[atl_1M]

Spy shots show the LCI X5M Comp will be getting a new grill shaped similar to the X6M. The non-M X5 LCIs will keep a similar shape to current grill. Just another difference, albeit cosmetic, between the X5M Comp vs X5 M60i in case you were wondering

[Mako]

BMW is simply reducing how many different engines they are producing as the shift to electric starts.

Just like how M2 will have M3 engine but at a lower tune.

Why make the M50i engine and True M when they are so similar In performance, seems smart to do this. Anyone who wants to save $30k can buy M60i and tune it to X5M levels…

[Hit_Apex]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

As mentioned, the base X5 M model is going away and it will just be offered as the X5 M Competition.

I understand that and agree. I'm trying to reconcile his first sentence regarding M60i and X5M getting the same engine. Assuming he meant X5MC, that will get the S68 hybrid - so either way it's confusing.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by Hit_Apex

I understand that and agree. I'm trying to reconcile his first sentence regarding M60i and X5M getting the same engine. Assuming he meant X5MC, that will get the S68 hybrid - so either way it's confusing.

They will both be getting the S68 engine according to the information he has provided. Makes sense since the 7 series and X7 will also be getting. As far as I know, he has never been wrong.

[Spectremotorsports]

Originally Posted by robopp

Very weird. I thought S motors were for real M models only? I guess not anymore.

Or alternatively, this now has an S motor, and an M badge, and it exists, so by that rule IS a "real" M model. Motoring it's way right past the gatekeepers.

[Game]

Originally Posted by Hit_Apex

I thought the X5M is going away with the LCI gen in favor of the M60i with some form of S63 (de)tune and the X5MC with the new S68?

Current X5 M50 will become the X5 M60.

X5M is dropping the base model.

[robopp]

Originally Posted by Spectremotorsports

Or alternatively, this now has an S motor, and an M badge, and it exists, so by that rule IS a "real" M model. Motoring it's way right past the gatekeepers.

It 1000% is not a real M. Its M badge is synonymous with the s-line badge of Audi.

[Hit_Apex]

Originally Posted by Game

Current X5 M50 will become the X5 M60.

X5M is dropping the base model.

I would suggest the M60i is closer to the current X5M than the M50i but get your point from a lineup perspective.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by Hit_Apex

I would suggest the M60i is closer to the current X5M than the M50i but get your point from a lineup perspective.

That is interesting, can you explain your thinking on that? The way I look at it is the HP is staying the same so performance wise the only thing that is changing is the engine name. Even if the HP increased a bit, there is so much difference between M Performance vehicles and M cars that the HP wouldn't make any difference as far as the M60 approaching the current X5M.

[FCX5]

Originally Posted by Spectremotorsports

Or alternatively, this now has an S motor, and an M badge, and it exists, so by that rule IS a "real" M model. Motoring it's way right past the gatekeepers.

Yup. Even Land Rover gets the S63. BMW must be making a lot of these engines…

https://www.bmwblog.com/2022/01/31/2...mw-s63-engine/

[xlover]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

Not sure why you are equating one with the other but I don't think the mild hybrid systems are changing at all with the LCI.

As far as the 50e is concerned, the electric motors will likely be the same and they are just not detuning the ICE like they do in the current version.

1) I strongly doubt the PHEV power boost is all ice motor, clearly they have a special tune to pair with the electric motor considering how it was reduced on power in the current gen

2) The mild hybrid assist: at minimum (beyond the inside info pointing in that direction) we have strong directional evidence the V8s are getting a more powerful hybrid assist beyond the 11hp available today on the 40i models. total output should rise high enough to merit the M60 designation. Bmw tends to tie designations to the power rating bands.

50i generally represents around 500hp hence why the new 480hp 7 and x5 plugin are 50i and the 516 hp iX and top end i4 at 536hp is a 50i. If the M60 v8 cars were going to be close to those ratings they would retain the M50i designation.

The 60i cars are in the around 600hp band (outgoing m760 and iX m60 both 600hp+

40i 350hp band
35i 300hp "
30i 250hp "
28i 230hp "

Obviously it's not a hard rule especially when high output smaller engines, electrics, and diesels are considered but reasonably consistent for the current lineup

all things considered I doubt they would have an x5 m60/x7m60/760 sitting next to an iX 50i or i7 50 with only a few hp difference and the iX m60 carrying the same designation at ~90 more hp. Additionally, bmw has not treated the current mild hybrid from a marketing perspective as much more than a fancier start/stop. I can't imagine they would go from "nothing" to being a differentiator worthy of increasing a model designation up a level without improving the technology and output. I expect hybrid boost to be in the 30hp-50hp range and boost more often.

Circling back to how the PHEV change fits in, with the plug in power rating up they could also apply a more powerful hybrid assist to the 40i models without stepping on the plug-in toes and maintaining the model line logic gap

[mjr24]

Originally Posted by Spectremotorsports

Or alternatively, this now has an S motor, and an M badge, and it exists, so by that rule IS a "real" M model. Motoring it's way right past the gatekeepers.

I'm so tired of hearing the argument about the M models versus non-M models. The difference is like $30k….that's what the difference is. It's just as much about status. No one is ever going to confuse a damn M-performance model with a real M car. I saw 3 M50i models driving the 60 miles to Chicago last week. I've literally never seen another X5M on the road.

[Luminor513]

The 50e sounds like a winner.

[PLF69]

You feel the difference when you ride in it, the real M will always feel a LOT stiffer !

I was looking into the 4xe GC but with this new 50e coming it's steering be back very hard !

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by xlover

1) I strongly doubt the PHEV power boost is all ice motor, clearly they have a special tune to pair with the electric motor considering how it was reduced on power in the current gen

2) The mild hybrid assist: at minimum (beyond the inside info pointing in that direction) we have strong directional evidence the V8s are getting a more powerful hybrid assist beyond the 11hp available today on the 40i models. total output should rise high enough to merit the M60 designation. Bmw tends to tie designations to the power rating bands.

50i generally represents around 500hp hence why the new 480hp 7 and x5 plugin are 50i and the 516 hp iX and top end i4 at 536hp is a 50i. If the M60 v8 cars were going to be close to those ratings they would retain the M50i designation.

The 60i cars are in the around 600hp band (outgoing m760 and iX m60 both 600hp+

40i 350hp band
35i 300hp "
30i 250hp "
28i 230hp "

Obviously it's not a hard rule especially when high output smaller engines, electrics, and diesels are considered but reasonably consistent for the current lineup

all things considered I doubt they would have an x5 m60/x7m60/760 sitting next to an iX 50i or i7 50 with only a few hp difference and the iX m60 carrying the same designation at ~90 more hp. Additionally, bmw has not treated the current mild hybrid from a marketing perspective as much more than a fancier start/stop. I can't imagine they would go from "nothing" to being a differentiator worthy of increasing a model designation up a level without improving the technology and output. I expect hybrid boost to be in the 30hp-50hp range and boost more often.

Circling back to how the PHEV change fits in, with the plug in power rating up they could also apply a more powerful hybrid assist to the 40i models without stepping on the plug-in toes and maintaining the model line logic gap

So far the information points to it just being an ICE increase.

Highly doubt there will be much, if any, increase in the mild-hybrid HP output but it is possible. The inside info points to this in some instances and some it is not clear.

I guess time will tell.

[MachinesWithSouls]

*Sheepishly raises hand…*

If the X5 M no longer has a base model, and the comp is the only way it comes, then isn't that…an X5 M? Never understood the Competition variants. Just make the enhancements standard and raise the base price.

[ChillyB]

Originally Posted by Game

Nice. I notice HK is currently back for the 45e (though the site doesn't reflect that).

Oh it does!

[sahajesh]

Originally Posted by Spectremotorsports

Or alternatively, this now has an S motor, and an M badge, and it exists, so by that rule IS a "real" M model. Motoring it's way right past the gatekeepers.

As if all that makes an M car is the engine. Not hard to understand there's a lot more behind the true M than just an S engine.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by MachinesWithSouls

*Sheepishly raises hand…*

If the X5 M no longer has a base model, and the comp is the only way it comes, then isn't that…an X5 M? Never understood the Competition variants. Just make the enhancements standard and raise the base price.

Yes, it really is just a marketing strategy. We are seeing more M cars just available with the competition moniker. I think one of reasons for that is to provide a differentiator between the M Performance and the "M's".

[Game]

Originally Posted by ChillyB

Oh it does!

Even better! It did not earlier in the week.

[arlind94]

Originally Posted by mjr24

I'm so tired of hearing the argument about the M models versus non-M models. The difference is like $30k….that's what the difference is. It's just as much about status. No one is ever going to confuse a damn M-performance model with a real M car. I saw 3 M50i models driving the 60 miles to Chicago last week. I've literally never seen another X5M on the road.

Anyone who knows the brand or cars in general knows they're not the same. Anyone who wonders what's the difference or thinks it's not different, has never driven the two.

[sahajesh]

Originally Posted by arlind94

Anyone who knows the brand or cars in general knows they're not the same. Anyone who wonders what's the difference or thinks it's not different, has never driven the two.

Or even been near the two.