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      03-17-2023, 10:51 AM   #23
DocWeatherington
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Originally Posted by Blue87 View Post
There's probably little we can do about food, however consumers can fight back at rapidly increasing home and auto prices by not buying if not absolutely necessary (I know, tall order). When consumers pay exorbitant prices with out protest, then companies continue to raise them. Typically these kinds of prices rarely drop once raised, except for during a 2008 like financial crisis or extremely low sales. During periods of low sales manufacturers will usually offer rebates and other incentives to move inventory. While automobile prices may not immediately return to yester-year's prices, heavy rebates can soften the load until they do. Lots of trickle down effects here, and I only considered the consumer.
They won't care...only things folks can do is prevent dealership markups up to a point.

But your the customer they are the seller. Increase costs will always be absorbed by the customer as at the end of the day any business has a bottom line of overhead costs and stands to make a profit. Tons of suppliers in the background.


The days of massive rebates are gone as manufacturers will not pump out cars in which the demand isnt there and will simply throttle plants. This was a lesson learned with covid

https://www.reuters.com/business/aut...es-2023-02-24/

If the hottest market in the US is trucks and the 3 largest manufacturers are doing it everyone else will follow suit.... Keep supply within demand and have things built to order.


Now in an ideal world if materials costs drop down, they would do price cuts ..one would hope so..but why should they as shareholders care about net profits. Could they pass that to consumers with large discounts ... Idk

Look at Telsa... That burnt a lot of people and messes up vehicle values, lease values, loans.

That 70k car you just bought new yesterday, is worth 60k right off the showroom floor.

Your now 10k in the hole plus interest and the bank won't give two shits neither will the manufacturer. As those that did a lease will fine, the other half that bought
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      03-17-2023, 10:52 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by r33_RGSport View Post
Seems like the snowball effect from Covid getting bigger and bigger.
Soon minimum wage in California will be $30/hr.
Haha
Isn't it already?
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      03-17-2023, 10:54 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by BobBeau View Post
And businesses will close because they can't afford to pay a $30 an hour wage.
Will just complete the circle of life and pass the cost to the customer.
That Big Mac meal will be 18 dollars
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      03-17-2023, 12:47 PM   #26
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Congrats, you've all just described inflation lol.
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      03-17-2023, 01:17 PM   #27
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Capitalism with cost transfer to consumers. Oil companies making Billons of $ in profit. Groceries to raw materials all getting expensive. Post pandemic greed to recover from the Covid lull. What goes up rarely comes down.

Curios how much the insurance premiums went up on the M vehicles in last two years.
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      03-17-2023, 02:43 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DocWeatherington View Post
They won't care...only things folks can do is prevent dealership markups up to a point.

But your the customer they are the seller. Increase costs will always be absorbed by the customer as at the end of the day any business has a bottom line of overhead costs and stands to make a profit. Tons of suppliers in the background.


The days of massive rebates are gone as manufacturers will not pump out cars in which the demand isnt there and will simply throttle plants. This was a lesson learned with covid

https://www.reuters.com/business/aut...es-2023-02-24/

If the hottest market in the US is trucks and the 3 largest manufacturers are doing it everyone else will follow suit.... Keep supply within demand and have things built to order.


Now in an ideal world if materials costs drop down, they would do price cuts ..one would hope so..but why should they as shareholders care about net profits. Could they pass that to consumers with large discounts ... Idk

Look at Telsa... That burnt a lot of people and messes up vehicle values, lease values, loans.

That 70k car you just bought new yesterday, is worth 60k right off the showroom floor.

Your now 10k in the hole plus interest and the bank won't give two shits neither will the manufacturer. As those that did a lease will fine, the other half that bought
I believe what you’re describing is ‘demand destruction’. And yes, prices will continue to climb for the foreseeable future.
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      03-17-2023, 02:59 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bavarianboar View Post
Capitalism with cost transfer to consumers. Oil companies making Billons of $ in profit. Groceries to raw materials all getting expensive. Post pandemic greed to recover from the Covid lull. What goes up rarely comes down.

Curios how much the insurance premiums went up on the M vehicles in last two years.
No change ..

My 19 M5 comp I just dropped a week ago is the same as my 23Comp...

M5 had a msrp of 117/ M3 107.

Rates have been constant here from the start
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      03-17-2023, 06:51 PM   #30
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I’m happy I went with my 2023! This is nice but idk think I like the one I have better to be honest.
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      03-17-2023, 09:05 PM   #31
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Sorry to burst some of your bubbles. As a person who works at a manufacturer of products that go globally I can say that the price is based off of what the market can tolerate not the actual cost of the goods.

Don’t get me wrong the goods will always sell at a profit but we know the US market tolerates the largest markups so guess who pays the most for the same goods that other countries pay less for. That’s just the reality of companies making money. How can you creatively extract the most out of the places willing to spend the most.

So yes buying less will affect the price as companies still need to sell to make a profit however the US market isn’t coordinated enough to stop buying as a whole and there are lots of people in the US with money that always keep buying no matter what the state of the economy is. So the prices will keep going up until it’s not making enough profit… sorry that’s the reality. For some of us BMWs will not be in our future as they will get out of reach… for others it won’t matter they will keep buying… another reality. Sorry.
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      03-18-2023, 09:57 AM   #32
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BMW To Pause Raising Prices On Premium Vehicles After Years Of 40% Increases
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      03-18-2023, 10:59 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DocWeatherington View Post
The entire market is up its the new normal. People need to deal with the pay to play.

How much is a gallon of milk today vs what it was in 2019 or any fast food?

At some point everyone will need a new car and it is what it is.

Interest rates could easily be had a 0-1% 16 months ago ...today it's 6-9% with good credit .
Main reason in the US now is not supply chain but because we still have very low unemployment rate, people willing to leverage up their debt to pre pandemic levels after reducing debt and people treating luxury as a need vs luxury.

We also have less competition now across the board due to PE funds owning all sorts of companies (not saying PE is bad, but it is what it is) so being able to control supply for in elastic goods to increase prices.

These are cyclical trends and eventually consumers will run out of runway to pay…the moment a recession is declared we’ll see prices fall rapidly since inventory is building up but not being sold…

So, we’ll see. I am with Alan in that, if I were in his shoes I would also wait rather than pay the extra BMW price increase since their own costs have not gone up at the same level. How do we know? Their profits and margins are both at record levels. That’s how we know they are simply leveraging their power over consumers.

I can’t believe people were paying $15K market adjustments for Kia SUVs a few months back! You can literally get them at MSRP and even below now - same model!
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      03-18-2023, 11:02 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobBeau View Post
And businesses will close because they can't afford to pay a $30 an hour wage.
In most cases the US minimum wage is below market rates so it doesn’t matter. But if you raise it to above market rates, you will get businesses that will have to move or close…wages are set by business. CA govt employees have a great deal however. That is probably where a lot of the budget is going now. 😂
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      03-19-2023, 09:23 PM   #35
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I’ve built one it was 136k which for what it is it’s not too crazy given that’s 2k over the starting price on the M8. What is crazy is that my M8 build (141k) would be cheaper then the X6M given the 10-11% discounts brokers currently have on the M8. Too bad my wife won’t allow me to get a coupe 😔
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      03-21-2023, 12:35 AM   #36
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Dang, Was going to upgrade from ‘22 X3M Comp; but I’ll wait and get a ‘24 X5M CPO in a few years when my lease is up. Residuals are 52% plus the phony CPO charge; still cheaper than brand new.
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      03-21-2023, 10:07 PM   #37
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      03-22-2023, 08:49 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DocWeatherington View Post
The entire market is up its the new normal. People need to deal with the pay to play.

How much is a gallon of milk today vs what it was in 2019 or any fast food?

At some point everyone will need a new car and it is what it is.

Interest rates could easily be had a 0-1% 16 months ago ...today it's 6-9% with good credit .
I agree with this. However, I think it’s unsustainable in the current economic climate (car loan defaults at an all time high). I predict these will sit and be heavily discounted in the not so distant future.
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