[peterg1965]

In eager anticipation of setting up my new Samsung LED TV and Samsung Blu Ray home cinema system with my existing SKY HD box, I have a question that hopefully is easy to answer.

How do I arrange/connect the HDMI cables to ensure I can use the home cinema speakers whilst watching TV through the SKY HD Box? Do I need some kind of dedicated audio link between the Blu Ray player and the Sky HD/TV to achieve this?

[Steve A]

yes pete you need a link from the HC to the HD box with an optical cable

I have the led46 with a samsung blueray and the HD pictures are truly stunning.

[rogerxp]

Argh, I've got HDMI & Optical Cables coming out of my ears, and still can't get the whole system working properly (lip-synch being a huge issue!!!). I've given up . I'd happily pay someone to come round and sort everything out for me.

[Steve A]

Originally Posted by rogerxp

Argh, I've got HDMI & Optical Cables coming out of my ears, and still can't get the whole system working properly (lip-synch being a huge issue!!!). I've given up . I'd happily pay someone to come round and sort everything out for me.

rog im not far from you give us a shout and ill sort it out

[rogerxp]

...let me know your fees

[peterg1965]

Cheers Steve,

Would it be one of these sorts of leads - TOSLINK?

[- Paul -]

Originally Posted by peterg1965

Cheers Steve,

Would it be one of these sorts of leads - TOSLINK?

Thats the ones but you certainly dont need gold plated!!!!!

Optical connections use light to transmit data!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[peterg1965]

Originally Posted by - Paul -

Thats the ones but you certainly dont need gold plated!!!!!

Optical connections use light to transmit data!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Cheers Paul! I quickly selected that one from ebay as an example, i wouldn't have been drawn into getting gold!

[xenon]

Re the lip-sync problem mentioned - is that just from using Sky? If so you can go into the Sky HD advanced settings and play with the audio delay settings. I had the same and found that 20ms was about right.

[M3-FAST]

Originally Posted by xenon

Re the lip-sync problem mentioned - is that just from using Sky? If so you can go into the Sky HD advanced settings and play with the audio delay settings. I had the same and found that 20ms was about right.

+1 - was just about to post the same solution

Not sure what you use for 'sound' Roger but if it helps any my system is wired as follows:

I have a HD TV, a SKY HD box, a PS3 and a Denon Amp powering a KEF Egg 5.1 setup.

• I have only 2 leads going to the TV - a HDMI from the PS3 and another HDMI from the SKY HD box.
• An optical TOS cable goes from the PS3 to the Amp and another TOS cable goes from the SKY HD box to the amp.

Nice simple wiring and works a treat. The only lip sync issues are on SKY and as Xenon says about 20ms delay seems to sort it out. You might need to play around with the SKY settings as you can basically choose wether you want the SKY box to upscale your standard def outputs or if you choose to let your TV do it. Can't remember which menu this is on off the top of my head, but it is in the one that switches the output resolution. If you set it to 720 then the box will upscale standard def signals before it sends them to the TV. If you choose auto, the TV will upscale it instead. See what works best for your setup

[creepy coupe]

I had the lip-sync problems until I did a software up date.

Switch of HD box press and hold the "back up" button on the top of the HD box, while holding in pull out the power lead from the rear, still holding the button down refit the power lead and wait 10 seconds, all the lights on the front of the HD box should come on, the a message on the TV screen advises the update could take 10 minuets.

It sorted it for me.

[rogerxp]

Thanks for that guys. Sorry Peter, feel like I've hijaked your thread, hopefully this will be useful for you too though.

I'll have to relook at the whole system again. I've got exactly the same system as M3-FAST (Paul) but with a Sony Amp instead. I spent a bloody fortune on cables to only get so frustrated I just gave up. Couldn't get my head round whether it was Sky, PS3, Amp or TV that I should be adjusting to make the necessary improvements. I used to be pretty good at all this however recently it's just got so damn complicated (with everything having the ability to upscale, delay, etc).

Think I'll just rip out all cable as set-up as above and start again. I've spent hours on various forums trying to sort this all out.

Edit - now I think about it I'm sure my cables are set-up likes yours too Paul, mmm, will check later. My Amp is about 5yrs old now so doesnt have HDMI so I'm forced to use optical. To get full-HD sound I need a dedicated BluRay player with the 5.1 separate speaker outputs (that's the only downside at present) as I'm pretty sure optical doesn't send sound at it's highest quality (am I right here?). I thought HDMI send it OK but not optical??

[RagingKileak]

I bought an Onkyo 806 AV Receiver and eveyrything runs through it. Prior to that I could only get surround sound from every device with great difficulty because of limited number of optical inputs for example etc.

The AV receiver also automatically configured the surround sound (and did it well) and also matches the sound/picture sync perfectly.

