[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by E70X5M35i

That would be retarded. I don't buy it. If ASS saved 10%, or even 20% as some posts said above, in city driving, manufacturers would want to show that.

You also realize the car uses slightly more fuel every time the car starts, right? Now , it's probably not a WHOLE lot, but you multiply that times the hundreds of restarts you may have in stop and go traffic? I wouldn't count on it saving me a lot of fuel.

The last part is not correct. With warm engine, and by remembering the position of the cam, starting a engine should not use any more fuel. It is really just the continuation of before stop. A cold start or not knowing the cam phase, yes.

[tooloud10]

Originally Posted by eelnoraa

Reason I ask is even with 45e in sport mode, we do experience ASS.

My experience in the 45e is that if you just push the Sport button, ASS will still be active, but if you activate Sport mode by pushing the gear lever to the left, ASS will not shut the car off.

But ICE only shut off when the car comes to complete stop. And ICE kick on when foot lift from brake paddle. This kind of ASS in 45e isn't very smooth.

I've actually found the 45e ASS to be the smoothest that I've ever experienced, akin to someone lightly tapping the back of the driver's seat a single time. I doubt my passengers have ever even noticed that it happens.

[X3_Alaska]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

Keep changing your position, you will eventually get there. One leads to the other but the proliferation of ASS was due to increasing CAFE standards.

Exactly, while the gas savings with one vehicle is quite small, factored into hundreds of thousands of vehicles of the corporate fleet and it really adds up. I had ASS in my 2020 Ram and in my 22 X5 and it worked extremely well in both.

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

That makes sense plus as far as I am able to tell, Ford did not delete ASS in general when they were having supply chain issues. What they did do is offer the customers an option to have it deleted in return for a credit. If that is the case then they likely wouldn't have redone the EPA testing.

Edit: Looks like were basing our discussion on false info that was posted, the Monroney stickers were updated when a customer choose not to have ASS.

Attachment 3357139

https://fordauthority.com/2022/03/20...emoval-option/

Correct, they updated the stickers to reflect the change, and in a 5.0L V8, all it could impact for the EPA testing, was rounding error on a combinedileage cycle. it went from 18 to 19 by having ASS.

If saving fuel were the goal, they would be more effective by mandating that roof attachments must be removed unless in use. Or that vehicles had to lose 200 pounds in the next 5 years. Or set a maximum aero cd that decreases each year.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

Correct, they updated the stickers to reflect the change, and in a 5.0L V8, all it could impact for the EPA testing, was rounding error on a combinedileage cycle. it went from 18 to 19 by having ASS.

If saving fuel were the goal, they would be more effective by mandating that roof attachments must be removed unless in use. Or that vehicles had to lose 200 pounds in the next 5 years. Or set a maximum aero cd that decreases each year.

That is a 5.5% savings, right in line with what some other folks have noted.

I missed part that they were changed, that was my bad.

In general the government issues the standards and lets it up to the manufactures to decide how to achieve them. They decided quit start-stop was the way to get the most gain for the least effort. They of course are doing many other things to try and meet them. I would rather not have politicians and/or bureaucrats designing my vehicle.

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

That is a 5.5% savings, right in line with what some other folks have noted.

I missed part that they were changed, that was my bad.

In general the government issues the standards and lets it up to the manufactures to decide how to achieve them. They decided quit start-stop was the way to get the most gain for the least effort. They of course are doing many other things to try and meet them. I would rather not have politicians and/or bureaucrats designing my vehicle.

Well, it's AT MOST a 5.5% gain. The fact that it didn't affect the city number but did the combined one means it likely was rounded up to 19, and the ASS removal just tipped it under the threshold for rounding. But that's all semantics and fuzzy math now, lol.

I agree, I'd rather not have politicians and bureaucrats designing cars. Frankly I don't even want them setting standards. Let the market decide. Consumers overachingly want better fuel economy. Many people buy based solely on fuel economy in class. If someone came out with a massive class disruption in fuel economy, people would naturally gravitate towards buying that without the need for any government intervention.

My take, abolish CAFE and the carbon credit market, and get rid of everyone in government employed in that sector. The market will do a better job figuring it out than they will.

