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      01-09-2020, 08:02 AM   #1343
ZCPM4
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Hey all - wanted to reach out to for some pricing guidance. My father and I just happen to both be in the market for new BMWs, an X5M50i and an X7 40i. We're both wanting to do PCD, so thought we would combine our order to try to maximize our discounts. The hope is we might be able to get an even better deal with buying 2 cars from the same CA at once. I'm taking the lead on negotiations and planning to get quotes from 3 or so dealers.

Looks like on both G05 and G07 threads, people are getting ~10% discounts, before any promotions. In that case, here's how our builds would work out:

X5M50i:
$93,750 MSRP
$995 delivery
$94,745 total ---> 10% would be $85,270

X7 40i:
$87,150 MSRP
$995 delivery
$88,145 total ---> 10% would be $79,330

So, questions:
  • Would you throw out those numbers (or any lower?) to dealers and get their response, or would you ask for their "best deal" and know in your head what you want to get down to?
  • We're both planning to pay cash, but could finance some if there are any incentives to be had and it looks like there's a finance credit and a loyalty credit on both. Can we combine those? We both have BMWs now.
  • If so, in the X5 as an example, would you expect your bottom line (before taxes and fees) to be $85k - $3k finance credit - $1250 loyalty = $81k? Is that the right way to look at it? I also have a corporate incentive and we both have BMWCCA, so I know those would be taken out of the very bottom.
  • We both have previous generation BMW trade-ins too, but would plan to negotiate those separately to maximize tax savings too.

Any other thoughts or recommendations for getting the best deal? We probably wouldn't ever be in the situation to buy 2 new cars at the exact same time again, so want to make sure we make the most of it! Thanks in advance!
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      01-09-2020, 09:19 AM   #1344
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZCPM4 View Post
Hey all - wanted to reach out to for some pricing guidance. My father and I just happen to both be in the market for new BMWs, an X5M50i and an X7 40i. We're both wanting to do PCD, so thought we would combine our order to try to maximize our discounts. The hope is we might be able to get an even better deal with buying 2 cars from the same CA at once. I'm taking the lead on negotiations and planning to get quotes from 3 or so dealers.

Looks like on both G05 and G07 threads, people are getting ~10% discounts, before any promotions. In that case, here's how our builds would work out:

X5M50i:
$93,750 MSRP
$995 delivery
$94,745 total ---> 10% would be $85,270

X7 40i:
$87,150 MSRP
$995 delivery
$88,145 total ---> 10% would be $79,330

So, questions:
  • Would you throw out those numbers (or any lower?) to dealers and get their response, or would you ask for their "best deal" and know in your head what you want to get down to?
  • We're both planning to pay cash, but could finance some if there are any incentives to be had and it looks like there's a finance credit and a loyalty credit on both. Can we combine those? We both have BMWs now.
  • If so, in the X5 as an example, would you expect your bottom line (before taxes and fees) to be $85k - $3k finance credit - $1250 loyalty = $81k? Is that the right way to look at it? I also have a corporate incentive and we both have BMWCCA, so I know those would be taken out of the very bottom.
  • We both have previous generation BMW trade-ins too, but would plan to negotiate those separately to maximize tax savings too.

Any other thoughts or recommendations for getting the best deal? We probably wouldn't ever be in the situation to buy 2 new cars at the exact same time again, so want to make sure we make the most of it! Thanks in advance!
10% is not bad, you can at most squeeze another percent (I still haven't seen custom orders that are proven to be 12%, but 11% I know has been verified)

The way incentives work is, you don't subtract those until the very end, so in your X5 example it should be $85K minus dealer discount + TTL, then minus the incentives. In other words, you pay taxes on the amount before incentives.

What corporate incentives? You can't stack fleet discount if that's what you're referring to. You can stack finance APR credit and loyalty in your case. As you said, BMWCCA is a post-transaction rebate so it's not impacted.

Not sure about Texas, but in Illinois we just got hit with a trade-in tax now. Trade-in that is worth more than $10K is not allowed to be deducted from new vehicle's tax... so something to keep in mind for buyers who may be in one of these crazy-tax states
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      01-09-2020, 11:02 AM   #1345
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Any dealers in here that can confirm that there aren't many X5 40i allocations being opened up by BMW at the moment? And know when allocations will actually open back up? My dealer claims they haven't gotten any since mid-December and don't know when they'll get them. They're a high volume dealer in Atlanta and have expected them each of the last 2 weeks but nothing.

Thanks!
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      01-09-2020, 12:58 PM   #1346
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karateboi87 View Post
10% is not bad, you can at most squeeze another percent (I still haven't seen custom orders that are proven to be 12%, but 11% I know has been verified)

The way incentives work is, you don't subtract those until the very end, so in your X5 example it should be $85K minus dealer discount + TTL, then minus the incentives. In other words, you pay taxes on the amount before incentives.

What corporate incentives? You can't stack fleet discount if that's what you're referring to. You can stack finance APR credit and loyalty in your case. As you said, BMWCCA is a post-transaction rebate so it's not impacted.

Not sure about Texas, but in Illinois we just got hit with a trade-in tax now. Trade-in that is worth more than $10K is not allowed to be deducted from new vehicle's tax... so something to keep in mind for buyers who may be in one of these crazy-tax states
Thanks, very helpful! I've always felt like they include the finance/loyalty credits in their "dealer discount," as they usually seem to lump everything together. Good to know those should be kept separate. So would you say "I want 10% off before incentives" or throw out a final number (discount+finance+loyalty), or what?

Yeah I have access to the Corporate Sales Program through work, and looks like the discount on X5 matches the loyalty credit amount. It also says "Corporate Sales Program incentives can be combined with other program credits such as Lease, APR, or Cash credits. It is not combinable with the Loyalty or Conquest program. So I guess it's a wash whether you use Corporate or Loyalty, but sounds like regardless, either one can be combined with the finance APR credit, so I could expect $3000+$1250 off the dealer discount.

Unless things changed Jan 1 and I'm not aware, we can still get a tax reduction from whatever trade-in here in Texas.

Appreciate it!
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      01-09-2020, 01:13 PM   #1347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZCPM4 View Post
Thanks, very helpful! I've always felt like they include the finance/loyalty credits in their "dealer discount," as they usually seem to lump everything together. Good to know those should be kept separate. So would you say "I want 10% off before incentives" or throw out a final number (discount+finance+loyalty), or what?

Yeah I have access to the Corporate Sales Program through work, and looks like the discount on X5 matches the loyalty credit amount. It also says "Corporate Sales Program incentives can be combined with other program credits such as Lease, APR, or Cash credits. It is not combinable with the Loyalty or Conquest program. So I guess it's a wash whether you use Corporate or Loyalty, but sounds like regardless, either one can be combined with the finance APR credit, so I could expect $3000+$1250 off the dealer discount.

Unless things changed Jan 1 and I'm not aware, we can still get a tax reduction from whatever trade-in here in Texas.

Appreciate it!
No problem. You only need to worry two numbers: Percentage OFF MSRP, and doc fee. These are the only variables that can change. Doc fee varies significantly from state to state so make sure you factor that in, it can be about 1% of MSRP.

How far you want to negotiate is up to you. If you can get a low doc fee with more than 10% it'd be great, but like I said 10% is pretty decent already and puts you ahead of majority of X5 buyers (most people probably believe dealerships when they say they are losing money by selling at invoice).
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      01-10-2020, 12:49 AM   #1348
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We went to the dealer today and they started at 5% off msrp of 71500
Saying there isn’t much room in these cars obviously he’s full of it now this is a purchase so is that the normal dealer discount on purchase
I’m in NY as well
Does anyone know a better dealer within a hour on nyc ?
Plus loyalty and finance incentives
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      01-10-2020, 04:05 PM   #1349
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2020 X5M Residual and MF released yet?
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      01-10-2020, 08:38 PM   #1350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atl_1M View Post
Any dealers in here that can confirm that there aren't many X5 40i allocations being opened up by BMW at the moment? And know when allocations will actually open back up? My dealer claims they haven't gotten any since mid-December and don't know when they'll get them. They're a high volume dealer in Atlanta and have expected them each of the last 2 weeks but nothing.

Thanks!
Dallas/Ft Worth area dealer says an order can be delivered by end of Jan, but we've been discussing the build for a few weeks so it could be they used an allocation they had prior to get it started. That or he's full of it to get me locked in. Not sure.
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      01-12-2020, 05:13 AM   #1351
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sazerac_tx View Post
Dallas/Ft Worth area dealer says an order can be delivered by end of Jan, but we've been discussing the build for a few weeks so it could be they used an allocation they had prior to get it started. That or he's full of it to get me locked in. Not sure.
I have a similar concern. How do you negotiate an order not knowing if the dealer has any allocations available? You can ask them but once they have your deposit your at their mercy.
I estimate ordering a car cost 1% monthly depreciation until it’s delivered.
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      01-12-2020, 08:13 AM   #1352
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Originally Posted by HeynowbababooeyAckAck View Post
2020 X5M Residual and MF released yet?
No, when it's posted it will be in the X5/6M subforum - https://g05.bimmerpost.com/forums/fo...play.php?f=705
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      01-13-2020, 10:39 PM   #1353
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My 36 / 12K lease on custom build 2020 X5 M50i:

MSRP: $98,425
Cap Cost: $91,808 (8.25% off, plus fees)
Cap Reduction: $2,782 ($2,250 in rebates, $532 Cash (from below))
Adjusted Cap: $89,026
Residual: $55,118 (60%)
MF: 0.00137 (3.28%)
Walk away cash: $2,000
Mo. Payment: $1,234 aft. taxes.

I know there are some talking about better deals, but I negotiated the price and placed this order back in November when dealers were telling me that they had no allocation. Used the 2020 MF of 0.00137 because the residual was higher at 60% on 12k, or so I was told. I'm content with it...

About to pick this beast up in a few days. Also have my custom build M550i arriving in March.

Last edited by bMm5w; 01-13-2020 at 11:00 PM..
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      01-14-2020, 08:20 AM   #1354
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About to pick this beast up in a few days. Also have my custom build M550i arriving in March.
Congratulations! Good luck, enjoy and be safe.
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      01-15-2020, 07:03 PM   #1355
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Originally Posted by karateboi87 View Post
No problem. You only need to worry two numbers: Percentage OFF MSRP, and doc fee. These are the only variables that can change. Doc fee varies significantly from state to state so make sure you factor that in, it can be about 1% of MSRP.

How far you want to negotiate is up to you. If you can get a low doc fee with more than 10% it'd be great, but like I said 10% is pretty decent already and puts you ahead of majority of X5 buyers (most people probably believe dealerships when they say they are losing money by selling at invoice).
Quick update - so far not having any luck getting any dealers to offer more than 5-6% off, and getting lots of the "any more discount than that and we're losing money...however if you send me a competing quote at 10% off we'll match it" lines, which is totally counterintuitive, ha. How can they be simultaneously claim they can't go any lower for risk of losing money, yet be willing to match a much lower quote from another dealer? And in that case why would you not just work with that lower dealer?

Since we're doing PCD we could really work with any dealer in the US; anyone have recommendations for dealers where they've gotten closer to 10%? May just be a bad time of year to be looking...
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      01-15-2020, 07:07 PM   #1356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZCPM4 View Post
Quick update - so far not having any luck getting any dealers to offer more than 5-6% off, and getting lots of the "any more discount than that and we're losing money...however if you send me a competing quote at 10% off we'll match it" lines, which is totally counterintuitive, ha. How can they be simultaneously claim they can't go any lower for risk of losing money, yet be willing to match a much lower quote from another dealer? And in that case why would you not just work with that lower dealer?

Since we're doing PCD we could really work with any dealer in the US; anyone have recommendations for dealers where they've gotten closer to 10%? May just be a bad time of year to be looking...
Passport BMW in Maryland.
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      01-15-2020, 07:14 PM   #1357
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Originally Posted by ZCPM4 View Post
Quick update - so far not having any luck getting any dealers to offer more than 5-6% off, and getting lots of the "any more discount than that and we're losing money...however if you send me a competing quote at 10% off we'll match it" lines, which is totally counterintuitive, ha. How can they be simultaneously claim they can't go any lower for risk of losing money, yet be willing to match a much lower quote from another dealer? And in that case why would you not just work with that lower dealer?

Since we're doing PCD we could really work with any dealer in the US; anyone have recommendations for dealers where they've gotten closer to 10%? May just be a bad time of year to be looking...
Yea I know what you mean.. my CA is still claiming he's losing money on my deal, what a joke. What business sells things at loss repeatedly?

And yep... you can get 10% from dealers in Georgia and Maryland, but beware GA has much higher doc fees.
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      01-15-2020, 07:30 PM   #1358
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wxnatscaps View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZCPM4 View Post
Quick update - so far not having any luck getting any dealers to offer more than 5-6% off, and getting lots of the "any more discount than that and we're losing money...however if you send me a competing quote at 10% off we'll match it" lines, which is totally counterintuitive, ha. How can they be simultaneously claim they can't go any lower for risk of losing money, yet be willing to match a much lower quote from another dealer? And in that case why would you not just work with that lower dealer?

Since we're doing PCD we could really work with any dealer in the US; anyone have recommendations for dealers where they've gotten closer to 10%? May just be a bad time of year to be looking...
Passport BMW in Maryland.
+1

Though I'm getting feedback from various members that they're having a challenge getting 9-10%. Perhaps it's the new year versus previous year end.
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      01-15-2020, 07:36 PM   #1359
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auricom View Post
+1

Though I'm getting feedback from various members that they're having a challenge getting 9-10%. Perhaps it's the new year versus previous year end.
The sales managers' hands are literally tied when it comes to discounting cars at the start of the year. There is a volume incentive they receive from BMW NA for the holidays (typically in November and December), which goes away in January. That affects their ability to give an aggressive discount at the start of the year. I went from getting an almost 11% discount in December to only a 9% discount off MSRP in January (both before incentives) because of this.
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      01-16-2020, 10:52 AM   #1360
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Ready for an X5 M50

Hi,
I think I am ready to move forward...anyone want to join me in buying a X5 and working to get a deal for both of us? I am in North Texas, but willing to go out of state. I have an X5 on lease that is coming due. I truly appreciate all the sharing of information.

Open to your guidance!

Thanks,
Kate
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      01-16-2020, 12:10 PM   #1361
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I am game--I'm here in Dallas--but curious based on the experience of this group if this works? I've seen it mentioned a few times.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsLadyLuck View Post
Hi,
I think I am ready to move forward...anyone want to join me in buying a X5 and working to get a deal for both of us? I am in North Texas, but willing to go out of state. I have an X5 on lease that is coming due. I truly appreciate all the sharing of information.

Open to your guidance!

Thanks,
Kate
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      01-16-2020, 12:22 PM   #1362
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Cool. Sent you a DM.
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      01-16-2020, 12:26 PM   #1363
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sazerac_tx View Post
I am game--I'm here in Dallas--but curious based on the experience of this group if this works? I've seen it mentioned a few times.
I think a dealer will almost always be more inclined to give a larger discount on two purchases versus one because they get bonuses from BMW NA for the number of units sold. So if they're near their quota, two orders will help get them there faster. Plus they would probably rather make, for example, $3,000 on 2 cars versus $2,000 on 1 car. If you can coordinate well, you'll probably be able to secure two really nice deals.
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      01-16-2020, 12:29 PM   #1364
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Thank you for the feedback @bluzbra!
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