[NittanyG05]

I wanted to post this because I know the topic and question comes up often.

I recently (this weekend) had a warranty issue using Bimmercode with my dealer. I have a X5 M50i.

I brought the car in for two main issues. 1) It was losing power when I would floor it. 2) The Nav system always thinks I'm three blocks away from where I really am.

When I brought the car in the dealer scanned it and found error codes due to Bimmercode changes. They also found an oil leak coming from the high pressure pump and the oil was flowing into the injectors.

Because they found the Bimmercode changes they would not move forward with anything until I paid to have the computer reverted back to the factory settings (not covered by warranty).

Now I do not think for a second that Bimmercode caused any of the issues the car had. But the dealer did "blame" the issues on the coding.

Just wanted everyone to know before you bring your car in for service.

[LDT]

That's always the risk when coding/flashing/tuning a car. Even out of spec wheels can cause warranty problems

[rmorin1249]

Originally Posted by NittanyG05

I wanted to post this because I know the topic and question comes up often.

I recently (this weekend) had a warranty issue using Bimmercode with my dealer. I have a X5 M50i.

I brought the car in for two main issues. 1) It was losing power when I would floor it. 2) The Nav system always thinks I'm three blocks away from where I really am.

When I brought the car in the dealer scanned it and found error codes due to Bimmercode changes. They also found an oil leak coming from the high pressure pump and the oil was flowing into the injectors.

Because they found the Bimmercode changes they would not move forward with anything until I paid to have the computer reverted back to the factory settings (not covered by warranty).

Now I do not think for a second that Bimmercode caused any of the issues the car had. But the dealer did "blame" the issues on the coding.

Just wanted everyone to know before you bring your car in for service.

Did you use "expert mode" to code some of the options?

[denaliman]

Your dealer is a Dick. How did they know it was bimmercode.

[S68 X5MC]

You guys really need to read up on flash counters and how the dealer can always see if the car ECU has been changed no matter if you switch a tune back to stock or anything with the computer. It'll usually be the thing a dealer blames and also void a warranty. It was the same thing with Audi other manufacturers.

[Sleeper]

Originally Posted by TheMadVeteran

You guys really need to read up on flash counters and how the dealer can always see if the car ECU has been changed no matter if you switch a tune back to stock or anything with the computer. It'll usually be the thing a dealer blames and also void a warranty. It was the same thing with Audi other manufacturers.

Coding behaviour changes to existing equipment/accessories (already present in the vehicle programming) is vastly different from bench and/or OBDII flashing your DME. Changing the chimes’ tone or how your lights behave is a touch different that impacting longevity of the engine where you’re recalibrating boost pressure, ign advance, AFR’s etc. I think you’d do well to understand the differences.

Asking for $200 to wipe coding changes back to factory spec before fixing a warrantable oil leak is a complete joke. I can guarantee you that his Rolls Royce chimes and turned off seat belt reminder didn’t cause the HP oil pump to go.

This dealership or Service person is definitely not the norm.

[S68 X5MC]

Originally Posted by Sleeper

Coding behaviour changes to existing equipment/accessories (already present in the vehicle programming) is vastly different from bench and/or OBDII flashing your DME. Changing the chimes’ tone or how your lights behave is a touch different that impacting longevity of the engine where you’re recalibrating boost pressure, ign advance, AFR’s etc. I think you’d do well to understand the differences.

Asking for $200 to wipe coding changes back to factory spec before fixing a warrantable oil leak is a complete joke. I can guarantee you that his Rolls Royce chimes and turned off seat belt reminder didn’t cause the HP oil pump to go.

This dealership or Service person is definitely not the norm.

Oh for sure, I might have typed that out a little off but the actual flashing is what I meant for warranty issues.

The dealer was a douche though. No way the normal coding did anyhing. I did that to every Audi I had and the dealer never once said anything throughout 13 years I owned Audi's.

[Sleeper]

Originally Posted by TheMadVeteran

Oh for sure, I might have typed that out a little off but the actual flashing is what I meant for warranty issues.

The dealer was a douche though. No way the normal coding did anyhing. I did that to every Audi I had and the dealer never once said anything throughout 13 years I owned Audi's.

Ah yeah, 100%. DME flashing and transmission flashing is definitely pay-to-play. The ‘play’ part is so rewarding though given how much juice can be unlocked in these engines, but it’s not fun or cheap if something goes sideways.

[S68 X5MC]

Originally Posted by Sleeper

Ah yeah, 100%. DME flashing and transmission flashing is definitely pay-to-play. The ‘play’ part is so rewarding though given how much juice can be unlocked in these engines, but it’s not fun or cheap if something goes sideways.

Yep, I usually would wait until my warranty was up and go all out. lol

[Qsilver7]

What would happen if the OP used his backup coding files to return everything back to normal? Would the dealership then proceed without raping him to erase all of his coding?

The takeaway I got was...get the sister app (Bimmerlink) so that you can check for any errors and clear them...especially any that came from using the Bimmercode app. If the errors had been cleared...would the dealership have had an issue if they didn't find any errors?

The instructions for retrieving and using the backups is right on their website. They explain how to retrieve for both IOS & Android:

[hkleyman]

That’s ridiculous. My dealership even encouraged coding for minor feature changes / lights / sounds etc. Of course the DME ECU is off limits.

