for 45e/50e owner, do you find yourself wanting more power when in Electric only mode

Ywxxbear · 08-16-2023, 05:34 PM

Hi guys, I'm thinking hard to get an 2024 50e.
I think it would be the best of both world, with ICE and EV.

However, one thing I didn't quite get from all the searching, is that what it's like to floor the car when starting from EV mode.
I feel like there're only 2 options:
1. car limits the rev because of cold oil temp
2. car doesn't limit, then the ICE is stressed because of high rev with still cold oil.

It sounds like 1 would be the case here.

I wonder how much of a limit would that impose on performance? since you'd be only using a portion of that ICE right?

I mostly would get by with electric range, but I like to do random accelaration when I feel like it with on-ramp, but not always.

It'd be awkward to anticipate if I'd want to do full send ahead of the time, and turn on the ICE to prep for it.
For ICE/BEV it won't be an issue as i just drive normally for 5-10min and i'd get full power anytime I want.

A related question is, if I always drive in hybrid/adaptive mode, do I always get access to the full power of both motor? assuming i have enough electricity and gas in the tank.
If so, does that defeat the purpose of owning an PHEV? and does anyone know the MPG if I were to do that?

Thanks ALL

915M · 08-16-2023, 05:50 PM

First, car limits rev when it is cold with a cold mark on dash but it does not take too long to disappear(Around 50'C, 1-2 miniutes of ICE driving from 20'C). However, with that low engine temp, I would not be comfortable to rev up to the limit until it becomes 80-90'C. You can use sport mode to shorten the warming up to keep ICE on.

Most of time, unless you drive it aggressively, hybrid mode stays in electric motor only. ICE will be triggered on with more than 50% of throttle(as on dash).

Of course, more power would be preferrable but power of elec motor is enough for regular driving situation I think.

Ywxxbear · 08-16-2023, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 915M

First, car limits rev when it is cold with a cold mark on dash but it does not take too long to disappear(Around 50'C, 1-2 miniutes of ICE driving from 20'C). However, with that low engine temp, I would not be comfortable to rev up to the limit until it becomes 80-90'C. You can use sport mode to shorten the warming up to keep ICE on.

Most of time, unless you drive it aggressively, hybrid mode stays in electric motor only. ICE will be triggered on with more than 50% of throttle(as on dash).

Of course, more power would be preferrable but power of elec motor is enough for regular driving situation I think.

So essentially there's no way to naturally drive the car and have full power ready whenever I need it?

unless I start the car in sports mode, or be agressive on the gas to force ICE to kick in, and keep it that way for a few minutes to get the ICE to working temperature, then switch to hybrid/ev mode to drive normally, and only then I can get the full power whenever I want for the rest of that trip?
(not sure if i continue to drive in ev mode for longer and not turn on ICE again would make ICE cool down to a temp that needs me to force ICE on again)

RNorb · 08-16-2023, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ywxxbear

So essentially there's no way to naturally drive the car and have full power ready whenever I need it?

unless I start the car in sports mode, or be agressive on the gas to force ICE to kick in, and keep it that way for a few minutes to get the ICE to working temperature, then switch to hybrid/ev mode to drive normally, and only then I can get the full power whenever I want for the rest of that trip?
(not sure if i continue to drive in ev mode for longer and not turn on ICE again would make ICE cool down to a temp that needs me to force ICE on again)

Set the battery hold at the beginning of your trip. That should keep the ICE running enough to keep it warm.

David3 · 08-16-2023, 06:33 PM

I believe when in electric only mode, if you push throttle past detent (kick down) the ICE will kick in. It’s a safety thing so you always have sufficient power to get out of a tricky situation.

Same as an ICE only model, it is not wise to push the engine when it is cold. You wouldn’t do it with ICE only vehicle, so why would you do it with a PHEV?

aaaaaaaaaz · 08-16-2023, 06:36 PM

You can always tap the left shift paddle to signal the car bring up the ICE in any driving mode

jad03060 · 08-16-2023, 06:40 PM

If you're in EV mode, you must go past the detent near the full extent of the accelerator to get the ICE to come on. Note, in EV mode, you can get to nearly 90-mph in EV mode. If you're in hybrid mode, it will engage the ICE when you exceed about 40% of the capacity of the EV motor. In practical situations except for drag racing, the cold engine issue isn't really an issue. How much power do you really need? You'll get most of the available maximum even when cold, and the maximum torque from the EV motor from stop means it is no slouch. Drive one and I think you'll agree.

Note on the 45e, compared to the pre-LCI 40i, the power:weight ratios are as close to identical as you'd get. The 50e's power:weight ratio is better than the ICE.

Ywxxbear · 08-16-2023, 07:38 PM

Thanks for all the reply.
Sounds like battery hold would be the option i want.

I don't think I NEED the full power per se, more of since it's a rather quick car, I'd like to experience the power when I feel like it, which might be when going on-ramp and there's no car in front of me.

I was thinking there'd be a mode to make the car work like a non plug-in hybrid, where electric and ICE would work at the same time, saving gas when driving lightly, and getting full power when I floor it (or change to sport mode and floor right afterwards to get some fun)

jad03060 · 08-16-2023, 08:21 PM

In hybrid (the default unless you change things) has the computer monitoring what is the most relevant mode to run in, whether that's EV if you're loafing along, or sporty if you ask for more power. Keep in mind that in all modes, both motors can be called upon, depending on the current circumstances.

Once the vehicle is rolling, the vehicle uses 'tow-start' mode to bring the ICE on line so smoothly, unless you're really paying close attention, you may not actually realize it. The starter motor only gets used if it wants the ICE from standstill.

Go FasTA · 08-16-2023, 08:24 PM

I owned a 2021 45e for two years and recently replaced it with a 50e. There were definitely times, although rare, that I wished for more power from the electric motor with my 45e, but I have yet to encounter the same feeling with the 50e. The torque provided by the electric motor plays a big role in the experience. For me, the 50e is the ideal output in electric only driving modes. One thing that surprised me about the 50e that I’ve not seen mentioned anywhere is that when in hybrid mode it will happily continue to run in electric mode up to at least 80ish mph whereas my 45e would transition to ICE between 65-70mph. This, combined with the increased range of the 50e, means I can now benefit from electric only propulsion in more of my personal use cases. We recently had to make a 45 mile round trip with 40 of those miles on the interstate. I completed the entire trip in hybrid mode (cruising at ~78mph on the interstate) and the car never once engaged the ICE.

jad03060 · 08-16-2023, 08:41 PM

The 45e can cruise (on level road) at nearly 90-mph IF you're in EV mode. In hybrid, it will engage the ice a lot earlier. With a larger EV motor, the 50e is about the same, but because of that increase, can cruise a bit higher in on the electric motor. The computer wants you to have some reserve power, and near the threshold, starting and stopping the ICE is not an efficient use, so once you 'need' it, it may stay on for a while.

E91toG05 · 08-16-2023, 09:05 PM

For what it is worth, I believe you are overthinking it. In practice, it is all quite natural and works very well. You will get used to it quickly and be very happy as these are great vehicles, and this is great technology. I drive around 95% of time in Electric mode. If I think I am going to want to move more swiftly, I pop it into sport mode (or move shifter to left into manual mode). If I want to have some battery on reserve when I arrive somewhere after a longer trip, I use the battery hold mode. that is about it.

nZtiZia · 08-16-2023, 09:17 PM

0-60mph acceleration is impressive on both the 45e and 50e, but that’s essentially dragging off the line.

sounds like you’d prefer an ICE-only or full EV, not a PHEV

thewils · 08-16-2023, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alanzyy

You can always tap the left shift paddle to signal the car bring up the ICE in any driving mode

Or knock the shift lever over to the left...

aaaaaaaaaz · 08-16-2023, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thewils

Or knock the shift lever over to the left...

Ugh I wish I could do that
I want the shift lever

eelnoraa · 08-17-2023, 12:37 AM

Paddle shifter also enables ICE

jad03060 · 08-17-2023, 12:41 AM

If you've driven the 40i and found it adequate, the 45e is pretty much identical, but the 50e should be faster. Sludging around town, you'd mostly be running the EV motor, out on the highway, the ICE would usually come on. The EV motor is always there to help with that extra instant torque and power.

SwissBeemer · 08-17-2023, 02:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jad03060

If you're in hybrid mode, it will engage the ICE when you exceed about 40% of the capacity of the EV motor.

Are you sure about that? Because it would make way more sense if it would be 100% capacity of the EV motor, which would be around 40% of total power. No reason to turn the ICE on before the electric motor runs out of power and 40% of 200hp would be 80hp which would hardly move a 2.5t car.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jad03060

The 45e can cruise (on level road) at nearly 90-mph IF you're in EV mode. In hybrid, it will engage the ice a lot earlier.

Judging from what I've seen in the Autogefühl test it engages the ICE pretty much exactly at 130kph/80mph in hybrid mode as well, although I remember always hearing about 140kph/85mph as top speed in electric-only mode.

SuperYes · 08-17-2023, 02:55 AM

50e Owner. The car is a Jeckyll and Hyde, and I find that my driving has morphed to fit that. Dads Taxi runs are always done in electric, which I think is as quick and capable as my previous car, a 2 litre Mercedes GLC. When I am on electric I never want to thrash it, I automatically want to compete the numbers for efficiency so drive accordingly. If I am out for a drive at the weekend, I know I will not be in errand mode, and will start/ run the engine in sport mode so its ready for the inevitable on ramp drag run. I will flip into sport if I want to have fun. For longer journeys I would flip it into Hybrid and allow the car to manage power sources.
I have to say that this is the best car that I have ever owned and I absolutely love learning about the added dimension of having a plug in electric motor integrated into the powertrain.

Kief · 08-17-2023, 03:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nZtiZia

or full EV, not a PHEV

This is what concerns me, for my situation (sorry OP, but sorta related)…

Last year this time, I was about to pull the trigger on a 45e for my wife. We were excited to slowly transition from ICE to PHEV/BEV (I should start by saying I am a huge BMW fanboi and we have had many X5s over the years from diesel to X5M). I had and an allocation and a relatively strong deal, but when we test drove the 45e we were sadly underwhelmed. Our intention with the 45e was to run it in EV mode as much as possible; however, the performance in pure EV mode was anemic IMHO. Of course we were looking at it wrong in thinking that in EV mode it would drive/feel like a BEV, which obviously it isn’t. Nevertheless, given our reaction, and the fact that we were installing a L2 charger, we decided to just dive right in and get a BEV…an ID.4 of all things!! The vdub has been great, but we sorta miss having an X5, and the LCI 50e has caught my eye (MSport, Brooklyn gray/cognac, 741M, yummy!!). We became so addicted with the BEV performance, that a few months after taking delivery of the ID.4, I traded in my M4Cx for an i4 M50!

Which brings us to now. Despite the increase in performance with the 50e, I’m worried we will feel the same way about the driving experience in EV mode as we did last year with the 45e, especially after drinking the kool-aid over the past year and driving only BEV. We are scheduled to test drive a 50e tomorrow (and an ix50 for that matter—strong lease deals, but fugly as hell), so certainly that will help in our decision making. I have a solid deal once again on a 50e, and an allocation ready to go, but at the 11th hour, I’m anxious we aren’t going to be impressed enough to pull the trigger. Obviously only we can decide for ourselves, but I like reading about owners’ experiences, bearing in mind the potential bias in a car forum lol.

cobramite · 08-17-2023, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kief

This is what concerns me, for my situation (sorry OP, but sorta related)…

Last year this time, I was about to pull the trigger on a 45e for my wife. We were excited to slowly transition from ICE to PHEV/BEV (I should start by saying I am a huge BMW fanboi and we have had many X5s over the years from diesel to X5M). I had and an allocation and a relatively strong deal, but when we test drove the 45e we were sadly underwhelmed. Our intention with the 45e was to run it in EV mode as much as possible; however, the performance in pure EV mode was anemic IMHO. Of course we were looking at it wrong in thinking that in EV mode it would drive/feel like a BEV, which obviously it isn’t. Nevertheless, given our reaction, and the fact that we were installing a L2 charger, we decided to just dive right in and get a BEV…an ID.4 of all things!! The vdub has been great, but we sorta miss having an X5, and the LCI 50e has caught my eye (MSport, Brooklyn gray/cognac, 741M, yummy!!). We became so addicted with the BEV performance, that a few months after taking delivery of the ID.4, I traded in my M4Cx for an i4 M50!

