just stating the reality. People who said this has very little experience with summer tires.

And I am speaking from my specific locations, where no one has winter tires. No only people don't buy, if you walk into a tire shop and want to buy a set, they will have to place order for you. I think this is true for majority of non mountain, central and south CA, where winter low can easily deep to 40F.

Having that said, I am not telling OP to use summer timer in Detroit for winter. I have never said that. If I live up on the Sierra mountain area, say Truckee, I will definitely have a set of winter tire.

[jad03060]

All rubber gets harder from the time it comes out of the mold. If you don't drive much, your rubber can get pretty hard as it ages before you wear it out, and cold makes it harder...in an emergency, even if your summer tires are new, if it is quite cold out, you could have problems. IF you encounter any snow or ice, you WILL have problems. The rubber composition of winter tires and the tread design do not provide optimum dry road handling, but they're not bad. Most people do not encounter the need for an emergency maneuver, but if they do, a summer tire in the cold may make the difference between avoiding the accident, or a much more severe situation. Except for a few years, I've lived where I felt winter tires were the prudent, but maybe a bit more expensive option. People that buy any vehicle with summer performance tires that do not have experience with them just may not realize that they can be a severe hazard in SOME conditions.

[IS350]

Originally Posted by IS350

I appreciate your caution, I think the 275 is more than fine, with each tire being rated for around 2321 lbs, or, the rear axle capacity for both tires being 4643 lbs.

Have you heard of scenarios where the square setup posted other problems?


Good to know, thanks. Has anyone else you know tackled your driveway successfully with anything but snow tires? I just wonder if something like the Michelin Cross Climate 2 may fend any better?

Btw, for anyone seeking more options, a 295/40/21 at the rear preserves the same 111 load rating.

[slicky]

Originally Posted by IS350

Btw, for anyone seeking more options, a 295/40/21 at the rear preserves the same 111 load rating.

That doesn't help if it doesn't allow the use the 275/40 front.
And you technically can't stretch a 295 on a 9.5" front wheel. You could if you wanted to go out of spec, I suppose.....Major retailers wouldn't install them though. And it may look a little weird......but given the lack of options, it could be something to consider. 295/40 all around.

[SplendidCamel]

I have the 22" performance Continental non-run flat tires and switch to 20" Michelin CrossClimate 2 non-run flat tires on BMW OEM wheels for the winter. I could drive on the CrossClimate 2's all year and be happy. The 22's are quieter and slightly more comfortable, which is odd given that they have less sidewall. The Michelins have more feel.

I like both tires. The CrossClimates are a big improvement for dry pavement driving over the performance winter tires that I had on a prior S4. There is really no need for a "performance winter" tire category now that CrossClimates have the triple peak and snowflake rating.

The CrossClimates really can be a year-round tire on the X5. Unfortunately, they don't come in the 22" size.

[IS350]

Originally Posted by slicky

That doesn't help if it doesn't allow the use the 275/40 front.
And you technically can't stretch a 295 on a 9.5" front wheel. You could if you wanted to go out of spec, I suppose.....Major retailers wouldn't install them though. And it may look a little weird......but given the lack of options, it could be something to consider. 295/40 all around.

I was going to leave stock 275/40/21 up front, 295 in the rear. If they aren’t to tall. TireRack found an installer who would also do 275/40/21 at all 4 corners, weight rating is 107 in the rear, slightly under the 111, but they say it’s still within allowable levels. This opens up many more tire options.

[JerZBMerLife]

I live in Jersey and used to have an Audi S4 with pirelli pzero summer tires. I drove on them year round and got about 13k miles over 3 years before I had to replace them. Never had traction problems in the winter but definitely tire pressure went down when super cold but trip to the pump took care of that. IMO all seasons are good enough. Good luck.

[mmm50i]

I live in BC, Canada. There's quite a bit of snow here, so winter tires are a must!

OP, considering you live in Michigan, I would opt for winter tires as well. Your safety is worth a few thousand dollars!