BMW X5
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      04-29-2019, 03:22 PM   #155
TurtleBoy
General
TurtleBoy's Avatar
12884
Rep
19,396
Posts

Drives: 2019 X5 40i,2021 M340i
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Colorado

iTrader: (0)

Given that it is a known issue in regards to bad cameras and the driver assistance reduced message it is amazing they didn’t replace that. If you still have that message ask them to replace it. You may also want to contact BMWNA and make sure they are aware of your situation as well as look into/start the lemon law process.

Edit: You posted while I was, glad to see you are in touch with corporate.
Appreciate 0
      04-29-2019, 03:33 PM   #156
gpitts
Captain
gpitts's Avatar
247
Rep
684
Posts

Drives: 2023 G07 X7 40i
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Portland, OR

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by LexxM3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by gpitts View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by EJELITE View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by LexxM3 View Post
Just for the record, comments to me did indicate the information was for a steering stability issue that occurs below -15C, not just "cold". I had failed to mention that as it did not occur to me it might be an issue differentiator, but time will tell.

Any chance your software update is prototype?
I'll ask if the update is prototype if/when I hear from them today. The steering issue is noticeably worse the colder the temps, but my steering starts acting up right around 0C if its left outside for a few hours. My guess is the 'fix' should certainly encompass anything warmer than -15C if it corrects anything below that temperature.
There's no concept of "prototype firmware". I can't imagine BMW putting anything short of a production candidate firmware update in a production vehicle. To do otherwise would be foolish at best.

Clearly their validation failed to uncover this issue, which is indeed a significant one that increases the risk of driving the vehicle in the very conditions that we bought it for to begin with!
I don't disagree. It may be a "production candidate" rather than "prototype", but neither would (or should ever be) treated as "production quality". Even if a "production candidate" ends up being released as "production" with zero changes, until the process reaches the "production quality" metrics, it is by definition not at production quality.

I am now getting "confirmation" that what is "suddenly" available now is a pre-production of the "late July 2019" update for this issue. In "quotes" because ... who the heck really knows except BMW corporate.

An initial indication of "late July"
release of this safety-critical update versus the now sudden current availability is disconcerting to say the least. It points to invalid info in the entire story as it doesn't make coherent sense per @gpitts comments.
You're right - only Corporate knows the timing and the real story.

I only raised the "production candidate" possibility because I've worked in the world of firmware for more years than I care to admit, and on a few occasions I've approved limited release of firmware that was technically production candidate status. In those cases, the code was simply awaiting higher-level sign off to promote the same 1s and 0s to production status, and that approver was away due to travel, vacation, etc. Exceptions like that can happen, but they're rare for sure.
__________________
2019 G05 X5 40i, Phytonic Blue, Black Extended Merino Leather Interior
Appreciate 0
      04-29-2019, 06:37 PM   #157
LexxM3
Colonel
LexxM3's Avatar
Canada
1698
Rep
2,609
Posts

Drives: E46M3, G05X5
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Waterloo, Canada

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2019 X5  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by gpitts View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by LexxM3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by gpitts View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by EJELITE View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by LexxM3 View Post
Just for the record, comments to me did indicate the information was for a steering stability issue that occurs below -15C, not just "cold". I had failed to mention that as it did not occur to me it might be an issue differentiator, but time will tell.

Any chance your software update is prototype?
I'll ask if the update is prototype if/when I hear from them today. The steering issue is noticeably worse the colder the temps, but my steering starts acting up right around 0C if its left outside for a few hours. My guess is the 'fix' should certainly encompass anything warmer than -15C if it corrects anything below that temperature.
There's no concept of "prototype firmware". I can't imagine BMW putting anything short of a production candidate firmware update in a production vehicle. To do otherwise would be foolish at best.

Clearly their validation failed to uncover this issue, which is indeed a significant one that increases the risk of driving the vehicle in the very conditions that we bought it for to begin with!
I don't disagree. It may be a "production candidate" rather than "prototype", but neither would (or should ever be) treated as "production quality". Even if a "production candidate" ends up being released as "production" with zero changes, until the process reaches the "production quality" metrics, it is by definition not at production quality.