Which brings us to now. Despite the increase in performance with the 50e, I’m worried we will feel the same way about the driving experience in EV mode as we did last year with the 45e, especially after drinking the kool-aid over the past year and driving only BEV. We are scheduled to test drive a 50e tomorrow (and an ix50 for that matter—strong lease deals, but fugly as hell), so certainly that will help in our decision making. I have a solid deal once again on a 50e, and an allocation ready to go, but at the 11th hour, I’m anxious we aren’t going to be impressed enough to pull the trigger. Obviously only we can decide for ourselves, but I like reading about owners’ experiences, bearing in mind the potential bias in a car forum lol.

Your "anemic" description of the 45e in pure electric mode is verified by it's 17 second 0-60 metric(10 seconds for the 50e). These are heavy vehicles that actually do accelerate relatively well with the ICE and EV both awake and working in tandem. A highly complex means of doing so.
There is a good bit of talk here about power and performance which is expected when any premium grade German vehicle is discussed.
Those who place a priority on a strong engine would really be best served by an M60i or X5M that comes with the M performance S68 V8.

FastMarkA · 08-17-2023, 08:18 AM

I had a 45e, and now have a 50e.

As mentioned, the 50e in electric mode is noticeably more muscular than the 45e.

Don't overthink how you use the car as it knows all the right moves for when to kick on the ICE; it's very clever.

As for cold engine oil and "gunning" it: if you are that conscientious of a driver (most aren't, and I think BMW plans for this), you wouldn't do that with an ICE-only car most likely.

The hybrid system is very well thought through, and at least for me, a more fun-to-drive experience than ICE-only.

08-16-2023, 05:34 PM	#1
Ywxxbear New Member 10 Rep 25 Posts Drives: M340i Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Washington iTrader: (0)	for 45e/50e owner, do you find yourself wanting more power when in Electric only mode Hi guys, I'm thinking hard to get an 2024 50e. I think it would be the best of both world, with ICE and EV. However, one thing I didn't quite get from all the searching, is that what it's like to floor the car when starting from EV mode. I feel like there're only 2 options: 1. car limits the rev because of cold oil temp 2. car doesn't limit, then the ICE is stressed because of high rev with still cold oil. It sounds like 1 would be the case here. I wonder how much of a limit would that impose on performance? since you'd be only using a portion of that ICE right? I mostly would get by with electric range, but I like to do random accelaration when I feel like it with on-ramp, but not always. It'd be awkward to anticipate if I'd want to do full send ahead of the time, and turn on the ICE to prep for it. For ICE/BEV it won't be an issue as i just drive normally for 5-10min and i'd get full power anytime I want. A related question is, if I always drive in hybrid/adaptive mode, do I always get access to the full power of both motor? assuming i have enough electricity and gas in the tank. If so, does that defeat the purpose of owning an PHEV? and does anyone know the MPG if I were to do that? Thanks ALL
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08-16-2023, 05:50 PM	#2
915M Second Lieutenant 88 Rep 208 Posts Drives: BMW X5 50e Join Date: Feb 2023 Location: NYC iTrader: (0)	First, car limits rev when it is cold with a cold mark on dash but it does not take too long to disappear(Around 50'C, 1-2 miniutes of ICE driving from 20'C). However, with that low engine temp, I would not be comfortable to rev up to the limit until it becomes 80-90'C. You can use sport mode to shorten the warming up to keep ICE on. Most of time, unless you drive it aggressively, hybrid mode stays in electric motor only. ICE will be triggered on with more than 50% of throttle(as on dash). Of course, more power would be preferrable but power of elec motor is enough for regular driving situation I think.
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08-16-2023, 06:33 PM	#5
David3 Second Lieutenant 124 Rep 219 Posts Drives: E21 (x2), E46, F15, G05 LCI Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Austin, TX iTrader: (0)	I believe when in electric only mode, if you push throttle past detent (kick down) the ICE will kick in. It’s a safety thing so you always have sufficient power to get out of a tricky situation. Same as an ICE only model, it is not wise to push the engine when it is cold. You wouldn’t do it with ICE only vehicle, so why would you do it with a PHEV? Last edited by David3; 08-17-2023 at 07:12 PM..
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08-16-2023, 06:36 PM	#6
aaaaaaaaaz Captain 570 Rep 887 Posts Drives: 2024 X5 50e (CB/Coffee) Join Date: Jul 2022 Location: sf bay iTrader: (0)	You can always tap the left shift paddle to signal the car bring up the ICE in any driving mode
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08-16-2023, 06:40 PM	#7
jad03060 Major General 3166 Rep 6,806 Posts Drives: X5 45e Join Date: Aug 2018 Location: NH iTrader: (0)	If you're in EV mode, you must go past the detent near the full extent of the accelerator to get the ICE to come on. Note, in EV mode, you can get to nearly 90-mph in EV mode. If you're in hybrid mode, it will engage the ICE when you exceed about 40% of the capacity of the EV motor. In practical situations except for drag racing, the cold engine issue isn't really an issue. How much power do you really need? You'll get most of the available maximum even when cold, and the maximum torque from the EV motor from stop means it is no slouch. Drive one and I think you'll agree. Note on the 45e, compared to the pre-LCI 40i, the power:weight ratios are as close to identical as you'd get. The 50e's power:weight ratio is better than the ICE.
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08-16-2023, 07:38 PM	#8
Ywxxbear New Member 10 Rep 25 Posts Drives: M340i Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Washington iTrader: (0)	Thanks for all the reply. Sounds like battery hold would be the option i want. I don't think I NEED the full power per se, more of since it's a rather quick car, I'd like to experience the power when I feel like it, which might be when going on-ramp and there's no car in front of me. I was thinking there'd be a mode to make the car work like a non plug-in hybrid, where electric and ICE would work at the same time, saving gas when driving lightly, and getting full power when I floor it (or change to sport mode and floor right afterwards to get some fun)
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08-16-2023, 08:21 PM	#9
jad03060 Major General 3166 Rep 6,806 Posts Drives: X5 45e Join Date: Aug 2018 Location: NH iTrader: (0)	In hybrid (the default unless you change things) has the computer monitoring what is the most relevant mode to run in, whether that's EV if you're loafing along, or sporty if you ask for more power. Keep in mind that in all modes, both motors can be called upon, depending on the current circumstances. Once the vehicle is rolling, the vehicle uses 'tow-start' mode to bring the ICE on line so smoothly, unless you're really paying close attention, you may not actually realize it. The starter motor only gets used if it wants the ICE from standstill.