[cellarrat]

I have no personal experience with bimmercode and BMW warranty but is it really a surprise that BMW took the opportunity to deny doing free work or to require payment for work that isn't covered by the warranty?

I have not read the warranty coverage documents (unsurprisingly, the dealer never highlights the details of the coverage; it was almost impossible to get the legal documentation for the extended warranty when they were trying to sell me), but BMW wrote the documentation for one reason only: to protect themselves. I would be shocked if this dealer behavior was not 100% consistent with what they promised to do in such circumstances.

Maybe the norm is for dealers to do free work they are not obliged to do (I would be surprised but as I said I have no experience w/bimmercode) but the behavior described in the OP is precisely what I would have expected, even if there is no way in hell the changes actually caused the problems experienced

[Jlewisinsyr]

By law they cannot just deny warranty service for modifications unless they can prove the modifications cause the failure.

[cellarrat]

Originally Posted by Jlewisinsyr

By law they cannot just deny warranty service for modifications unless they can prove the modifications cause the failure.

Which law would this be?

[Jlewisinsyr]

Originally Posted by cellarrat

Which law would this be?

Magnuson Moss Warranty Act

[COKen]

Originally Posted by cellarrat

Which law would this be?

The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act.

[cellarrat]

Originally Posted by Jlewisinsyr

Magnuson Moss Warranty Act

Magnuson Moss absolutely would require that BMW honor the warranty promises it has made. It does not require any specific warranty terms. It does not even require a warranty at all.

So the Act is of no help if BMW provides that the warranty is voided by aftermarket meddling by consumers, as I suspect it does. Speculation, of course, because it is almost impossible to find the specific terms of the warranty coverage, but BMW wrote the warranty to protect itself. I doubt seriously if BMW put the causation onus on itself.

[Jlewisinsyr]

Originally Posted by cellarrat

Magnuson Moss absolutely would require that BMW honor the warranty promises it has made. It does not require any specific warranty terms. It does not even require a warranty at all.

So the Act is of no help if BMW provides that the warranty is voided by aftermarket meddling by consumers, as I suspect it does. Speculation, of course, because it is almost impossible to find the specific terms of the warranty coverage, but BMW wrote the warranty to protect itself. I doubt seriously if BMW put the causation onus on itself.

The law also restricts warranty companies from blanket exclusions for modifications and case law supports this time and time again.

Basically, if there is an oil leak but modifications had no direct implication to say the engine or transmission, then they cannot arbitrarily deny the warranty.

My statement still stands.

[cellarrat]

Not my field, and I haven't done any research, but I am pretty sure the only things that can't be disclaimed under the MMA are the warranties of fitness for particular purpose and merchantability, which deal exclusively with the product as built, not as modified. The scope of any other promises made would be defined by state contract law; MMA just regulates the specificity of disclosure (and provides a cause of action in federal court for breach).

But I am not holding myself out as an expert here. I would just be very cautious before I threw around MMA as a basis for requiring the dealer to un-do or re-do software that had been intentionally modified by the purchaser.

[weinerbarn]

Originally Posted by cellarrat

I have no personal experience with bimmercode and BMW warranty but is it really a surprise that BMW took the opportunity to deny doing free work or to require payment for work that isn't covered by the warranty?

I have not read the warranty coverage documents (unsurprisingly, the dealer never highlights the details of the coverage; it was almost impossible to get the legal documentation for the extended warranty when they were trying to sell me), but BMW wrote the documentation for one reason only: to protect themselves. I would be shocked if this dealer behavior was not 100% consistent with what they promised to do in such circumstances.

Maybe the norm is for dealers to do free work they are not obliged to do (I would be surprised but as I said I have no experience w/bimmercode) but the behavior described in the OP is precisely what I would have expected, even if there is no way in hell the changes actually caused the problems experienced

I had my 540i in for warranty work recently and it also had errors related to coding (ASS, mirror tilt, etc) but they didn't even say a word about it. Just ordered the parts, fixed and even gave me a loaner. OP's dealer was just being a dick and I'd find another right after I explained to the service manager why they'd never get another dime from me.

[cellarrat]

Originally Posted by weinerbarn

I had my 540i in for warranty work recently and it also had errors related to coding (ASS, mirror tilt, etc) but they didn't even say a word about it. Just ordered the parts, fixed and even gave me a loaner. OP's dealer was just being a dick and I'd find another right after I explained to the service manager why they'd never get another dime from me.

Perfectly reasonable response

[COKen]

Originally Posted by cellarrat

Not my field, and I haven't done any research, but I am pretty sure the only things that can't be disclaimed under the MMA are the warranties of fitness for particular purpose and merchantability, which deal exclusively with the product as built, not as modified. The scope of any other promises made would be defined by state contract law; MMA just regulates the specificity of disclosure (and provides a cause of action in federal court for breach).

But I am not holding myself out as an expert here. I would just be very cautious before I threw around MMA as a basis for requiring the dealer to un-do or re-do software that had been intentionally modified by the purchaser.

The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act says the dealer can't refuse to fix something on your car/truck unless they can prove the change you made caused the issue. For example, they can't refuse to fix an engine warranty item just because you turned of ASS.