I am now getting "confirmation" that what is "suddenly" available now is a pre-production of the "late July 2019" update for this issue. In "quotes" because ... who the heck really knows except BMW corporate.

An initial indication of "late July"
release of this safety-critical update versus the now sudden current availability is disconcerting to say the least. It points to invalid info in the entire story as it doesn't make coherent sense per @gpitts comments.
You're right - only Corporate knows the timing and the real story.

I only raised the "production candidate" possibility because I've worked in the world of firmware for more years than I care to admit, and on a few occasions I've approved limited release of firmware that was technically production candidate status. In those cases, the code was simply awaiting higher-level sign off to promote the same 1s and 0s to production status, and that approver was away due to travel, vacation, etc. Exceptions like that can happen, but they're rare for sure.
Well, updated info/explanations seems to reliably match gpitts thoughts. The version being installed now on a case-by-case basis is, in fact, the same as is scheduled for general global release in late July 2019. This is the formal fix to the cold steering feedback issues, and not just at -15C and below, but over temperatures overall. The reason for the time gap is, again in line with gpitts comments, due to final global sign offs by a whole lot of parties, mostly internal to BMW but also external. I misclassified the situation by calling it prototype firmware. This "pre-release/early installation of production software" is available when needed to "help a customer", but is not entirely routine.

A couple of side comments: I was in the middle of the S54 engine self-destruction fiasco during the first couple of years of E46M3 production. BMW was highly non-transparent about the defect and while they clearly found and fixed the root cause a couple of years later and did extend engine warranty to 6 years to compensate, they never admitted to any issue. At the time, the same party I am having discussions with right now about G05X5 couldn't get any straight answers out of BMW; nor could any other mere mortal. This time around, BMW seems to be supporting their ecosystem and is being strangely more transparent. You still have to ask and you do have to ask a bit forcefully, but there IS info available. I don't know if it's random or pattern, but I like it and hope it does become a pattern of transparency.

PS: gpitts, I am also an engineer and know exactly what you've been describing.
__________________
G05 X5 x40i (04/2019 mfg, Canada) on S18A-19-11-540
Appreciate 2
      04-29-2019, 07:24 PM   #158
LexxM3
Colonel
LexxM3's Avatar
Canada
1698
Rep
2,609
Posts

Drives: E46M3, G05X5
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Waterloo, Canada

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2019 X5  [0.00]
Oh, one more thing: the reason given for why the update is being made available early is that it is a direct result of escalated cases in all markets. So this thread, the discussions with dealers, regulatory agency reports, etc. are clearly significant contributors to the approach that BMW is taking. Customer power :-).
__________________
G05 X5 x40i (04/2019 mfg, Canada) on S18A-19-11-540
Appreciate 1
gpitts247.00
      04-30-2019, 10:18 AM   #159
foodiewithacorgi
New Member
United_States
32
Rep
24
Posts

Drives: 19' X5 40i; 18' X3m40i
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: VA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by EJELITE View Post
No compensation Stinkyxy - I don't believe anyone with this issue has gotten any sort of compensation. BMW wanted to downplay the problem as much as possible from my experience.

I'm in Calgary LexxM3 - If I actually get the vehicle back tomorrow, it will be perfect testing conditions as to whether its actually fixed or not since we're forecast for sub zero temps and 10-15cm of snow on Saturday

Loaner was an X3 FreddyBMW
BMW NA tried to get me to sign a general release with compensation. But I refused. I would say, keep calling BMW client relations, if you're interested in being compensated. That's what I did.
Appreciate 0
      04-30-2019, 11:50 AM   #160
Augy56
Registered
United_States
0
Rep
2
Posts