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08-16-2023, 08:24 PM	#10
Go FasTA Second Lieutenant 231 Rep 206 Posts Drives: 2021 X5 45e Join Date: May 2014 Location: Lexington, KY iTrader: (0)	I owned a 2021 45e for two years and recently replaced it with a 50e. There were definitely times, although rare, that I wished for more power from the electric motor with my 45e, but I have yet to encounter the same feeling with the 50e. The torque provided by the electric motor plays a big role in the experience. For me, the 50e is the ideal output in electric only driving modes. One thing that surprised me about the 50e that I’ve not seen mentioned anywhere is that when in hybrid mode it will happily continue to run in electric mode up to at least 80ish mph whereas my 45e would transition to ICE between 65-70mph. This, combined with the increased range of the 50e, means I can now benefit from electric only propulsion in more of my personal use cases. We recently had to make a 45 mile round trip with 40 of those miles on the interstate. I completed the entire trip in hybrid mode (cruising at ~78mph on the interstate) and the car never once engaged the ICE.
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08-16-2023, 08:41 PM	#11
jad03060 Major General 3166 Rep 6,806 Posts Drives: X5 45e Join Date: Aug 2018 Location: NH iTrader: (0)	The 45e can cruise (on level road) at nearly 90-mph IF you're in EV mode. In hybrid, it will engage the ice a lot earlier. With a larger EV motor, the 50e is about the same, but because of that increase, can cruise a bit higher in on the electric motor. The computer wants you to have some reserve power, and near the threshold, starting and stopping the ICE is not an efficient use, so once you 'need' it, it may stay on for a while.
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08-16-2023, 09:05 PM	#12
E91toG05 Captain 343 Rep 615 Posts Drives: 2022 X5 45e Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: New York, NY iTrader: (0)	For what it is worth, I believe you are overthinking it. In practice, it is all quite natural and works very well. You will get used to it quickly and be very happy as these are great vehicles, and this is great technology. I drive around 95% of time in Electric mode. If I think I am going to want to move more swiftly, I pop it into sport mode (or move shifter to left into manual mode). If I want to have some battery on reserve when I arrive somewhere after a longer trip, I use the battery hold mode. that is about it.
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08-16-2023, 09:17 PM	#13
nZtiZia Major General 4656 Rep 8,700 Posts Drives: eVeRyOnE mAD! Join Date: Dec 2020 Location: neither here nor there... iTrader: (0) Garage List 2021 BMW X5 xDrive 45e [9.88]	0-60mph acceleration is impressive on both the 45e and 50e, but that’s essentially dragging off the line. sounds like you’d prefer an ICE-only or full EV, not a PHEV
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08-17-2023, 12:37 AM	#16
eelnoraa Brigadier General 2033 Rep 3,681 Posts Drives: G05 X5 Join Date: May 2022 Location: SF Bay Area CA iTrader: (0)	Paddle shifter also enables ICE __________________ 2022 G05 B58/PHEV + a few very old BMWs
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08-17-2023, 12:41 AM	#17
jad03060 Major General 3166 Rep 6,806 Posts Drives: X5 45e Join Date: Aug 2018 Location: NH iTrader: (0)	If you've driven the 40i and found it adequate, the 45e is pretty much identical, but the 50e should be faster. Sludging around town, you'd mostly be running the EV motor, out on the highway, the ICE would usually come on. The EV motor is always there to help with that extra instant torque and power.
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08-17-2023, 02:55 AM	#19
SuperYes New Member 58 Rep 26 Posts Drives: Mercedes GLC Join Date: Jul 2023 Location: United Kingdom iTrader: (0) Garage List MY2024 BMW X5 50e [0.00]	50e Owner. The car is a Jeckyll and Hyde, and I find that my driving has morphed to fit that. Dads Taxi runs are always done in electric, which I think is as quick and capable as my previous car, a 2 litre Mercedes GLC. When I am on electric I never want to thrash it, I automatically want to compete the numbers for efficiency so drive accordingly. If I am out for a drive at the weekend, I know I will not be in errand mode, and will start/ run the engine in sport mode so its ready for the inevitable on ramp drag run. I will flip into sport if I want to have fun. For longer journeys I would flip it into Hybrid and allow the car to manage power sources. I have to say that this is the best car that I have ever owned and I absolutely love learning about the added dimension of having a plug in electric motor integrated into the powertrain.
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08-17-2023, 08:18 AM	#22
FastMarkA Lieutenant 561 Rep 545 Posts Drives: '24 X5 50e M-Sport Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Chicago iTrader: (0)	I had a 45e, and now have a 50e. As mentioned, the 50e in electric mode is noticeably more muscular than the 45e. Don't overthink how you use the car as it knows all the right moves for when to kick on the ICE; it's very clever. As for cold engine oil and "gunning" it: if you are that conscientious of a driver (most aren't, and I think BMW plans for this), you wouldn't do that with an ICE-only car most likely. The hybrid system is very well thought through, and at least for me, a more fun-to-drive experience than ICE-only.
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