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      01-21-2020, 04:15 PM   #1
Ilyam5
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X5 M50 vs X5 M separation

I believe it was asked before - but knowing that the release of X5m i so close - is it separated enough from M50? or better question - is M50 too close to M
There was a thread separating X5M from X5M comp and the consensus was - there is not much separating them - same suspension, same torque, just some cosmetics.
so if one needs to decide M50 or X5 M base - what will truly separate them? M50 runs 3.8 to 60 and 12.3 sec 1/4 - maybe X5m will shave .3 sec of that

Equally equipped I get pricing pretty close to each other.
X5 M is 110K with exec and driving assist pack, and M50 is 107 with similar options to match M standard equipment

What I like about x5 M vs M50
- Better engine with 100 more HP and better revs
- Better cooling
- Ability to get active roll stabilization without the active steering
- Better suspension
- More driving modes configurable
- Ability to switch modes on steering wheel with m buttons instead of looking for toggle on center console
- Arguably more fun to drive

What I do not like about x5 M vs M50
- Not able to get standard comfort seats from M 50 – not a fan of comp seats. I think regular x5 M should have them as option ( like x3M)
- No trailer hitch – that is a big one – I carry bikes all the time (hence reason for SUV) and hitch is needed -so need to go aftermarket
- No 20” wheel option – would prefer light 20” rims - will Have to buy aftermarket
- Rougher ride
- Torque is higher up the rev range for around town crawling
- Fuel economy (Pulling at straws here)
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      01-21-2020, 04:23 PM   #2
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https://g05.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1683197

The M drives like an M. the M50 drives like a fast X5
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      01-21-2020, 06:30 PM   #3
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I have also thought a lot about this over the last few months since the official launch of the X5M in October. I pretty quickly decided to go with the X5MC.

In full disclosure, my brief deliberation was only between the M50i and X5MC. I never seriously considered the base X5M for two reasons - first, after its spec'd with the options I'd want, the difference from the X5MC similarly spec'd was ~$4k, and 2) you simply can't currently spec a base X5M with certain things offered on the comp version, such as the high gloss black grill surround which is standard on the comp version and an option on the M50i. The special seat belts, black badging and the 17 extra ponies are nice too.

Interestingly, the biggest reason I decided on the X5MC over the M50i is something you didn't mention in your post - the exterior body differences, and in particular the front end and the rear end. I think the front on the X5M/MC is way more aggressive than the M50i, especially in colors that contrast a bit with black. I also like the rear spoiler as well.

The second reason was (unsurprisingly) the nearly 100 more hp you with the X5MC. While one can say it may "only" translate to .3 seconds, that's not nothing...especially in this class of vehicles...and I'm will to pay for it.

The last reason is that I didn't love my color choices with the M50i. I really like MBB with the Silverstone interior...nothing close to that look with the M50i.

Candidly, I'm only concerned about two things with my choice of the X5MC over the M50i:

1. Will the X5MC be too stiff/rough around town? I will probably not ever track mine, so I want something that is still comfortable on the daily, but sporty AF. I don't mind stiff suspensions in general, but I've read quite a few complaints from buyers of the X3MC about its rough ride on this forum. I live in Dallas and the roads aren't bad compared to elsewhere, but it's not all highway driving for me.

2. Given 2020 is the first year and I'll likely get an early allocation (assuming my dealership isn't blowing smoke), will I suffer through a number of first-year issues and bugs. Maybe this is always a risk for any new model of any manufacturer offering lots of tech, but I got one of the first Porsche 991.2s in my area and I had absolutely zero issues with it. That's what I want with this.

Not sure this was all that helpful to you, but it more or less sums up my thinking about your query.
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      01-21-2020, 06:33 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbal View Post
https://g05.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1683197

The M drives like an M. the M50 drives like a fast X5
I wish it were that simple. M50 is a hell of a car. M performance cars drive very close to M cars.

Just like New M340 has nothing to give to old M3.

Days of manual rear wheel drive light M cars are over.

Today they are all heavy 4 wheel drive High HP machines.

X5 M is as heavy as M50- there is no magic, they will be very close on the track

- similar suspension
- limited slip differential
- Same weight
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      01-21-2020, 09:10 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilyam5 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbal View Post
https://g05.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1683197

The M drives like an M. the M50 drives like a fast X5
I wish it were that simple. M50 is a hell of a car. M performance cars drive very close to M cars.

Just like New M340 has nothing to give to old M3.

Days of manual rear wheel drive light M cars are over.

Today they are all heavy 4 wheel drive High HP machines.

