[brave-heart]

Anyone cross shopping 45e and Tesla Model X? One of my friends is asking my opinion. I have owned 45e for more than 3 month, very happy about the car. Never tried model X before, just model 3. For me, pros for 45e:
1) Better bang for the buck - My $82K car turned out to be 63k before tax. A lower trim model X would be 80K, plus another 10K to add autopilot.
2) ICE engines means piece of mind for long commute, while 40 miles electric range is perfect for my local.
3) Classic BMW handling and interior. (Way better) comfort and message seats, HUD , 360 view, Apple Car play, the actual physical convenience buttons (instead of touch screen).
Some items I initially thought were exclusive to Tesla, but then found out BMW also tries to catch up:
1) OTA updates.
2) Auto parking.
3) Driving Assistant Pro - auto-steering works very well in highway.

Pros for Model X:
1) Much longer range and much faster acceleration.
2) Handling might be better
3) Full Auto pilot capacity.
4) Fancy falcon doors

Granted, the pricing range paid for my 45e is more towards Model Y (60K including Full Auto pilots) . Just want to hear people's thoughts here. I simply turned down the idea of Model 3 after sitting/driving in the car for 10 minutes - interior is not my taste, at all. Model X should be better.

[jad03060]

Tesla is 25 out of 26 in the vehicle quality standings for this year...tells you something about how well they are put together. There are good and bad things about the way Tesla makes their battery packs. In the industry, the more parts, the more likely there can be a defect. A large battery pack on a Tesla could have nearly 8,000 cells. The X5 has a bit over 100, and that's in twelve, separate modules that can be replaced if a fault occurs. Tesla batteries do seem to have a decent life, and so do those used by BMW, but Teslas have been around a little longer, so it's really hard to say long-term. Many people lease their vehicle, so it's really a mute point.

I agree about the large touch panel...not my cup of tea. Tesla really doesn't want people using their superchargers on a regular basis, and really would prefer they use them only for trips with a long enough range to make that more useful, but, should you want or have to recharge it at home, and it needs a lot of power, many homes may not have enough power to do it in a reasonable timeframe. BUt, if you can wait, yes, you'll go further on electricity than the X5 45e by a long ways. Throw in the gas tank on the X5 that you can refill in minutes, and your overall trip time of a long one would likely be lots shorter. Now, that's not to say that a periodic stop to rest isn't a good idea, it's just that I'd prefer to do that on my schedule.

I haven't driven the Tesla...had no real interest. I might be surprised, but the X5 goes fast enough for me.

[marcpitt]

Not sure fancy falcon doors is a pro. Have a friend who has nothing but problems with them including the fact they constantly close down on his wife and kids as they only have sensors on the outside while opening.

[m3_08]

i compared both by test drive. Like the acceleration and tech in Tesla but
I still want my HUD, ventilated seats and massaged seats and other typical luxury amenities. Also I believe the price for batteries will go down in near future and all EV are overpriced for now.
I don't care about autopilot, auto parking so to me x5 45e was a good compromise to fit my family dd needs of 20 miles/day.

[biterror]

I drove Model X over two years ago. Acceleration was nice, but.. that was it. No feeling "I have to get this". Autopilot was bouncing from one road edge to the other and it's useless in wintertime. I like my X5 45e better.

[X5 45e]

I tested a Tesla model S not an X.

Accelerations are faster than the 45e. Question is if we really need more. 5,7 seconds 0-100 kmh is more than enough (for me)

Interior quality was worse in the Tesla. BMW is several steps ahead in comfort, build quality, design.

Reliability of the Tesla is reported to be inferior to the 45e.

Like mentioned by someone else I would really miss the HUD. But also comfort seats. And MX has a panoramic roof but it can't be opened, I would miss that too.

I don't think handeling would be better in the model X.

In Europe the model X and 45e are in the same price range. I still prefer the 45e. If it is even cheaper than the model X I would definitely choose the 45e.

I am still not convinced for longer road trips in a full electric vehicle.

[codex57]

I'm a Tesla owner and a 45e owner. I'm not a Tesla fanboy though.

They're VERY different. However, the main reason I didn't go with a Model X is pretty simple, like OP pointed out, there's a HUGE price difference. I dunno if you really can make a direct comparison with the X5. The X7 is more in line for a competitor, and then it's pretty simple.

The 45e is for people who aren't ready to jump headfirst into the full BEV experience. Typically it's range envy to some degree. I like to take road trips out to national parks and other areas with poor electric car infrastructure. I also have a 180 mile roundtrip work commute which is maxing out the real world range of my Model 3 LR. I'm an extreme use case.

So, the 45e was a great compromise because it's a hybrid. Around town, the electric is great.

Pricewise, the 45e is about the same cost as a Model Y (which I seriously considered). And my 45e is pretty loaded ($83k MSRP). The BMW is WAY more luxurious and comfortable.

Tesla, including the X, has WAY better infotainment and electronics. It's night and day once you start to live with it. Idrive 7 feels Bronze Age vs the Stone Age iDrive 6 of my previous X3, but it's still extremely unpolished. I prefer the system in the 3/Y better than the S/X, but that one is fine too.

With the X7 and X, it's basically ICE vs Electric. Size is very similar, including cargo space. The X has the bugs pretty much worked out so reliability isn't a concern. Fit and finish is not BMW level, but it's ok. It's not horrible. Quality of materials is vastly worse overall though. It feels like a Honda level, not a luxury brand. But the acceleration and handling is nuts. All that weight down low mean the car sticks to the ground at an absurd level. The initial electric kick is something you really need to feel for yourself. You can have extreme fun just accelerating to 40 mph. BMW looks a lot better inside and out. Even with Superchargers, waiting at a Supercharger on a roadtrip isn't fun. The savings vs gas is quite significant though. You really can't discount that and it really changes the financial picture.

[SmartSaves]

codex57, thanks for the insights, very nice comparison. I researched Tesla and current models didn't fit my need. Below are some reasons I went with with the X5 (no particular order). I would love to hear your thoughts from you and others

• Cold weather battery range is reduced.
• Charging infrastructure.
• Range anxiety during long road trips and charging duration.
• No heat-pump (added in 2020 - Model 3, Y)
• Less towing capability.
• Glass roof without shade, in case of rollover, hot sunny days, cold condensation, cannot be open.
• No physical tactile HVAC buttons.
• Lack of wiper stalk (model Y and 3).
• No wireless CarPlay (dealbreaker), Apple CarKey, Android Auto.
• No HUD (dealbreaker) .
• No 360 camera (part of FSD)
• No heated steering wheel on model x? (Not sure).
• Model X is longer and very wide with side mirrors fully open (not garage door friendly).
• No laser light.
• No rear seat entertainment system.
• No active sway bar, no active steering
• No massage chair, programable seat options for both driver and passenger.
• Lack of sound system choices.
• Too minimalist interior, doesn't feel luxurious
• Quality control issues.
• Installation cost of charger.
• Electric charging is not free and questionable clean source.
• Subject to vandalism, keying.
• Plastic wheel well arch (not painted).
• No tax credit is a dealbreaker.
• Seating position is not high enough (Model Y), only 7 inch, prefer high ground clearance.
• Battery tech is changing rapidly, current battery pack could become obsolete in a year or two.
• No plans to adopt Lidar tech.
• Falcon wings doors have limited purpose (model X)

[brave-heart]

Thanks for all the opinions. I'll let my friend know. Dealbreaker for me would be no HUD/Apple Carplay/360 camera in a $80K+ SUV. Even if he is fond of Autopilot, should wait until Model X fixes these.

[jad03060]

The adaptive cruise control with all of the options on the X5 is pretty good. I don't have the November update yet, but hear it made improvements over the July version I have now, too. There's a camera watching the driver, so it will let you go handsfree for a short while if you're not touching the steering wheel.

