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      09-08-2020, 02:00 AM   #1
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Anyone cross shopped Q8 prior?

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Just wondering if anyone has checked out / test driven the Q8 before getting the G05? Your opinion pls on the Q8?
Thank you in advance...
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      09-08-2020, 09:48 AM   #2
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Previous Q7 owner, so yes, shopped the Q7, Q8, and actually Volvo. Volvo, just no - 4 cylinder, multiple reliability issues. Q8 - and I'll throw in Q7 - have the same issues I had with my 2018 Q7, plus some. The software and out of the box reliability is more robust IMO than BMW's - i.e., it generally works. No misaligned cameras, no misaligned hoods, no wrinkly seats. That said, still horrible throttle lag (I attribute to dual clutch), still poor ergonomics (ACC controls on steering column vice the steering wheel), still missing features I like (US cars -Autohold, cupholder covers, real programmable shortcut buttons), poor Nav and voice response - sometimes took several minutes to even connect, and still does. And worst of all, to me, exclusive digital controls. Not just my opinion, but an inferior interface for operating a moving vehicle. Your mileage may vary.
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      09-08-2020, 10:15 AM   #3
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I cross shopped the following cars with the X5:

Audi Q8:
Pros: Loved the look of it in general, and they had a beautiful turquoise color that I definitely would have gotten had I gone with the Q8. The back seats are great, much better than the X5's IMO. The general look of the cabin is quite nice.
Cons: Turbo Lag/Throttle Lag/Something Lag. The lag was catastrophic and a deal breaker. Too much reliance on touch screens. Curiously, there was no remote start. When we asked why that was the sales lady said, "because it's illegal in Germany", which made absolutely no sense, because both of my Bimmers have remote start (including the German made 3 series).

Mercedes GLE450:
Pros: In the beginning, I felt MBUX was a bit more refined than iDrive (iDrive has since fixed quite a few issues and is a much better system). There's a definite wow factor with the huge screen. Back seat was great and extremely roomy.
Cons: It just didn't drive that nicely. It felt wobbly and did not inspire confidence at all. The powertrain isn't as good in real world as it is on paper. The mild hybrid system didn't seem to help much at all. Besides that giant screen, the rest of the interior was a bit bland.

Porsche Cayenne:
Pros: Felt planted, great handling. By far the most customizable car on this list. Strong leather smell (I personally love the smell of leather, so if you don't this would be a con).
Cons: The Porsche tax. An equivalently optioned Cayenne was $20k higher than anything else on this list. I didn't feel like paying $20k for something that functionally wasn't much superior than the X5. The Cayenne handled better, but other than that I felt the X5 had a nicer interior, and did "SUV things" better (space, comfort, luxury etc).


At the end I felt the X5 was the best combination of ride quality, comfort, features, and overall luxury. I had no allegiance to BMW prior to this X5, so I went in totally unbiased. But as a result of how impressed I came away, I ended up getting a 2nd BMW (m340i) within a couple weeks of ordering the X5.
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      09-08-2020, 01:17 PM   #4
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I didn't shop a Q8, but I did shop the X5 45e vs the Cayenne E Hybrid. I ended up going Cayenne, but the X5 was pretty nice (it is currently at BMW of Austin, Arctic grey w/ Tartufo 45e). I built them both as close as I could, some things I couldn't get on the BMW (suspension upgrades, have air and PDCC, more customization was appreciated on the Cayenne). So being as one to one as possible, the Cayenne was $30k more. I think that many things were nicer in the Porsche, but I wouldn't have been sad to go with the 45e either. That said, the Audi forums have a lot of complaints with turbo lag on the Q8s, the SQ8 may solve that if you are looking for a V8.
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      09-08-2020, 09:52 PM   #5
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I have to agree about the lag on Q8. I tried it and it didn't feel right at all, even with sports mode turned on. I'm a first time BMW owner.
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      09-08-2020, 10:44 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wtwo3 View Post
I cross shopped the following cars with the X5:

Audi Q8:
Pros: Loved the look of it in general, and they had a beautiful turquoise color that I definitely would have gotten had I gone with the Q8. The back seats are great, much better than the X5's IMO. The general look of the cabin is quite nice.
Cons: Turbo Lag/Throttle Lag/Something Lag. The lag was catastrophic and a deal breaker. Too much reliance on touch screens. Curiously, there was no remote start. When we asked why that was the sales lady said, "because it's illegal in Germany", which made absolutely no sense, because both of my Bimmers have remote start (including the German made 3 series).

Mercedes GLE450:
Pros: In the beginning, I felt MBUX was a bit more refined than iDrive (iDrive has since fixed quite a few issues and is a much better system). There's a definite wow factor with the huge screen. Back seat was great and extremely roomy.
Cons: It just didn't drive that nicely. It felt wobbly and did not inspire confidence at all. The powertrain isn't as good in real world as it is on paper. The mild hybrid system didn't seem to help much at all. Besides that giant screen, the rest of the interior was a bit bland.

Porsche Cayenne:
Pros: Felt planted, great handling. By far the most customizable car on this list. Strong leather smell (I personally love the smell of leather, so if you don't this would be a con).
Cons: The Porsche tax. An equivalently optioned Cayenne was $20k higher than anything else on this list. I didn't feel like paying $20k for something that functionally wasn't much superior than the X5. The Cayenne handled better, but other than that I felt the X5 had a nicer interior, and did "SUV things" better (space, comfort, luxury etc).


At the end I felt the X5 was the best combination of ride quality, comfort, features, and overall luxury. I had no allegiance to BMW prior to this X5, so I went in totally unbiased. But as a result of how impressed I came away, I ended up getting a 2nd BMW (m340i) within a couple weeks of ordering the X5.

excellent write up. i also looked at the cayenne and the one i configured was 23K more than the X5. I, like you decided on the X5. Both your bimmers have remote start but that isint an option on the cars bound for germany
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      09-08-2020, 11:18 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wtwo3 View Post
I cross shopped the following cars with the X5:

Audi Q8:
[COLOR="Teal"]Pros:[/COLOR] Loved the look of it in general, and they had a beautiful turquoise color that I definitely would have gotten had I gone with the Q8. The back seats are great, much better than the X5's IMO. The general look of the cabin is quite nice.
[COLOR="Red"]Cons:[/COLOR] Turbo Lag/Throttle Lag/Something Lag. The lag was catastrophic and a deal breaker. Too much reliance on touch screens. Curiously, there was no remote start. When we asked why that was the sales lady said, "because it's illegal in Germany", which made absolutely no sense, because both of my Bimmers have remote start (including the German made 3 series).

Mercedes GLE450:
[COLOR="teal"]Pros:[/COLOR] In the beginning, I felt MBUX was a bit more refined than iDrive (iDrive has since fixed quite a few issues and is a much better system). There's a definite wow factor with the huge screen. Back seat was great and extremely roomy.
[COLOR="Red"]Cons:[/COLOR] It just didn't drive that nicely. It felt wobbly and did not inspire confidence at all. The powertrain isn't as good in real world as it is on paper. The mild hybrid system didn't seem to help much at all. Besides that giant screen, the rest of the interior was a bit bland.

Porsche Cayenne:
[COLOR="Teal"]Pros:[/COLOR] Felt planted, great handling. By far the most customizable car on this list. Strong leather smell (I personally love the smell of leather, so if you don't this would be a con).
[COLOR="Red"]Cons:[/COLOR] The Porsche tax. An equivalently optioned Cayenne was $20k higher than anything else on this list. I didn't feel like paying $20k for something that functionally wasn't much superior than the X5. The Cayenne handled better, but other than that I felt the X5 had a nicer interior, and did "SUV things" better (space, comfort, luxury etc).


At the end I felt the X5 was the best combination of ride quality, comfort, features, and overall luxury. I had no allegiance to BMW prior to this X5, so I went in totally unbiased. But as a result of how impressed I came away, I ended up getting a 2nd BMW (m340i) within a couple weeks of ordering the X5.
Nice write up. I have a M340 and it's a blast to drive. Thinking of trading up to a X5MC next year or 2
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      09-09-2020, 12:24 AM   #8
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I had a Q8 loaner for over a month and can confirm the lag is awful. It's a deal breaker on all new modern Audi's for me. And it seems to be mostly lag from the transmission and throttle calibration from what I can tell because Porsche uses the same 3.0 engine in the Panamera and Cayenne and does not suffer from the same problem.

I also agree that the Idrive blows the doors off the dual touch screen interface. On the plus side, the Audi has great build quality and much sharper and accurate steering.
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      09-09-2020, 07:44 PM   #9
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I looked at the Q8, GLE 450, & Cayenne as well. I think the guy who posted his pros and cons above was spot on.

I was excited Audi was coming out with something other than the Q7 which is minivan'ish in appearance to me. I wasn't impressed with the lag on the Q8 & expected more. It did handle well but didn't feel sporty enough to me. I also wasn't as impressed in person. It was nice but I didn't have this I love it feeling.

The GLE my husband hated the back end. He said the styling fell off once you passed the back doors. It drove well but it didn't have the ass in it when I hit the pedal. His friend is the GM so I was bummed as we could have gotten a great deal on it. I feel like I would have settled in the GLE just because of a deal.

This is my first BMW. I always hated the look on the interior and felt it was boring and dated. I didn't even want to look at the X5. We finally stopped one evening & I was impressed with the way they upgraded the the styling. We drove a 40i & I was pleasantly surprised with the engine. My husband then insisted we drive the M50i for comparison. Let's just say there wasn't much of one. Each time I went to compare what I had test driven I was always comparing every other vehicle to the X5. I'm 10 months in now and have no complaints. The seats leave a little to be desired but it's not a deal breaker. Every time I start the X5 I smile listening to the engine. It's a fun vehicle to drive. I also do the occasional glance back when I'm walking away from it in parking lot. If I continue to stay problem free I can see myself in another one down the road.
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      09-09-2020, 10:43 PM   #10
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Thank you everyone for the valuable input. i think the body style of Q8 is beautiful. When I did more research, people showed me pictures of the finger prints on the two control panels of Q8. The compartment storage between the two front seats is very small. So maybe i was receiving biased feedback but I am now getting consistent feedback. Just need to go test drive and see how it feels behind the wheels. I have a feeling, i will end up with the G05.
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      09-10-2020, 12:18 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyer1234 View Post
Thank you everyone for the valuable input. i think the body style of Q8 is beautiful. When I did more research, people showed me pictures of the finger prints on the two control panels of Q8. The compartment storage between the two front seats is very small. So maybe i was receiving biased feedback but I am now getting consistent feedback. Just need to go test drive and see how it feels behind the wheels. I have a feeling, i will end up with the G05.
I almost bought a Q8. You really need to understand the base problem of what is called the “lag”. This is their auto start/stop (ASS) engaging at speeds under about 20 mph when coasting. The engine shuts off while coasting, so if you see a car coming at you and floor it to avoid a collision, the engine needs to start and then it can go. This lag can be a couple seconds and has raised SERIOUS safety issues with the vehicle. When I last looked, there was still no way to code ASS off. People would turn the tranny into sport mode all the time to avoid the issue, but that doesn’t seem to be a legit solution for a 90k vehicle.

That was the reason I didn’t get one. Would I consider and SQ8 or RSQ8? Yes, but the Q8 is too dangerous IMO.
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      09-10-2020, 03:38 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wtwo3 View Post
Cons: The Porsche tax. An equivalently optioned Cayenne was $20k higher than anything else on this list. I didn't feel like paying $20k for something that functionally wasn't much superior than the X5.

At least here in the UK it's a triple tax:
1) substantially more than $20k for the equivalent spec
2) No discount typically, versus 15%+ for the X5
3) Finance APR when I looked was 9.8%!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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      09-10-2020, 04:37 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by G Whizz UK View Post
Finance APR when I looked was 9.8%!!!!!!!!!!!!!
People would save tons of money if they did not take loans to buy cars they cannot afford.
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      09-10-2020, 04:55 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Caramel View Post
People would save tons of money if they did not take loans to buy cars they cannot afford.
True though I think you've also wrongly assumed people who lease can't afford to buy outright.

But I don't want to hijack the thread into the lease/not lease debate!
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      09-10-2020, 07:01 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 130FeetDeep View Post
I almost bought a Q8. You really need to understand the base problem of what is called the “lag”. This is their auto start/stop (ASS) engaging at speeds under about 20 mph when coasting. The engine shuts off while coasting, so if you see a car coming at you and floor it to avoid a collision, the engine needs to start and then it can go. This lag can be a couple seconds and has raised SERIOUS safety issues with the vehicle. When I last looked, there was still no way to code ASS off. People would turn the tranny into sport mode all the time to avoid the issue, but that doesn’t seem to be a legit solution for a 90k vehicle.

That was the reason I didn’t get one. Would I consider and SQ8 or RSQ8? Yes, but the Q8 is too dangerous IMO.
thank you for your clear explanation. That helps.
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      09-10-2020, 07:35 AM   #16
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I had a deposit and order for an SQ8 that was placed just before COVID hit. My original delivery date was July, which matched when my S7 lease ended, but my build ended up getting delayed to October so I ended up cancelling.

However, before cancelling, I did get a chance to sit in a dealer-optioned unit and while I didn't drive it (only started it), it was very nice and:
  • It looks awesome in person. Just something about the "coupe" look that makes it look sleek and fast, especially from the side.
  • The interior fit and finish is exceptional but looked sterile. It also had a lot of gloss black that I'm sure will be fingerprint magnets.
  • The seats were way, way, way more comfortable than the uncomfortable rocks that BMW calls seats.
  • The digital instrument cluster and HUD were much better than what is found in our X5 and offered a lot more customization.
  • It sounded a lot better at startup. My M50i sounds like a bunch of drunk bassoons during the initial startup; it does not sound good.
  • The HK stereo sounds better than the B&O stereo (base) in the Audi, although to be honest, I only briefly listened to the Audi without adjusting anything. The bass sounded hollow and highs were overly tinny and artificial.
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      09-10-2020, 10:16 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyer1234 View Post
thank you for your clear explanation. That helps.
Long discussion on this in the AudiWorld forums:

https://www.audiworld.com/forums/aud...issue-2966888/

Has been noted in the Qs since at least 2018, and not just related to ASS:

https://techcrunch.com/2019/06/10/re...breaking-flaw/

I don't think the source of the lag problem has been clearly identified, and has certainly not been acknowledged by VAG, but it happens with ASS on and off with all the Q models (S models potentially excepted), apparently randomly (not every car), but frequently. My own suspicion from driving the Q7 is that it's related to the dual-clutch transmission - the car would actually roll backwards on a hill unless you came to a complete stop when slowing, as if the transmission was just free-wheeling for a period of time when not actively engaged in going forward. And completely unrelated to any sort of turbo lag (pre-2019 Qs actually had superchargers). Throttle lag from 1 to 4 seconds was reported, although my own experience was on the order of a second or two, consistently, and with both Q7s I owned - enough to be dangerous if you weren't prepared for it, but mostly just supremely annoying. Nothing I've ever experienced in any other car, and even with ASS the G05 demonstrates nothing like this particular issue.
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      09-10-2020, 10:51 AM   #18
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I had this in V8 TDi Touareg. It was so bad that I bailed out of the car after only 4 months. That engine superseded the V10 diesels of which i had two of and no problem with them at all, amazing motors.
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      09-10-2020, 03:02 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frenetic View Post
I had a deposit and order for an SQ8 that was placed just before COVID hit. My original delivery date was July, which matched when my S7 lease ended, but my build ended up getting delayed to October so I ended up cancelling.

However, before cancelling, I did get a chance to sit in a dealer-optioned unit and while I didn't drive it (only started it), it was very nice and:
  • It looks awesome in person. Just something about the "coupe" look that makes it look sleek and fast, especially from the side.
  • The interior fit and finish is exceptional but looked sterile. It also had a lot of gloss black that I'm sure will be fingerprint magnets.
  • The seats were way, way, way more comfortable than the uncomfortable rocks that BMW calls seats.
  • The digital instrument cluster and HUD were much better than what is found in our X5 and offered a lot more customization.
  • It sounded a lot better at startup. My M50i sounds like a bunch of drunk bassoons during the initial startup; it does not sound good.
  • The HK stereo sounds better than the B&O stereo (base) in the Audi, although to be honest, I only briefly listened to the Audi without adjusting anything. The bass sounded hollow and highs were overly tinny and artificial.
I really wish they actually put some nice wheels on the RSQ8. For that kind of money, it stinks that you have to swap out the wheels. I guess it is the same with the X5MC too.
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      09-11-2020, 05:58 PM   #20
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Turning in my Q8 lease

I am about to turn in my Q8 which was a 2 year lease in Jan 2019.

Agree with all the issues listed prior. Finger prints, Lag, and Lack of remote start is a loser.

But no one mentions the most important (to me) feature that sets BMW apart. Driver Assist Pro!

The Audi system will keep you in your lane and keep your distance in stop and go traffic, but after 7 seconds, you have to step on the gas to get the car to move. And forget about having the car drive itself up to 40MPH in traffic.

I am scheduling a SQ8 drive this weekend, but I have all but signed up for a loaded 2021 X5 M50i. I have an 850i and that motor is sweet! (Although it doesn't sound like my car even in Sport Pro!)

The only head to head the Audi wins is good looks. IMHO

GW
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      09-11-2020, 07:28 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by GKW View Post
I am about to turn in my Q8 which was a 2 year lease in Jan 2019.

Agree with all the issues listed prior. Finger prints, Lag, and Lack of remote start is a loser.

But no one mentions the most important (to me) feature that sets BMW apart. Driver Assist Pro!

The Audi system will keep you in your lane and keep your distance in stop and go traffic, but after 7 seconds, you have to step on the gas to get the car to move. And forget about having the car drive itself up to 40MPH in traffic.

I am scheduling a SQ8 drive this weekend, but I have all but signed up for a loaded 2021 X5 M50i. I have an 850i and that motor is sweet! (Although it doesn't sound like my car even in Sport Pro!)

The only head to head the Audi wins is good looks. IMHO

GW
Forgot about that, but the actual pause interval is 3 seconds. Stopped longer, you have to reactivate. That's another thing I like about the G05 - even with the "alertness monitor" in the G05, it continues to drive after a pause (assuming you are "alert" and facing forward).
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      09-12-2020, 06:31 AM   #22
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The throttle lag (from the start/stop system) has been addressed through software updates from what I can tell.

Even our cars has some input lag after the engine stops if you keep the auto start/stop activated, although I cannot say exactly what the differences are since I’ve never personally experienced the Q8 one.
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