[cobramite]

Originally Posted by Mattl0806

Also to add to this - do most of us here or most higher end bmw owners plan on keeping these cars to the point the v8 issues really come about? The way I’ve been going, I only care how the first 1yr lol. Maybe I’ll settle down at some point but it won’t ever be for longer than manufacturer warranty.

Too funny, there are some of us who have this disease, an enjoyable affliction. Try to hang in there for 2 or 3 years. That is enough unless your goal is to save the planet by keeping a new car for 10 years.

[eluded]

Originally Posted by cobramite

That is enough unless your goal is to save the planet by keeping a new car for 10 years.

It’s all about saving the environment.

[matowi]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

They wil only be around for a few more years so get them while they are hot.

That was my thinking exactly - why get X5 at all. Would have regretted not ordering the M60i while the opportunity was there. Switching from a g11 2021 7 series, so a big decision for me… first ever SUV and a first ever V8 in one package 😅

[JMD]

Originally Posted by eelnoraa

This really sucks. What puzzles me is what is the big change from 45e to 50e that causes this. It cannot be the new b58 because 40i on both x5 and x7 has it. Those owner don’t seem to have the same issue. So it is the Edrive portion, new Edrive motor? New/larger battery pack?? These seems like small updates, how did bmw get it so wrong.

I think it's more of the 'luck of the draw'! As in, lets say they built 15,000 50e X5s,...and there is some failure rate of a given percentage that will have issues!,...then it's just some happens that someone on Bimmerpost may very well end up with a bad copy of the 50e. I suppose there were some 45e models with an issue that had to be sorted out,...and I suspect, if we were to search and review posts on the 45e made some 2,...3,...to 3.5 years ago, we'd find posts here revealing issues with earlier 45e X5s.

If one person here posts an example of the 50e problems, the page may see it as a minor or major problem for the 50e. However, if 10,000 50e owners have no issues,...and none of the owners visit Bimmerpost,...would we here know the 50e to be just as reliable as the 45e, or other BMWs,...even though,...1 person makes a post regarding a bad issue for the model?

Naturally, this analysis can be applied to any manufacturer...on any vehicle model line-up they offer!

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by JMD

I think it's more of the 'luck of the draw'! As in, lets say they built 15,000 50e X5s,...and there is some failure rate of a given percentage that will have issues!,...then it's just some happens that someone on Bimmerpost may very well end up with a bad copy of the 50e. I suppose there were some 45e models with an issue that had to be sorted out,...and I suspect, if we were to search and review posts on the 45e made some 2,...3,...to 3.5 years ago, we'd find posts here revealing issues with earlier 45e X5s.

If one person here posts an example of the 50e problems, the page may see it as a minor or major problem for the 50e. However, if 10,000 50e owners have no issues,...and none of the owners visit Bimmerpost,...would we here know the 50e to be just as reliable as the 45e, or other BMWs,...even though,...1 person makes a post regarding a bad issue for the model?

Naturally, this analysis can be applied to any manufacturer...on any vehicle model line-up they offer!

I do agree some will have issue, most will not. This is what the industry refers to as DPM. In your example, if bmw produced 15k 50e, then I would say even if 150 have issue, dpm is already 15000, or 1%. This is huge. It is systematic, not random. But then of course we don’t know how many are impacted.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by eelnoraa

I do agree some will have issue. This is what the industry refer to as DPM. In your example, if bmw produced 15k 50e, then I would say even if 150 have issue, dpm is 15000, this is huge. It is systematic, not random. But then of course we don’t know how many is impacted.

I have been thinking of collecting some data from members to get a better idea. While it still wouldn't be a representative sample it may provide some insight. What got me was the number of folks who became members prior to either getting their 50e or having their 50e and then reporting problems. It sure seems like it is over 50% but it is tough to try determine the timing in some instances.

[JMD]

Originally Posted by eelnoraa

I do agree some will have issue. This is what the industry refer to as DPM. In your example, if bmw produced 15k 50e, then I would say even if 150 have issue, dpm is 15000, this is huge. It is systematic, not random. But then of course we don’t know how many is impacted.

Hmm, would you kindly define "DPM"? When I Google DPM,...I get "Doctors of Podiatric Medicine",..."Data Protective Management",...and "Diesel Particulate Matter",...and "Disruptive Pattern Material"!

As for your analysis of 15k built and 150 having issues,...that's 1% (...of which you know). That said, I'd venture say a lot of manufacturers would luv to have a 1% issue rate of their products! That basically means,...if 50es were bought in all 50 States,...3 in each State would potentially have an issue. The question is,...what issues are repeated the most!,...and more important, how fast can the BMW Service Centers resolve the issue(s)?

Now, given the 'luck-of-the-draw',...the 10 examples could possibly end up within a given State or Region or country,...or continent!= (...since all X5s are built in SC,...and exported world wide!

On another note, the 2024 50e that was available at Richmond BMW a few weeks ago was a "Buy-Back",...I believe. A part had failed and had to be sourced from Germany,...so the customer took delivery of some other BMW,...I think it was an iX (...or was it an X7?) they settled on.

Fyi, the color of the 50e I'm referring was BS,...M Performance Pro,...but didn't the Executive Package!


Edit: Just think if the E60 M5 had a 1% failure rate on a given issue! It would be awesome,...but it's fail rate is much higher,...as I suspect no one has ever owned an E60 M5 (out of warranty) and didn't have and issue that cost big bucks to resolve! And I suspect prolly 80-90% of them had an issue while still under warranty!

[JMD]

Originally Posted by cobramite

Too funny, there are some of us who have this disease, an enjoyable affliction. Try to hang in there for 2 or 3 years. That is enough unless your goal is to save the planet by keeping a new car for 10 years.

I've had 3 previous X5s (4.6is, 4.8is and X5 M) and I kept the 4.6is for about 2 years and kept the 4.8is for about 5 years I think. I bought it with some 23-25k miles and added about 125+ miles to the odometer. I don't recall any issues with the 4.6is;...however, I do recall 4 issues between the 4.6 and 4.8. There was an issue with the fuel level sensor and I ran out of gas on a road trip. The fuel level showed approximately 1/4 tank,...yet it ran dry! Once fixed, no other issues with it. The second issue, the battery was replaced and I wasn't familiar with the "Registering the Battery" thing,...and the Alternator later failed. I believe this occurred with the 4.8,...and to be more specific, the Voltage Regulator failed, but since the VR is built into the Alternator,...the Alternator had to be replaced. The fix cost me a cool $1000! The 3rd issue,...the 4.8is developed an issue of bellowing smoke out of the tailpipe from cylinder bank 2 on trailing throttle! I thought the valve guide seals or rings were going bad,...it still made good power,...and yielded the same MPGs on road trips, etc. After learning more about the engine,...the fix could easily had been the need for a new Crankcase Ventilation Diaphragm (gasket,...etc.)

Lastly, I had a 2013 X5 M from about 28k miles to about 96k miles and no major issues at all! Just oil/filter, tires,...and brake pads once! However, there was an issue with the driveside mirror,...it wouldn't Fold!,...and the fix was a mere $1k. I decided spending $1k to enable a mirror to fold was a good ROI!

[eelnoraa]

DPM is defect per million.

The defect here typically means a customer observed and catastrophic issue, meaning something render the product not operational. The larger the expected volume of a product (TAM = total available market)., less lower the DPM requirement. Because generally mass market products, customers are a lot less tolorable than niche exotic market. Maybe marketing and operations people can chime in.

In my work, we supply components (semi conductor) to auto motive industries, like Audi or tesla and a few others. The requirement for us is 0 DPM, meaning for certain sample size that their acceptance test, zero failure can be observed. And usually in production run phase, ~100 dpm in on going quality test is allowed. And we are not even making the whole car, so the cost of the defect so small.

As in your example, 1% of defect (customer observed and catastrophic) is actually very big. If an on going 1% of bmw have issue like this in warranty period, I think bmw may be in bankruptcy. For e60 M5, I am not sure 1% of them will have catastrophic issue within warranty. Post warranty, sure it is technically not bmw responsibility anymore. Whatever is done by bmw is their want to maintain some level of reputation. .

[Ledwinka]

I am in the market for the X5 50e, and to hear this is quite sad. On the other hand, as a former vehicle test engineer with an auto OEM, I am not surprised: PHEV is one hell of a complex vehicle, ICE+BEV+HEV combined. The coding required to handle all of this would be astronomical... for me, the real surprise is that they seemed to change the system during an LCI/FL, which is abnormal: no OEMs would touch powertrains during F/L, but again, this is about 15+ years since I left R&D role. So much efforts these days to comply with regulations and to compete with BEVs like Tesla and the like. For the X5 50e, it would require at least a year to identify further problems and iron it out, but with a FMC coming in 2026... I just hope that the MY25 X5 50e is better... I am not sure what other vehicle I should check in case... a Merc???

[eelnoraa]

Originally Posted by Ledwinka

I am in the market for the X5 50e, and to hear this is quite sad. On the other hand, as a former vehicle test engineer with an auto OEM, I am not surprised: PHEV is one hell of a complex vehicle, ICE+BEV+HEV combined. The coding required to handle all of this would be astronomical... for me, the real surprise is that they seemed to change the system during an LCI/FL, which is abnormal: no OEMs would touch powertrains during F/L, but again, this is about 15+ years since I left R&D role. So much efforts these days to comply with regulations and to compete with BEVs like Tesla and the like. For the X5 50e, it would require at least a year to identify further problems and iron it out, but with a FMC coming in 2026... I just hope that the MY25 X5 50e is better... I am not sure what other vehicle I should check in case... a Merc???

At least in my bmw experience, they usually chsnge drive chain the middle of body style. E39 changed from 528 to 530 (M52 to M54), . E46 changed for 323/328 to 325/330 (M52 to M54). E90 change from 325/330 to 328/335 (N52 to N54), E82 135 changed from N54 to N55 …. In fact, I think they purpose do that.

The smaller changes were usually for the better, but bmw can sure messed up. The big change, say from N52 to N54, adding the turbos for the first time created lots of issue. I somehow don’t see how 45e to 50e changes are that big.

Complexity of bmw engines do increase exponentially IMO. If you ever do a valve cover job in a non turbo inline 6 (M54), then a turbo inline 6(N54), thr former is a child’s play compare to thr later.

[eluded]

They probably will have most of the bugs worked out by MY2005. BMW loves to change powertrains during LCI, for example the F30 LCI was got a new motor B58. Early B58's might have some issues, looking at you #6 stuck open injector.

For the 50E, the transmission/electric motor is supplied by ZF and from what I've seen there don't seem to be many issues with the actual powertrain. The motor is a third update of the B58 and should be pretty solid. The problems seem to be with the coolant valves to maintain the temperature the battery, problems with the battery itself and software. Other issues might be simple but BMW couldn't source the part(s) in time for the car to be lemon'd. I've never seen so many buybacks on a vehicle in a forum before

Originally Posted by Ledwinka

PHEV is one hell of a complex vehicle, ICE+BEV+HEV combined. The coding required to handle all of this would be astronomical... for me, the real surprise is that they seemed to change the system during an LCI/FL, which is abnormal: no OEMs would touch powertrains during F/L, but again, this is about 15+ years since I left R&D role. So much efforts these days to comply with regulations and to compete with BEVs like Tesla and the like. For the X5 50e, it would require at least a year to identify further problems and iron it out, but with a FMC coming in 2026... I just hope that the MY25 X5 50e is better... I am not sure what other vehicle I should check in case... a Merc???

[BourbonJ]

We bought a 50e on 9/28/23, 3 days later it was flat towed back to dealership were it has been in repair service to this day 1/14/2024 (108 days). BMWNA is "reluctantly" buying the 50e back this week. In our case the problem was the BMU(Battery Management Electronic Unit), the replacement unit was ordered from Germany, but even with BMWNA Tech assistance they could not and have not resolve the problem for 3 months.

There is a chance they got another defective BMU or like in this forum it has become a systematic problem that BMWNA wants to fix before sending out any more 50e. I can see BMW not wanting customers to cancel their orders if they admit to a problem they are trying to resolve, so that could be part of reason they are running silent on production halt or reduced production.

This Forum has been a great place to find out, unfortunately, the many safety issues and problems the 2024 BMW X5 50e has been having.

I hope others will join me in reporting these issues to the NHTSA at https://www.nhtsa.gov/report-a-safety-problem#vehicle. It is a pretty simple process to fill out.

We still love the BMW, but we need to hold BMW accountable to fix the problem(s) and help others not go thru the same problems and safety issues we are going through, best way is to officially document them with the NHTSA.

[BMPHIL]

Surely the BMU should have been tested before shipping, not good enough hope you don't have issues with your next car.

[mnx5er]

Originally Posted by BourbonJ

We bought a 50e on 9/28/23, 3 days later it was flat towed back to dealership were it has been in service to this day 1/14/2024 (108 days). BMWNA is "reluctantly" buying the 50e back this week. In our case the problem was the BMU(Battery Management Electronic Unit), the replacement unit was ordered from Germany, but even with BMWNA Tech assistance they could not and have not resolve the problem for 3 months.

There is a chance they got another defective BMU or like in this forum it has become a systematic problem that BMWNA wants to fix before sending out any more 50e. I can see BMW not wanting customers to cancel their orders if they admit to a problem they are trying to resolve, so that could be part of reason they are running silent on production halt or reduced production.

This Forum has been a great place to find out, unfortunately, the many safety issues and problems the 2024 BMW X5 50e has been having.

I hope others will join me in reporting these issues to the NHTSA at https://www.nhtsa.gov/report-a-safety-problem#vehicle. It is a pretty simple process to fill out.

We still love the BMW, but to hold BMW accountable to fix the problem(s) and help others not go thru the same problems and safety issues we are going through, we need to officially document them with the NHTSA.

When I see a post like this I just shake my head at BMW. How are they justifying selling these things? They have to acknowledge they are selling random lemons and leaving the rest of us 50e owners nervous about our next trip.

Really embarrassing BMW. Hope you are reading this thread.

[SRCTG29]

Just to add a positive experience on the 50e - I took delivery in September 23 and have had 10k miles of trouble free motoring since . It has been truly excellent thus far and comparing to my previous MB’s where I had a fair few issues feels a step above.

[jphcbpa]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

They wil only be around for a few more years so get them while they are hot.

X5 m60 Might be my next bmw… in production until June 2026

[bmwx3805]

Contact tk’s garage on YouTube

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by jphcbpa

X5 m60 Might be my next bmw… in production until June 2026

July 2026

[JS8041]

Originally Posted by aakeller

I am writing this for those of you that have not yet purchased your 50e and are on the fence because of the known battery issues. I hope that our experience will save you the headache and convince you to purchase a different model. We ordered our 50e at the end of July. The build process was pretty typical, but the vehicle did spend 4 weeks in quality check. This should have been a red flag to us, but this was my dream car and we proceeded. The vehicle was delivered on 10/6 and I was instantly in love with my vehicle. Over the next couple of weeks there were several times where the car would stop charging and the check engine light would come on, but go off the next day. Fast forward to 11/1. My husband was driving home from work and the light came on again but this time it was flashing red and said drivetrain malfunction. We had to have the vehicle towed to the dealership at this point, and it has been there ever since. It was several weeks before they had a plan of what to do, and initially we were told that they were going to replace the CCU and a part that helps cool the battery, but now the plan is that they are going to try and replace individual cells in the battery. These parts are coming from Germany and are not expected until the end of January. Best case scenario is that we get our car back at the beginning of February. 3 months of paying a car note on a vehicle we don’t have. We requested a buy back from BMW and it was denied. We contacted a lawyer and unfortunately this vehicle does not yet qualify for the lemon law in our state because we have to give them an opportunity to fix it even though we are not confident that they can. The 30 day clause does not apply in Texas because we have a loaner vehicle. I will never have confidence in this vehicle, and am beyond angry at how BMW is handling this situation. We are being treated as beta testers for the many 50e’s out there with this issue. Save yourself the headache and purchase another X5 model or wait until next year when they have this problem fixed, hopefully.

I'm sorry this happened to you. We had the same issue with our 45e, and I also had hoped the issue would be fixed with the 50e, but I'm sad it's still happening. I'd love to see a thread with all the 45e and 50e cards that have been flawless. I just can't bring myself back around to buying one, it wasn't worth the headache.

[aakeller]

It’s still in the service department. It’s now been there for almost 5 months. Buying that car was one of the biggest mistakes I’ve ever made.

[Mattl0806]

Originally Posted by aakeller

It’s still in the service department. It’s now been there for almost 5 months. Buying that car was one of the biggest mistakes I’ve ever made.

Hang in there. It wasn’t a mistake you made. I think a mistake in case would imply you knew this might happen. You’re just unlucky that’s all. You made the best decision you thought at the time with the info you had.