Pulling up on the emergency brake will also cause the vehicle to turn itself to the side of the road and stop. Probably more useful if there's a front passenger to do it than the driver, but still a neat feature. It will self-park with the parking option. If you get it fully loaded, there are six cameras and five radar sensors in addition to the US parking sensors. BMW doesn't make a big deal about it, but it's pretty good and getting better.

[codex57]

Originally Posted by brave-heart

Thanks for all the opinions. I'll let my friend know. Dealbreaker for me would be no HUD/Apple Carplay/360 camera in a $80K+ SUV. Even if he is fond of Autopilot, should wait until Model X fixes these.

Well, there is 360 camera now. BMW has over the air updates, but it's still vaporware for me. My car was built 11/20, yet it came with 7/20 software and I have no faith I'll get it any time soon.

Not having Apple CarPlay is bizarre, but Tesla's interface and options are just as good if not better in terms of usability in a car. Any other car co I'd say it's a deal breaker. Not so much in a Tesla. I never miss it. My X3 didn't have it and I coded it in, but lost it when dealer updated software. Having it helped a ton. Losing it and dealing with BMW's system was a big reason I got rid of the X3.

No HUD sucks, but less critical on a X bc it has a dash display also.

Each "missing" item is very valid as a minus against Tesla. However, there are a ton of features (software based) that make daily life easier with a Tesla. If it doesn't exist, a tweet to Elon might make it so. See "Joe Mode". For instance, Comfort Access is driving me nuts right now and I'm sure I'll have to live with it. Tesla would have pushed an update in a couple months to fix it.

But yes, cold will KILL your range. There's very little adjustability in a Tesla. Luckily, it's pretty comfy and much more comfortable than the standard X5 seats IMO. I have the Merino leather and massage chairs on my X5 and honestly, my Model 3 seats are still more comfortable but the adjustability does make it a lot closer.

Autopilot did bounce too much when it first came out. They fixed it pretty shortly after the Model 3 was first released. However, recent updates seemed to make "phantom braking" more of an issue so plenty of work still to do on Tesla's part.

For me, the range is just not enough. You also have to be very aware of tire pressure and what brand tire you out on as that can affect range dramatically. My OEM tires lasted 52k miles, but I replaced them with some Bridgestones and my range has been cut by maybe as much as a third.

Not much I have to worry about with the X5 because it's pretty much a conventional car. Not worried about the battery (on either X5 45e or X) because every car will get outdated eventually.

But if it was my money of the 45e vs the X (and cost is similar), I'd pick the X5 unless I truly needed 7 seats. The S and X are just too much in need of version 2 whereas the X5 is much more polished of a vehicle.

[nosnoop]

Originally Posted by codex57

Well, there is 360 camera now.

It looks like you need FSD to get the 360 camera.
And the price for the FSD is way too much for what it can do now, which is not much more than X5. And I don't think FSD would get approved in any country any time soon.

Not having Apple CarPlay is bizarre, but Tesla's interface and options are just as good if not better in terms of usability in a car.

It's not interface and UI, it's the lack of built-in Apple Music support.
There are rumors of Apple Music support in upcoming software updates, but who knows when that would happen.

[codex57]

Originally Posted by nosnoop

It looks like you need FSD to get the 360 camera.
And the price for the FSD is way too much for what it can do now, which is not much more than X5. And I don't think FSD would get approved in any country any time soon.



It's not interface and UI, it's the lack of built-in Apple Music support.
There are rumors of Apple Music support in upcoming software updates, but who knows when that would happen.

Is that in Canada? I just checked their website for the US. The cameras (and 360 view) come standard with all their cars in the US. Basic autopilot too (and it's all you need IMO). FSD gets you relatively useless things like stoplight detection (still doesn't work that will in city driving), auto lane change (I have that and it still needs work to match a human), and a few other things I consider really minor. And yes, $10k for it is absurd.

Yes, Elon time is infamous for being unreliable and meaning years after he says it will happen. But it does happen and they have a good track record of software being pushed back onto people who have already purchased their cars. Buy a Tesla, and at least you know the car will continuously gain features. I still don't have any faith my BMW will gain anything useful (or even fun) in the next several years of ownership despite it purportedly having OTA updates.