Drives: BMW X5
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Central Iowa

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TurtleBoy View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Augy56 View Post
Same problem with two new X5s delivered to me and my wife over the last couple of weeks. I would describe our experience as overly aggressive “active intervention” with the lane departure system. For example, if I drift close to a line on my left, the assist will activate, overcorrect (oversteer), kicking me toward the right side of my lane. In a split second I reach the right line, the system activates again, and kicks me back to the left. My wife feels unsafe. She unchecked the active intervention option in the lane departure menu. I spent $1,700 on this feature expecting a gentle nudge from the system back to the center of my lane relieving some of the fatigue of long drives. Instead we are experiencing a dangerous situations!
Sounds like you may be confusing the Steering Intervention for the lane keeping with the Driver Assistance Package. Are you sure you are engaging cruise with lane control and not just relying on the lane keeping? It should be very smooth and keep you centered quite well. If it doesn't there is a problem and you should take it in for service.
Thank you TurtleBoy! I was confusing lane departure intervention with adaptive cruise. We still feel the ping pong effect other posts have described. Looking forward to a good software update.
Appreciate 0
      08-13-2019, 09:55 AM   #161
2skivt
Registered
0
Rep
3
Posts

Drives: 2015 Audi A8L 4.0
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: New York

iTrader: (0)

Cold Temp Steering Issue ?

Has the cold temperature steering issue been resolved ?
If so what was the fix ?
Can anybody point me in the direction any technical backup that explains the remedy ?

I ski 45+ days a year in Vermont. Cold temperature steering problems are a deal killer for me.

Considering ordering 2020 X5 in the next few weeks or waiting till after ski season to take delivery if cold weather steering is still an issue.
Appreciate 0
      10-31-2019, 10:21 AM   #162
TimT465201
2019 X5 40i
United_States
22
Rep
49
Posts

Drives: 2019 X5
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Colorado

iTrader: (0)

Cold Temp Steering Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2skivt View Post
Has the cold temperature steering issue been resolved ?
If so what was the fix ?
Can anybody point me in the direction any technical backup that explains the remedy ?

I ski 45+ days a year in Vermont. Cold temperature steering problems are a deal killer for me.

Considering ordering 2020 X5 in the next few weeks or waiting till after ski season to take delivery if cold weather steering is still an issue.
Bumping this post.....

Has anyone confirmed resolution on this issue? If you have.... what are the magic words to communicate the issue/fix to the service dept.

2019 BMW X5 40i standard suspension. Blizzak DM-V2 snow tires.

Single digit temps in Colorado and I am now experiencing something very similar. Warm car (garage) no issues.... Cold Car front end feels like it is floating/ not planted/ twitchy.

Very disconcerting on snowy roads.
__________________
Phytonic Blue 2019 BMW X5
Harley Davidson 2015 V-Rod Muscle
Harley Davidson 2009 Low Rider
Appreciate 0
      10-31-2019, 12:06 PM   #163
mnx5er
Captain
538
Rep
806
Posts

Drives: 2015 BMW X5 3.5i
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Minneapolis, MN

iTrader: (0)

It is supposed to be fixed in one of the software updates. What version are you on?
Appreciate 0
      11-13-2019, 11:45 AM   #164
jcarlilesiu
Second Lieutenant
115
Rep
258
Posts

Drives: 2019 X7 50i
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Chicago Metro

iTrader: (0)

Hate to bump an old post, but a search led me right to this thread.

The X7 has the same issues. Took delivery in June, and recently temperatures dropped to below 20F. Almost immediately I felt the same things:

- Steering feels like its making minute "adjustments" on its own, but requires constant driver intervention to stay straight
- The steering feels loose when in the neutral position, and the excess play requires constant corrections like its windy. But it isn't.
- The steering feels excessively loose in the neutral position, and heavier when turned in either direction.

Has anybody who has had the software updates been able to confirm that it fixed the issue?
Appreciate 0
      11-13-2019, 12:12 PM   #165
randybobandy
Rick James
randybobandy's Avatar
305
Rep
784
Posts

Drives: 2020 BMW M340i xDrive
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: USA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcarlilesiu View Post
Hate to bump an old post, but a search led me right to this thread.

The X7 has the same issues. Took delivery in June, and recently temperatures dropped to below 20F. Almost immediately I felt the same things:

- Steering feels like its making minute "adjustments" on its own, but requires constant driver intervention to stay straight
- The steering feels loose when in the neutral position, and the excess play requires constant corrections like its windy. But it isn't.
- The steering feels excessively loose in the neutral position, and heavier when turned in either direction.