X5 M is as heavy as M50- there is no magic, they will be very close on the track

- similar suspension
- limited slip differential
- Same weight
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilyam5 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbal View Post
https://g05.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1683197

The M drives like an M. the M50 drives like a fast X5
I wish it were that simple. M50 is a hell of a car. M performance cars drive very close to M cars.

Just like New M340 has nothing to give to old M3.

Days of manual rear wheel drive light M cars are over.

Today they are all heavy 4 wheel drive High HP machines.

X5 M is as heavy as M50- there is no magic, they will be very close on the track

- similar suspension
- limited slip differential
- Same weight
Curious what type of model car you currently drive, and have you driven the G05, or the F15 for that matter?
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      01-21-2020, 11:56 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSG5 View Post
I have also thought a lot about this over the last few months since the official launch of the X5M in October. I pretty quickly decided to go with the X5MC.

In full disclosure, my brief deliberation was only between the M50i and X5MC. I never seriously considered the base X5M for two reasons - first, after its spec'd with the options I'd want, the difference from the X5MC similarly spec'd was ~$4k, and 2) you simply can't currently spec a base X5M with certain things offered on the comp version, such as the high gloss black grill surround which is standard on the comp version and an option on the M50i. The special seat belts, black badging and the 17 extra ponies are nice too.

Interestingly, the biggest reason I decided on the X5MC over the M50i is something you didn't mention in your post - the exterior body differences, and in particular the front end and the rear end. I think the front on the X5M/MC is way more aggressive than the M50i, especially in colors that contrast a bit with black. I also like the rear spoiler as well.

The second reason was (unsurprisingly) the nearly 100 more hp you with the X5MC. While one can say it may "only" translate to .3 seconds, that's not nothing...especially in this class of vehicles...and I'm will to pay for it.

The last reason is that I didn't love my color choices with the M50i. I really like MBB with the Silverstone interior...nothing close to that look with the M50i.

Candidly, I'm only concerned about two things with my choice of the X5MC over the M50i:

1. Will the X5MC be too stiff/rough around town? I will probably not ever track mine, so I want something that is still comfortable on the daily, but sporty AF. I don't mind stiff suspensions in general, but I've read quite a few complaints from buyers of the X3MC about its rough ride on this forum. I live in Dallas and the roads aren't bad compared to elsewhere, but it's not all highway driving for me.

2. Given 2020 is the first year and I'll likely get an early allocation (assuming my dealership isn't blowing smoke), will I suffer through a number of first-year issues and bugs. Maybe this is always a risk for any new model of any manufacturer offering lots of tech, but I got one of the first Porsche 991.2s in my area and I had absolutely zero issues with it. That's what I want with this.

Not sure this was all that helpful to you, but it more or less sums up my thinking about your query.
Have you driven the last x5m/x6m? Suspension in both is nothing like that of a 911/m3/m4 that sort of thing in terms of being harsh or too stiff. There's enough tire and while firm still a decent ride. That said I like a firm suspension so it's purely subjective.
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      01-22-2020, 07:53 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilyam5 View Post
I believe it was asked before - but knowing that the release of X5m i so close - is it separated enough from M50? or better question - is M50 too close to M
There was a thread separating X5M from X5M comp and the consensus was - there is not much separating them - same suspension, same torque, just some cosmetics.
so if one needs to decide M50 or X5 M base - what will truly separate them? M50 runs 3.8 to 60 and 12.3 sec 1/4 - maybe X5m will shave .3 sec of that

Equally equipped I get pricing pretty close to each other.
X5 M is 110K with exec and driving assist pack, and M50 is 107 with similar options to match M standard equipment

What I like about x5 M vs M50
- Better engine with 100 more HP and better revs
- Better cooling
- Ability to get active roll stabilization without the active steering
- Better suspension
- More driving modes configurable
- Ability to switch modes on steering wheel with m buttons instead of looking for toggle on center console
- Arguably more fun to drive
What I do not like about x5 M vs M50
- Not able to get standard comfort seats from M 50 – not a fan of comp seats. I think regular x5 M should have them as option ( like x3M)
- No trailer hitch – that is a big one – I carry bikes all the time (hence reason for SUV) and hitch is needed -so need to go aftermarket
- No 20” wheel option – would prefer light 20” rims - will Have to buy aftermarket
- Rougher ride
- Torque is higher up the rev range for around town crawling
- Fuel economy (Pulling at straws here)
AFAIK a trailer hitch is available in Europe for the F95
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      01-22-2020, 08:52 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scotchy View Post
Have you driven the last x5m/x6m? Suspension in both is nothing like that of a 911/m3/m4 that sort of thing in terms of being harsh or too stiff. There's enough tire and while firm still a decent ride. That said I like a firm suspension so it's purely subjective.
Thanks, thatís reassuring. I have not driven the last version (or any for that matter), but Iím aware of very few complaints about it. Most people on this forum rave about itís capabilities as a very sporty daily driver, which is exactly what Iím targeting with the F95. Itís just that the F95 sounds like a completely redesigned vehicle so just a little worried based on feedback from some (not all) X3MC owners. Maybe thatís silly as itís a completely different model altogether.

To be clear, Iím getting the F95 for sure - my decision is made. Just hoping it delivers on my ever-increasing expectations!
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      01-22-2020, 10:02 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSG5 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by scotchy View Post
Have you driven the last x5m/x6m? Suspension in both is nothing like that of a 911/m3/m4 that sort of thing in terms of being harsh or too stiff. There's enough tire and while firm still a decent ride. That said I like a firm suspension so it's purely subjective.
Thanks, that’s reassuring. I have not driven the last version (or any for that matter), but I’m aware of very few complaints about it. Most people on this forum rave about it’s capabilities as a very sporty daily driver, which is exactly what I’m targeting with the F95. It’s just that the F95 sounds like a completely redesigned vehicle so just a little worried based on feedback from some (not all) X3MC owners. Maybe that’s silly as it’s a completely different model altogether.

To be clear, I’m getting the F95 for sure - my decision is made. Just hoping it delivers on my ever-increasing expectations!
Haha, that's exciting. I'd assume they haven't made it a vehicle that would be awful as a daily. As sporty as the seats are, they aren't paper thin. Tires have decent sidewall. Unless they've made the suspension way firmer than the last model you should be good.
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      01-23-2020, 07:34 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilyam5 View Post
I wish it were that simple. M50 is a hell of a car. M performance cars drive very close to M cars.

Just like New M340 has nothing to give to old M3.

Days of manual rear wheel drive light M cars are over.

Today they are all heavy 4 wheel drive High HP machines.

X5 M is as heavy as M50- there is no magic, they will be very close on the track

- similar suspension
- limited slip differential
- Same weight
Iím just saying the M50 I drove was nothing like my Ď17 X5M. The steering and brakes on my M blow the M50 away. The one I drove did not have DHP so canít compare there...the M50 without DHP was not impressive. But... Iíve driven plenty of M performance cars and yes theyíre very nice but do not offer the same experience. You need to drive an M50 and compare when the time comes. If youíre not impressed by the difference then you should get the M50

Last edited by bbal; 01-23-2020 at 07:57 AM..
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      01-30-2020, 01:03 AM   #11
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I too asked the very same question. I ended up going for an M50I Myself.

The biggest reason I was tossing and turning between the 2 cars was actually the exterior design. The X5MC definitely looks more aggressive than the M50I. However in Australia there is a $50-55k difference between the 2 cars. I didn't feel like it was quite worth the price difference.

My full reasoning in dot points went something along the lines of:
Tired of rock hard suspension.
Didn't fully utilise or track my m3.
If I want a fast fun car an M2 or another M3 down the road will do the trick.
This is a family car.
I do a lot of daily driving, a luxury feel and softer suspension will go a lot further than the improved handling and power.

My only real disappointment is the exterior but I'll learn to deal with it.

On a related note. BMW are doing a great job at offering this sort of in between model bridging the gap between a 50I and a X5MC. It's not as sporty but it's about 75% there and it is more daily driver friendly.
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      01-30-2020, 01:06 AM   #12
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Having driven a G05 and I currently own an F85, with a full blown M you are getting more than just an engine with 100 hp more. The brakes and suspension alone are very different and much more powerful. There is an element of brute force in the M that you don't get in the regular car, but it can still be refined. I found when I first had the M that I could see the suspension was much stiffer but after a short while you get used to it.

Do I like the refinement and comfort of the regular car - yes. But does the Brute Force of the M outweigh the comfort factor - YES!!!

Go for the F95, you won't regret it - its a very different beast. Just a shame the dashboard is the same as every other BMW now.
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      01-30-2020, 06:38 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rajindergill View Post
Having driven a G05 and I currently own an F85, with a full blown M you are getting more than just an engine with 100 hp more. The brakes and suspension alone are very different and much more powerful. There is an element of brute force in the M that you don't get in the regular car, but it can still be refined. I found when I first had the M that I could see the suspension was much stiffer but after a short while you get used to it.

Do I like the refinement and comfort of the regular car - yes. But does the Brute Force of the M outweigh the comfort factor - YES!!!

Go for the F95, you won't regret it - its a very different beast. Just a shame the dashboard is the same as every other BMW now.
totally agree - M performance and real M cars are totally different cars, it is not only about the horsepower and every car enthusiast knows that...
Happy for every M Performance owner, but come on guys, please do not come with the arguments "I will chip my car and then it is as fast as or even faster than the real M". with such arguments you show everyone that you do not know anything about cars....enjoy your car and be happy, M Performance are great but still not Ms
cheers
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      02-01-2020, 07:22 PM   #14
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That is an interesting discussion. Funny enough, there is a pretty much identical discussion going on between the X3 M40i and X3 M drivers.
https://x3.xbimmers.com/forums/showt...1690674&page=3
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      02-02-2020, 06:39 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexFL View Post
That is an interesting discussion. Funny enough, there is a pretty much identical discussion going on between the X3 M40i and X3 M drivers.
https://x3.xbimmers.com/forums/showt...1690674&page=3
Thanks for the link. I'll have a read for funsies.

Someone in the thread does bring up a good point, if you are wanting comfort and don't want the stiff ride of the X3M. Wouldn't the X5 be a better car than the X3 M40I?

Also was looking at Original post again. Is this part true? I think the torque is the same for both X5MC and X5 M50i?

"- Torque is higher up the rev range for around town crawling"
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      02-02-2020, 10:48 AM   #16
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X5M/X6M: 553 lb-ft. 1800-5860 rpm.
X5MC/X6MC: 553 lb-ft 1800-5890 rpm.

X5 M50i: 553 lb-ft. 1800-4800 rpm.

So, they all have the same max torque and low rev performance should be the same(till 4800rpm).

Once above 4800rpm, the M models are much more performant.

This would also feel M models to feel slower in the low revs, but in reality this is not the case.

On the other hand, X3M and X3 M40i have completely different torque curves, M40i max torque starting much lower(369 @1520rpm) and X3M 442@2600.

So no, the X5M will not have the same issue as the X3M does.
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      02-02-2020, 01:18 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laki021 View Post
X5M/X6M: 553 lb-ft. 1800-5860 rpm.
X5MC/X6MC: 553 lb-ft 1800-5890 rpm.

X5 M50i: 553 lb-ft. 1800-4800 rpm.

So, they all have the same max torque and low rev performance should be the same(till 4800rpm).

Once above 4800rpm, the M models are much more performant.

This would also feel M models to feel slower in the low revs, but in reality this is not the case.

On the other hand, X3M and X3 M40i have completely different torque curves, M40i max torque starting much lower(369 @1520rpm) and X3M 442@2600.

So no, the X5M will not have the same issue as the X3M does.
These are just numbers that do not tell the whole story. The truth is that the S58 (X3M engine) is a high revving engine that by default operates at higher rpms than the B58 (M40i). What it means that in Sport and Sport+ mode (and D2/D3 transmission setting), the X3M rpms never drop below 2/2.5k even when you just casually drive around. You only experience the lag/lack of torque in the comfort mode or when you use the D1 transmission setting. To make sure the high revving S58 doesn't overheat, BMW put in one large central radiator and two smaller radiators, an engine oil cooler, and a separate transmission oil cooler.

Last edited by AlexFL; 02-02-2020 at 02:33 PM..
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      02-02-2020, 01:21 PM   #18
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Above 2500 rpm at the traffic light, not a chance...
Same thing during normal driving.
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      02-02-2020, 02:35 PM   #19
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Quote:
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Above 2500 rpm at the traffic light, not a chance...
Same thing during normal driving.
Just went and tested it. You are partially right. At traffic light it stays at 1/1.5k. When you drive normally, the transmission keeps it at 2/2.5k rpm (Sport/Sport+).
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      02-06-2020, 01:44 PM   #20
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I have an older X5M and drove the M50l and bought it on the spot. It is the right mix sporty and fun, extremely impressed. If you never had an X5M I would agree with other posters that they are a very different vehicle. Suggest driving it once you can and making a decision, this is very subjective.
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      02-06-2020, 06:02 PM   #21
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There's still a big difference between M performance and M cars. I realize we're talking about an Suv but comparing the two, there will be noticeable differences. We'll definitely upgrade our X5 50i to the X5M once we start seeing 8-10% discounts.
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      02-06-2020, 06:14 PM   #22
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Quote:
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There's still a big difference between M performance and M cars. I realize we're talking about an Suv but comparing the two, there will be noticeable differences. We'll definitely upgrade our X5 50i to the X5M once we start seeing 8-10% discounts.
I drove first generation X5M and second X6M and can't wait for April/May to take new one home.

Each generation is so much better and I can imagine how this will be
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