[cobramite]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

Well, it's AT MOST a 5.5% gain. The fact that it didn't affect the city number but did the combined one means it likely was rounded up to 19, and the ASS removal just tipped it under the threshold for rounding. But that's all semantics and fuzzy math now, lol.

I agree, I'd rather not have politicians and bureaucrats designing cars. Frankly I don't even want them setting standards. Let the market decide. Consumers overachingly want better fuel economy. Many people buy based solely on fuel economy in class. If someone came out with a massive class disruption in fuel economy, people would naturally gravitate towards buying that without the need for any government intervention.

My take, abolish CAFE and the carbon credit market, and get rid of everyone in government employed in that sector. The market will do a better job figuring it out than they will.

Excellent post and synopsis.
What does the government ever do better than the private sector?

[aaaaaaaaaz]

Originally Posted by cobramite

Excellent post and synopsis.
What does the government ever do better than the private sector?

Wasting money I suppose

[bloozemanAZ]

Originally Posted by X6ix GTA

On our 2022 mild hybrid, ASS is very seamless. That being said, the only time we notice it is when it's hot out there. At the traffic lights, engine turns off and the HVAC cooling is reduced. You do feel the cabin getting warmer for a couple of minutes, before the engine kicks in to maintain the cabin temperature. I didn't point it out but my wife picked on it and it annoys her. Luckily we don't get too many of those hot days over here.

At least on the wife's 2017 35i under ECO settings for when ASS kicked in I had it configured to not impact the AC as here in Phoenix during the summer that's a no go. She always drove it in ECO to get the best gas mileage out of it on her mostly highway commute to work/back. Have the same setting, i.e., control of the AC turned off on the LCI under ECO Pro Individual.

I'd have to say that during my testing also in ECO the ASS was nearly seamless. Plus, I learned how to avoid it all together when desired by inching forward at stop lights, etc. That said with her LCI 40i with the mild hybrid the ASS is definitely seamless but only if one starts moving during shutoff at a stop light. Otherwise if stuck at a stop light, ASS kicks in and the the engine kicks back on before the light changes there is a small shudder that never existed in the 35i.

In fact when I'm running on fumes in the M850i and making my 12 mile journey on surface streets to the closest Costco in ECO Pro the fire breathing N63 twin turbo V8 is more seamless if the engine turns back on while still stuck at a stop light than the LCI 40i.

[bloozemanAZ]

Originally Posted by Vinnrox250

OP, You nailed it on the head for me. I was ready to go with ordering an X5 M60 to add to the garage with my G80 M3 and my F150 limited. And it would be a send off to the dying V8. My biggest hold back was the lack of a a ASS button. On $100,000 car that’s a V8, no one cares about fuel economy, that is why I didn’t get one.

Agreed as with the N63 in my M850i (more nose bleed than $100K) vs the new S68 in a M60i it's about "smiles to the gallon" vs miles to the gallon. 👍

[AGONXF30]

Originally Posted by E70X5M35i

ASS is not for fuel economy. The amount of fuel you're saving is miniscule. ASS is related to lowering CO2 emissions.

ASS is absolutely related to fuel economy. The emission come from burning fuel. Basic chemistry. Also a car that has ASS enabled will get better city MPG that one with it turned off. I do not like the feature, but BMW gets its City MPG numbers with it on.

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by tooloud10

I've actually found the 45e ASS to be the smoothest that I've ever experienced, akin to someone lightly tapping the back of the driver's seat a single time. I doubt my passengers have ever even noticed that it happens.

Yes need to push shifter to left to prevent ASS kicking in. I often forgot to do that. 😅

I found hybrid electric to ice transition is very smooth, almost in noticeable. But sport mode ASS with 12V starter, it is ok. Not as good as hybrid transition.