Has anybody who has had the software updates been able to confirm that it fixed the issue?

I’m on 07/2019.70 and it isn’t fixed. The car forces you to hug the center double yellow basically to the point where the tires are touching the line. It doesn’t like the middle of the lane. Also, any small, incremental adjustment seems very jerky and exaggerated.
Appreciate 0
      11-13-2019, 01:30 PM   #166
mnx5er
Captain
538
Rep
806
Posts

Drives: 2015 BMW X5 3.5i
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Minneapolis, MN

iTrader: (0)

I have had no issues. It was 8 degrees here yesterday and my X5 was fine. I had an earlier one last year that did exhibit the issue.
Appreciate 0
      11-19-2019, 06:19 PM   #167
edofloat
Captain
edofloat's Avatar
453
Rep
647
Posts

Drives: Outback or 992
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: ///MN

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mnx5er View Post
I have had no issues. It was 8 degrees here yesterday and my X5 was fine. I had an earlier one last year that did exhibit the issue.
What software version is in your vehicle?
Appreciate 0
      11-19-2019, 06:27 PM   #168
TurtleBoy
General
TurtleBoy's Avatar
12884
Rep
19,396
Posts

Drives: 2019 X5 40i,2021 M340i
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Colorado

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by edofloat View Post
What software version is in your vehicle?
The cold steering issue was supposed to be fixed in 07/2019.xx. It is early in the season yet but so far it seems like it has been, hopefully that is the case.
Appreciate 0
      11-20-2019, 07:52 AM   #169
edofloat
Captain
edofloat's Avatar
453
Rep
647
Posts

Drives: Outback or 992
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: ///MN

iTrader: (0)

My car is on 03/2019.30 and the dealer told me the need to replicate the issue or they can’t apply new software. Just need a cold enough day. OTA updates are one reason I wanted the X5, too bad they don’t work.

I also have intermittent CarPlay connectivity issues too.

I noticed I have this recall: NHTSA Recall Number19V684
It says the remedy for this recall involves updating the software for the rear camera. Would this require applying newer software than 03/2019.xx to resolve or is it just for a single module?

Last edited by edofloat; 11-20-2019 at 08:29 AM..
Appreciate 0
      11-20-2019, 12:54 PM   #170
randybobandy
Rick James
randybobandy's Avatar
305
Rep
784
Posts

Drives: 2020 BMW M340i xDrive
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: USA

iTrader: (0)

Are you having these issues with the driver's assistance on? I find that I am constantly fighting the car since it wants to stay closer to the shoulder than I would like. I still have flukes where the car wants to drive all over. Just this morning it decided to go into the opposite lane. I doubt there's anything wrong with the car, and maybe just some sort of weird lines?

Anyway, the only weird thing I noticed that mine does with the cold happened a last week. It was around 25 degrees F and the car had been sitting for about 3 hours after a 30 min drive. It was in the sun, so the dash and all was warmer. When I got back in and the wheel and seat went into position, the steering column made a horrible grinding sound. Never had they happen before, and couldn't replicate it. Not sure if this may contribute as well. No obstructions or debris either.

I had the recall and update completed back in October, and it the camera always pops up. The only oddities I've noticed are the R to D and rear/front camera handoff. It popped up on the front camera once or twice when switching gears. Also, not sure how perfect the alignment should be on all the cameras with the 360 view. The lines in a parking spot are slightly off, but not to any crazy degree like I've seen others post.
Appreciate 0
      11-20-2019, 05:44 PM   #171
edofloat
Captain
edofloat's Avatar
453
Rep
647
Posts

Drives: Outback or 992
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: ///MN

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by randybobandy View Post
Are you having these issues with the driver's assistance on? I find that I am constantly fighting the car since it wants to stay closer to the shoulder than I would like. I still have flukes where the car wants to drive all over. Just this morning it decided to go into the opposite lane. I doubt there's anything wrong with the car, and maybe just some sort of weird lines?

