[smass]

I have an odd issue that is fluctuating my boost and making the X5 jerky. So far everything is testing OK in ISTA however I don't like the way the EGR bounces at the end of each cycle. Is that normal? I pointed a camera at the EGR and it is definitely bouncing around whenever the boost is fluctuating. thanks

This is what I am trying to fix.

i am not expert on egr, but it is rather harsh. other than that the usual loss of vacuum. red pipe might lose. or even some hole in other vacuum hoses. i even had a hole in aluminium pipe to turbocharger. it can be bad actuator, or even bad vacuum device that looks like a grenade. worse would be the turbo

what bothers me is that bmw is well aware of these issues yet they didn't give a shit about fixing them; every car is dealing with lost vacuum. and those piece of shit would charge u for expensive repair still that should never happen. they should put the quality parts in place. silicone hoses that would withstand high temperatures and shit like that, yet they use cheap rubber ones to save pennies on premium luxury car. most of my ownership i am driving with low pressure and no boost at low revs where it matters because of difficulty of identifying the problem because their stupid diagnostics never showed any fault, so they can wipe their stupid asses with it. son of a bitches, the whole bmw group ag in munich

[smass]

Originally Posted by Martin80k

i am not expert on egr, but it is rather harsh. other than that the usual loss of vacuum. red pipe might lose. or even some hole in other vacuum hoses. i even had a hole in aluminium pipe to turbocharger. it can be bad actuator, or even bad vacuum device that looks like a grenade. worse would be the turbo

I agree it looks harsh. Red hose is new along with all vacuum hoses and actuators. Unplugging EGR, MAF or throttle makes the issue go away completely so I don't think it is a boost leak. How did they find the hole in the aluminum pipe?

thanks

ok, u can actually open egr to see how it looks. plus there is another actuator for erg that some people said failed and there was no boost.

re big aluminium pipe: they had to manually look for the leak as diagnostics didn't show anything wrong, and they found it from the constant friction with other pipe. they suggested to replace for 250 plus euros, and i got it welded for 10 bucks...but now, i have another power loss that developed few days ago. i went for diagnostics because i lost the obd cable and it showed the DPF filter is full, but i still think there is another power leak too...it's a constant thing. i fix it and it's ok for 2 months and then it's bad the rest of the year. i had this car for 3-4 years and this is a constant occurrence and i am not even saying about other major faults...every other week splashing out about 200-600 euro for repairs, oils, wheels welding, new tires, etc etc...it's unbelievable...

[DWR]

Originally Posted by smassey321

I agree it looks harsh. Red hose is new along with all vacuum hoses and actuators. Unplugging EGR, MAF or throttle makes the issue go away completely so I don't think it is a boost leak. How did they find the hole in the aluminum pipe?

thanks

I looked at some old EGR logs and did not see that kind of behavior, alternating between full open and closed. At low load, boost can be higher than EMP. If the EGR opens during that time boost will be lost to the exhaust manifold. If you can log EGR, MAF and boost, that may narrow it down. If boost goes down and MAF goes up, I'd suspect that EGR. If boost goes down and MAF goes down, then I'd suspect the throttle. Either way, it is still hard to expain why.

[smass]

Originally Posted by DWR

I looked at some old EGR logs and did not see that kind of behavior, alternating between full open and closed. At low load, boost can be higher than EMP. If the EGR opens during that time boost will be lost to the exhaust manifold. If you can log EGR, MAF and boost, that may narrow it down. If boost goes down and MAF goes up, I'd suspect that EGR. If boost goes down and MAF goes down, then I'd suspect the throttle. Either way, it is still hard to expain why.

What is the best tool to log with? I have Carley and Torque Pro for the tablet and Rheingold for my laptop. The fully open to closed you see was during a Rheingold test. I pointed a camera at the EGR and drove to work today. It is not as drastic during normal driving but still seems like it is bleeding off boost when it should not.

Frankly I hope it is the throttle. If it is the EGR I will need to do a software update first.

[ingenieur]

Good test - since your problem is not present with EGR disabled of HFM disconnected.
This is an activation to see if the EGR valve achieves the desired position - bar graph on the left, but clearly shows by its response - bar graph on the right - it is sticking and slow to return to the closed position. It may lag behind the activated or desired position somewhat, but should do so just a smooth manner.
How could it be caused by the throttle valve as it is always open during most driving situations - and would set a deviation fault?

Use TestO - PM me for a list of labels.

[DWR]

Originally Posted by ingenieur

Good test - since your problem is not present with EGR disabled of HFM disconnected.
This is an activation to see if the EGR valve achieves the desired position - bar graph on the left, but clearly shows by its response - bar graph on the right - it is sticking and slow to return to the closed position. It may lag behind the activated or desired position somewhat, but should do so just a smooth manner.
How could it be caused by the throttle valve as it is always open during most driving situations - and would set a deviation fault?

Use TestO - PM me for a list of labels.

EGR deviation or throttle deviation can set faults, so that logic cannot be applied to one and not the other. The throttle partially closes under certain conditions to create a pressure differential so that increased EGR can flow. However, I think the EGR valve is the most obvious because of its exposure to soot. Also agree Testo is the best tool because of its faster sampling rate.

[smass]

Originally Posted by ingenieur

Good test - since your problem is not present with EGR disabled of HFM disconnected.
This is an activation to see if the EGR valve achieves the desired position - bar graph on the left, but clearly shows by its response - bar graph on the right - it is sticking and slow to return to the closed position. It may lag behind the activated or desired position somewhat, but should do so just a smooth manner.
How could it be caused by the throttle valve as it is always open during most driving situations - and would set a deviation fault?

Use TestO - PM me for a list of labels.

The Rheingold test mentions that the deviation between left and right should be "less than half a second" so it is close. The bouncing at the end seems similar to what I feel when boost is fluctuating. I would have ordered an EGR already however I am probably going to need a software update so I want to be as sure as I can about this. I have a new style valve so I hope the software is good. I forgot to check that with Rheingold yesterday. PM sent for TestO. The faster frequency of TestO is exactly what I need. thanks

[smass]

I don't have TestO working yet but my borascope camera came in. Here are a couple of videos of the EGR while driving and the boost is bouncing around. The first is a 0 - 40 MPH. The 2nd going up a bridge at 80 mph.

The EGR recall mentions new DDE software is needed. I have the new style valve but I am unsure of the DDE software version. See below. My DDE was last programmed in 2010 but the recall came out in 2012. I may be fine now but if I purchase a new EGR I may need new DDE software. Or the valve was changed but the software was not updated and this is what is actually causing my issue. Service records show no EGR change.

[Mik325tds]

Kudos on the diagnostic efforts. Well done!
Is there a reason why you wouldn't just block the EGR lines? It's better for you engine anyway.

[Bob@BPC]

Originally Posted by smassey321

I don't have TestO working yet but my borascope camera came in. Here are a couple of videos of the EGR while driving and the boost is bouncing around. The first is a 0 - 40 MPH. The 2nd going up a bridge at 80 mph.

The EGR recall mentions new DDE software is needed. I have the new style valve but I am unsure of the DDE software version. See below. My DDE was last programmed in 2010 but the recall came out in 2012. I may be fine now but if I purchase a new EGR I may need new DDE software. Or the valve was changed but the software was not updated and this is what is actually causing my issue. Service records show no EGR change.

Yep, you have the older update

latest update: 1037523267
Your's :1037510744

You can use winKFP or ista p to update the car.
WinKFP you can use a DCAN cable
ISTA P you need an Icom

Make sure you have a charger, both can take some time to update.

[smass]

Originally Posted by Bob@BPC

Yep, you have the older update

latest update: 1037523267
Your's :1037510744

You can use winKFP or ista p to update the car.
WinKFP you can use a DCAN cable
ISTA P you need an Icom

Make sure you have a charger, both can take some time to update.

Thank you for the reply. Is there a way to tell the approximate date of my older software? I don't trust the dates from ISTA as they have my manufacture date off by a year. The recall was in 2012 so if 1037510744 is from that era I am fine. If the dealer did not do the recall correctly hopefully they will fix this for free.

[smass]

Originally Posted by Mik325tds

Kudos on the diagnostic efforts. Well done!
Is there a reason why you wouldn't just block the EGR lines? It's better for you engine anyway.

Great question with several answers. I only have 45k miles and I believe some of the emissions systems may have their warranty extended. I tow a 5000lb boat. The X5 has 2 EGRs so it is bit more complicated.

[ninja_zx11]

Any luck with your issue?

[smass]

Originally Posted by ninja_zx11

Any luck with your issue?

I went ahead and changed the HP EGR because that was the most likely cause. The hesitation issue is 95% gone now however mileage is still lower than I would expect so I think something still is not right. I only get 22 mpg on the highway.

The dealer did a key read Monday and is researching what i-level the software needs to be. Hopefully they will get back to me soon.

I also am seeing a drop of oil from my new red boost hose so I may still have a small leak.

I did the ISTA test on the new EGR and it does the bounce at the end just like the video above so that may be normal.

[ninja_zx11]

Originally Posted by smassey321

I went ahead and changed the HP EGR because that was the most likely cause. The hesitation issue is 95% gone now however mileage is still lower than I would expect so I think something still is not right. I only get 22 mpg on the highway.

The dealer did a key read Monday and is researching what i-level the software needs to be. Hopefully they will get back to me soon.

I also am seeing a drop of oil from my new red boost hose so I may still have a small leak.

I did the ISTA test on the new EGR and it does the bounce at the end just like the video above so that may be normal.

Well done in diagnosing this issue!!

[smass]

Time for another update. As the weather warmed up, the hesitation became constant during any acceleration. After lots of back and forth, the dealer agreed something was odd with the ilevel, but did not think it was the issue. They still thought it was the transfer case. I pressed them to just update the ilevel first as that is $300 compared to $6000 for a new TC. So last week it was flashed to 2015 ilevel and the hesitation is now completely gone.

Yesterday I drove 400 miles in 95 degree heat and it did not hesitate once. Evey once in a while it is a little more jerky than I would expect when accelerating from a stop. This may indeed be the transfer case or just diesel turbo lag. Acceleration on the highway is now perfect.

Next, I will change the TC fluid to see if that changes the off the line smoothness. I also, can unplug the TC under the car and see if that changes anything. I am not against rebuilding the TC myself. Parts are available for around $300 and a rebuild is probably easier than changing the vacuum hoses on a diesel .

[Puerto Rican 335d]

Dude just get rid of the whole system like most of us have done and we don't have any issues so far its my suggestion. I had SURMOUNTABLE issues w egr/scr/Urea tank etc etc and got rid of the shit I'm at 72k and running w/o problems since 49k figure out the math

[smass]

Originally Posted by Puerto Rican 335d

Dude just get rid of the whole system like most of us have done and we don't have any issues so far its my suggestion. I had SURMOUNTABLE issues w egr/scr/Urea tank etc etc and got rid of the shit I'm at 72k and running w/o problems since 49k figure out the math

Before you do any tune, you must make sure everything is running right.

[Puerto Rican 335d]

that is correct smassey321 it would be dumb if you do not correct issues before a tune