[Scientifix]

Here’s a video that I watched today about start stop and it’s quite informative. Talks about all the key complications that the car manufacturers had to deal with for this feature!
https://youtu.be/TTBN8Ic57Gg?si=Qru7JCd4Cou_4hbO

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by Scientifix

Here’s a video that I watched today about start stop and it’s quite informative. Talks about all the key complications that the car manufacturers had to deal with for this feature!
https://youtu.be/TTBN8Ic57Gg?si=Qru7JCd4Cou_4hbO

Wow very good info, I also watch a few other video from him. He is good, very knowledgeable

[RNorb]

Originally Posted by Scientifix

Here’s a video that I watched today about start stop and it’s quite informative. Talks about all the key complications that the car manufacturers had to deal with for this feature!
https://youtu.be/TTBN8Ic57Gg?si=Qru7JCd4Cou_4hbO

Very interesting for sure. Seems like there is a lot of opportunity to alter just one of the many required sensors to permanently disable the ASS, if one were so inclined.

[BlkGS]

Food for thought. I couldn't find when X5 added auto start stop for sure, so I looked at start buttons online.

The last X5 incould see without auto start stop was from 2013. The xdrive 50i for that year was rated at 14/20 city/highway. A 2015 50i had auto start stop and was rated at 15/22. The casual observer would say "it went up by 1 adding auto start stop!", which is potentially true. But more importantly, it went up by 2 highway, which indicates there was engine improvements.that mad ethe whole engine more efficient.

[cobramite]

Is anyone really gullable enough to honestly believe that this ASS stuff increases fuel mileage by 15%, 20%, 26%, as some of the "studies" refered to here are claiming.
You can set up a "study" to yield the results that you desire. Big Pharma wrote the book on that chicanery.
Always be leary of claims that start with: "Studies show" or "Experts will tell you".

[FLYZ]

Originally Posted by E70X5M35i

Exactly. ASS is a joke when it comes to fuel economy. That's not the main purpose -- it's main purposes was to fall under the EPA mandated CO2 emissions.



That would be retarded. I don't buy it. If ASS saved 10%, or even 20% as some posts said above, in city driving, manufacturers would want to show that.

You also realize the car uses slightly more fuel every time the car starts, right? Now , it's probably not a WHOLE lot, but you multiply that times the hundreds of restarts you may have in stop and go traffic? I wouldn't count on it saving me a lot of fuel.

Dude, who uses the R-word anymore? Have you been living under a rock since the '90s? Leave that back with the carburetors.

[edikam]

Originally Posted by tbolts1010

Wanted to give a quick run down of my short 5 months of ownership of a 2024 X5 M60i. Ultimately I sold it this weekend and I have to say I don't regret it at all. I bought it thinking it would be a great blend of performance and practicality, but at the end of the day there were far too many annoyances to make me really love the car.

The good: I loved the looks, the comfort, the power (mine was tuned) and the overall handling (other than lift off over-steer which was a bit unnerving)

The bad: To make a long story short, the complete lack of exhaust note was disappointing, the Idrive system was confusing and difficult to use (for me) and the start/stop system drove me nuts. The ventilated seats were also stupid (I live in FL) and for a relatively large SUV, there's absolutely nowhere to put anything other than in the cup holder. The brakes also warped and shuddered badly with only 3k miles on it. I bought the car thinking it would be my send off to the V8, but it didn't really feel like a car with a V8. If I were to do it again, i'd get a regular 40i and modify it.

In the end, it was less about me not liking the X5 and more about me not being able to justify having a 100k dollar car that I didn't truly love. I was hoping it would make me feel like my 07 335i did back in the day and it just didn't do it for me. Not trying to offend anyone, just truly wanted to share my feedback! I still love BMWs and the brand.

Welcome any comments/questions!

Hey, you sold it, then get out of this group. Who needs your comments, go to the Tesla group.

[X6ix GTA]

Originally Posted by edikam

Hey, you sold it, then get out of this group. Who needs your comments, go to the Tesla group.

Open minded folks appreciate different viewpoints. This forum isn't restricted to fanboys.

[Mattl0806]

Originally Posted by edikam

Hey, you sold it, then get out of this group. Who needs your comments, go to the Tesla group.

Ridiculous- I think we’d all prefer that you leave.

[edikam]

Originally Posted by Mattl0806

Ridiculous- I think we’d all prefer that you leave.

I am in the group because I have 2024 X5, and you are in the wrong group. There is a group for people with X3 (you). Why do people with Tesla, and Ford participate in these groups, or people who can not read and stick in the wrong group, like you Mattle0101