My car has zero steering feedback when it is acting up, it feels like you could blow on the steering wheel to move it. Flipping back and forth to sport a few time seems to get it to stop doing that. If you are using the assistant systems it feels like it ping pongs back and forth ever so slightly. It feels nervous, not steady. The issue only happens when the car has been sitting and is cold. Each time it has been less than 10 degrees F. My garage is fairly warm, this has been happening after it sits outside all day. It also can happen in the morning when it was -1 F air temp here last week.
Appreciate 0
      11-20-2019, 06:37 PM   #172
TurtleBoy
General
TurtleBoy's Avatar
12884
Rep
19,396
Posts

Drives: 2019 X5 40i,2021 M340i
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Colorado

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by edofloat View Post
My car is on 03/2019.30 and the dealer told me the need to replicate the issue or they can’t apply new software. Just need a cold enough day. OTA updates are one reason I wanted the X5, too bad they don’t work.

I also have intermittent CarPlay connectivity issues too.

I noticed I have this recall: NHTSA Recall Number19V684
It says the remedy for this recall involves updating the software for the rear camera. Would this require applying newer software than 03/2019.xx to resolve or is it just for a single module?
It seems like your dealer was just being lazy. What you are describing is a known issue and they should have updated you. It could have been this was before the fix was out. Did you get the email from BMW inviting all owners in to get a free iDrive update? They should have given you that also if you asked. Since you have the recall you will be covered since that will get you the latest version and hopefully your cold steering issue will be fix. Let us know how it turns out.
Appreciate 0
      11-20-2019, 07:07 PM   #173
edofloat
Captain
edofloat's Avatar
453
Rep
647
Posts

Drives: Outback or 992
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: ///MN

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TurtleBoy View Post
It seems like your dealer was just being lazy. What you are describing is a known issue and they should have updated you. It could have been this was before the fix was out. Did you get the email from BMW inviting all owners in to get a free iDrive update? They should have given you that also if you asked. Since you have the recall you will be covered since that will get you the latest version and hopefully your cold steering issue will be fix. Let us know how it turns out.
If I would have picked up the car three days later they would have been stuck doing the update, can’t sell the car with an open recall. Scheduled for December 11th. Stay tuned. Guessing by then the steering will be acting up every day so it should be obvious if the software fixes the issue.
Appreciate 1
      11-20-2019, 08:12 PM   #174
Aliendrive
Private First Class
Aliendrive's Avatar
United_States
96
Rep
155
Posts

Drives: 23 X3 M40i 24 X3 M40i
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: St Louis

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2023 X3 M40i  [0.00]
Our has this issue and the dealer could not duplicate last winter.They turn off all the steering intervention and told us to put it in sport if it happens. Got updated to 3/2019.45 in spring. We had it happen last week when it was 12 degrees f. Normally happens when it sits outside all day while at work and below 10 degrees. Will take it in for update in about 1000 miles sometime next month to get tires rotated if a update fixes it.Probably will have to wait till Jan or Feb for it to get cold enough again.
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2019, 06:04 AM   #175
mnx5er
Captain
538
Rep
806
Posts

Drives: 2015 BMW X5 3.5i
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Minneapolis, MN

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by edofloat View Post
What software version is in your vehicle?
07/2019.xx (can't remember which). No issues at all.
Appreciate 0
      12-17-2019, 10:25 AM   #176
Aliendrive
Private First Class
Aliendrive's Avatar
United_States
96
Rep
155
Posts

Drives: 23 X3 M40i 24 X3 M40i
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: St Louis

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2023 X3 M40i  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by edofloat View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurtleBoy View Post
It seems like your dealer was just being lazy. What you are describing is a known issue and they should have updated you. It could have been this was before the fix was out. Did you get the email from BMW inviting all owners in to get a free iDrive update? They should have given you that also if you asked. Since you have the recall you will be covered since that will get you the latest version and hopefully your cold steering issue will be fix. Let us know how it turns out.
If I would have picked up the car three days later they would have been stuck doing the update, can’t sell the car with an open recall. Scheduled for December 11th. Stay tuned. Guessing by then the steering will be acting up every day so it should be obvious if the software fixes the issue.
Just checking to see if your cold weather steering issues has been resolved and what they did to fix
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:54 PM.




xbimmers
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST