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      10-25-2021, 12:20 AM   #1
GS2019
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Potential EV Tax credit up to $12,500 in 2022 -WoW

Hey, have you guys heard of some proposals on potential EV Tax credit up to $12500.

https://www.greencarreports.com/news...rsions-compare

Any thoughts?
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      10-25-2021, 12:54 AM   #2
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I couldn't agree more with this statement from the comment section:

"If the idea is to encourage EV sales then I don't think there should be so many conditions and limitations. Apply the incentive at time of purchase as a discount off of the sales price."

Putting a cap price just limits your options and I doubt people (specially car enthusiasts) would buy an undesirable car just to save ~10K. I'm sure if the $7,500 tax credit wasn't available, more people would chose the 40i instead of the 45e.

Also if people bought more EVs from the VW group (Taycan, E-Tron and ID4), the more reason VW has to invest in Electrify America.
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      10-25-2021, 08:07 AM   #3
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I think they're trying to push to get that passed. If so, additional $5k for next year buyers, if 45e will quality full $12.5k tax credit. Not bad at all.
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      10-25-2021, 09:01 AM   #4
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ridiculous but I'll take the tax credit
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      10-25-2021, 09:06 AM   #5
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The article is a month old and refers to a bill that no longer exists.

I'll take the money and run if it is available (I doubt it will be) but it makes little sense to me to encourage EVs/PHEVs this way -- by giving discounts to people in my tax bracket. Better to spend federal money on improving charging infrastructure than making very expensive vehicles less expensive for the well to do.
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      10-25-2021, 11:02 AM   #6
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The climate bill won't pass in current form because of Manchin whose wealth is based on coal, so we'll have to see what gets cut.

X5 owners could get the extra incentive for being US made, but won't get the Union incentive. Neither would Tesla, Honda, Toyota, etc.. It's really crafted to benefit US automakers.

IMO, the $80k hard cap outweighs these new incentives. In 2030, that $80k will actually be $61k in present terms, which will disqualify a ton of SUVs or performance vehicles, which are the vehicles that need hybrid or EV versions the most. That $80k cutoff will include options, which hurts luxury brands more.
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      10-28-2021, 03:25 PM   #7
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Looks like both restrictions on the additional EV rebate stayed. But at least the X5 would qualify for the made in America restriction, but I assume no BMW would qualify for the Union restriction.

No mention of the $80k or smaller MSRP caps yet...maybe those were cut?

Quote:
On Thursday, the White House announced dollar figures and initiatives included in a package that "can pass both houses of Congress," it said. Specifically for the EV tax credits, the long-floated $12,500 for purchasing an electric vehicle is included as part of $555 billion earmarked to combat climate change. According to the White House, eligible EVs will need to be made in the US with union labor to qualify for the full $12,500 credit.

Existing requirements for this boost from the current $7,500 credit for qualifying EVs breaks down in a few ways: The base credit is still $7,500, but an additional $2,500 comes into play if an automaker builds the EV in America. The government would green light the remaining $2,500 if the car in question comes from a factory with a union workforce.
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/e...d-back-better/
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      10-28-2021, 03:33 PM   #8
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Many people looking at an X5 will like the federal tax credit, but not all of them would qualify if they're stretching a bit...to have another $5K in tax credits means paying an additional $5K in taxes, then throw in AMT...having to wait for it for maybe close to a year can put some off, too, so I agree, taking the discount at the time of purchase is better, but would only really work if it was a rebate, not a credit, as the place of purchase just isn't or shouldn't be privy to your income tax paperwork, and the federal government isn't responsive enough to get that money to the dealership where they'd care to participate.
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      10-28-2021, 04:50 PM   #9
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Just keeping my fingers crossed they don't implement the $69k cap for SUVs. That would sink my X5 plans for sure.
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      10-28-2021, 05:16 PM   #10
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Wow.. this is awesome news.. any idea/guesses when they'll go into effective?

Quote:
Originally Posted by taek View Post
Looks like both restrictions on the additional EV rebate stayed. But at least the X5 would qualify for the made in America restriction, but I assume no BMW would qualify for the Union restriction.

No mention of the $80k or smaller MSRP caps yet...maybe those were cut?


https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/e...d-back-better/
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      10-28-2021, 05:24 PM   #11
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This whole thing may be wishful thinking, as it appears no Republican wants to vote for it. Manchin last year got nearly $500K from his stocks in coal, so isn't helping the Democrats, and they need every Democrat in the Senate to vote for it.

Call your Congressional delegation if you want this and let they know your feelings.
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      10-28-2021, 05:31 PM   #12
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The asshats won't get anything passed. And seriously - tax breaks for people who spend $70K-$80K on a car? That's the priority?
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      10-28-2021, 06:51 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ToddMac View Post
The asshats won't get anything passed. And seriously - tax breaks for people who spend $70K-$80K on a car? That's the priority?
The priority is getting more EVs on the road. Doesn't matter if it's a 40k or 80k car, it has the same impact on the climate.

I guess technically the more expensive ICE cars tend to also be the worst on gas mileage, so anything you can do to get those drivers into an EV is a good thing.

I know for me, if the X5 45e gets disqualified through an MSRP cap, I will likely not be driving electric any time soon.
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      10-28-2021, 07:08 PM   #14
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Pass a bill .... every car not manufactured in the USA gets a 10K tax. At the moment I don't think many cars qualify.
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      10-28-2021, 07:32 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XGoober View Post
The priority is getting more EVs on the road. Doesn't matter if it's a 40k or 80k car, it has the same impact on the climate.

I guess technically the more expensive ICE cars tend to also be the worst on gas mileage, so anything you can do to get those drivers into an EV is a good thing.

I know for me, if the X5 45e gets disqualified through an MSRP cap, I will likely not be driving electric any time soon.
My point is we don't need the tax break. The jerkoffs in Congress (all of them) are focused on the wrong things. You want to increase EV usage - give people making less than $60K ten grand off a Chevy volt (2 benefits) not the person making $150K-$200K that buys the Tesla or X5 45e.
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      10-28-2021, 07:42 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aimster82 View Post
Pass a bill .... every car not manufactured in the USA gets a 10K tax. At the moment I don't think many cars qualify.
BMW X5 is manufactured in the USA right? How about the full $12,500?
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      10-28-2021, 07:42 PM   #17
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Pretty silly to put a price cap on it.

There are zero cars I would consider buying that get good mpg. The most fuel efficient car I've owned in a decade was a Corvette (which, tbf, was pretty impressive). There are very few "nice" cars that get good mpg. They are generally bigger, heavier and have more powerful engines.

You're also not convincing me to buy a "cheap" car when I want and can afford a nice car.


So you're basically only converting people who were the most likely to get fuel efficient vehicles into electric. It's government, so sounds about right.
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      10-28-2021, 07:43 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ToddMac View Post
My point is we don't need the tax break. The jerkoffs in Congress (all of them) are focused on the wrong things. You want to increase EV usage - give people making less than $60K ten grand off a Chevy volt (2 benefits) not the person making $150K-$200K that buys the Tesla or X5 45e.
Great point Todd
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      10-28-2021, 08:07 PM   #19
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Probably not apropos on an X5 forum, but there are a lot of people that cannot afford an X5, regardless of how much of a tax credit or even a rebate they may get...they also tend to drive an older, usually less efficient vehicle, that may not see the best maintenance, so getting those vehicles off of the road will likely do more than giving someone that can afford an X5 regardless makes good sense to me...putting a cap on the benefits may just end up meaning those people may still buy it because they want it, and can afford it.

If I decide I can't afford something right now, I make plans and get it later if it's important to me...some wage earners may never be able to afford an X5, at least a new one. To them, a big price cut could get their old vehicle off the road IF it was a rebate versus a tax credit. Putting a cap on the value also means more of the allocated money tends to go to those that need it most. Might look like socialism, but that aspect doesn't really bother me. What bothers me is a CEO earning 100-1000x more than his workers, and have a golden parachute worth millions, when the workers may never earn that in their entire career. Nobody is worth 1000x more than the worker under him IMHO.

Last edited by jad03060; 10-28-2021 at 08:12 PM..
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      10-29-2021, 09:40 AM   #20
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Since we're all complaining about the current EV incentive structure, the biggest problem isn't the amount or tax rebate it's the fact that you get nothing if you lease a vehicle, which is becoming more & more popular and also appeals to those more on a budget.

Leasing affects the most cars because leasers get new cars every 3 years, you would want those to be EVs. But if you lease an EV you get nothing from the govt. It all goes to the captive finance, like BMWFS.

Something like 77% of new BMWs are leased? That's a huge chunk of drivers to ignore. People on the fence about going EV are also more likely to lease so they can try it out for a few years before committing to the full price of a vehicle long term.

But in reality they're just trying to get anything passed here. Overhauling the EV incentives to be better is probably out of scope.
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      10-29-2021, 09:46 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taek View Post
Since we're all complaining about the current EV incentive structure, the biggest problem isn't the amount or tax rebate it's the fact that you get nothing if you lease a vehicle, which is becoming more & more popular and also appeals to those more on a budget.

Leasing affects the most cars because leasers get new cars every 3 years, you would want those to be EVs. But if you lease an EV you get nothing from the govt. It all goes to the captive finance, like BMWFS.

Something like 77% of new BMWs are leased? That's a huge chunk of drivers to ignore. People on the fence about going EV are also more likely to lease so they can try it out for a few years before committing to the full price of a vehicle long term.

But in reality they're just trying to get anything passed here. Overhauling the EV incentives to be better is probably out of scope.
From my experience they will give you the tax credit as a discount. The dealers will see this and try to take advantage and give you little to nothing off MSRP by stating "You are already getting $12,500 off".
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      10-29-2021, 09:57 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ToddMac View Post
The asshats won't get anything passed. And seriously - tax breaks for people who spend $70K-$80K on a car? That's the priority?
I got $6700 tax credit on my $115k Cayenne E Hybrid, it wasn't necessary, but it was nice. With the 5% off MSRP and the tax credit, brought the cost down to just above $100k. Why do you care if people want to take advantage of it?
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