Its a good piece of kit, similar ones can be had for £200... but if you already have an amp, your throwing money at a problem your halfway to solving!

Matt

[- Paul -]

Originally Posted by rogerxp

Thanks for that guys. Sorry Peter, feel like I've hijaked your thread, hopefully this will be useful for you too though.

I'll have to relook at the whole system again. I've got exactly the same system as M3-FAST (Paul) but with a Sony Amp instead. I spent a bloody fortune on cables to only get so frustrated I just gave up. Couldn't get my head round whether it was Sky, PS3, Amp or TV that I should be adjusting to make the necessary improvements. I used to be pretty good at all this however recently it's just got so damn complicated (with everything having the ability to upscale, delay, etc).

Think I'll just rip out all cable as set-up as above and start again. I've spent hours on various forums trying to sort this all out.

Edit - now I think about it I'm sure my cables are set-up likes yours too Paul, mmm, will check later. My Amp is about 5yrs old now so doesnt have HDMI so I'm forced to use optical. To get full-HD sound I need a dedicated BluRay player with the 5.1 separate speaker outputs (that's the only downside at present) as I'm pretty sure optical doesn't send sound at it's highest quality (am I right here?). I thought HDMI send it OK but not optical??

Cant see why optical wont transmit at highest quality? Its bandwidth is higher than copper wires afaik.

[rogerxp]

Originally Posted by - Paul -

Cant see why optical wont transmit at highest quality? Its bandwidth is higher than copper wires afaik.

I must admit I agree with you but thought I'd read it somewhere. OR, is it that the PS3 doesn't send HD-sound and therefore it's a PS3 limitation as opposed to the optical cable. I'm sure it's one or the other...

[- Paul -]

Its not a PS3 thing as I send 5.1 and dts etc out via ps3 optical to my Yamaha receiver. Maybe something to do with 7.1 ? But I still cant see why optical couldn't carry this - its maybe a manufacturer thing to only put 7.1 through HDMI so we all have to buy expensive gold plated cables!!!? :-)

[RagingKileak]

To clarify regarding cables and 'HD sound' if your on about Blu Ray, then you have the option of 7.1 but that will only work via HDMI cable - not optical, no matter what amp you have.

I don't know about bandwidth, but I know what my ears tell me - my 360 now runs through HDMI and up until a few weeks ago it ran through Component HD and Optical.

The picture has improved since I changed to HDMI but not my much, the sound on the other hand is night and day - HDMI cable for the win without a shadow of a doubt.

Its worth noting, for comparison, that the 360 will never output 7.1 but the AV receiver spoofs it so that all 7 speakers are still used. The effect of this now the 360 runs through HDMI is also increased over when it was being done via Optical cable.

Matt

[rogerxp]

I'm completely confused now (see, this is what makes me just give up!!). My amp is 7.1 but I've only got it set-up for 5.1 now due to the shape of the room. Maybe I'm just wrong (it has been known!!).

Originally Posted by RagingKileak

To clarify regarding cables and 'HD sound' if your on about Blu Ray, then you have the option of 7.1 but that will only work via HDMI cable - not optical, no matter what amp you have. Matt

Ah, there's the answer, and as my amp doesn't support HMDI I can only use the optical cable so would have to buy a separate BluRay player to use HMDI and unlock the others. That said, I'm only running 5.1 anyway, so I suppose it makes no difference anyway. Is there a difference in sound quality between 5.1 and 5.1HD (or does this difference not actually exist???).

[RagingKileak]

Originally Posted by rogerxp

I'm completely confused now (see, this is what makes me just give up!!). My amp is 7.1 but I've only got it set-up for 5.1 now due to the shape of the room. Maybe I'm just wrong (it has been known!!).



Ah, there's the answer, and as my amp doesn't support HMDI I can only use the optical cable so would have to buy a separate BluRay player to use HMDI and unlock the others. That said, I'm only running 5.1 anyway, so I suppose it makes no difference anyway. Is there a difference in sound quality between 5.1 and 5.1HD (or does this difference not actually exist???).

Hmmm, well I dont wanna keep the confusion running as I am not a hugely technical guy on this front but here is what I do know...

Your AMP wont have HDMI in because obviously, its just an amp - so it wont have a video passthrough. Which means if you COULD plug say, a PS3 into it via HDMI - even if it could decode sound, then where would the video go?

If I refer back to the AV Receiver I mentioned before, which allows both video and sound passthrough and also upscales and does other clever stuff which I dont understand, it could take either HDMI or Optical IN and output it to 7.1 as long as it had an 8 channel amp (which it obviously would if you chose it for that reason).

With regards to 5.1HD or 5.1 or 7.1HD or 7.1 etc - I dont think such a thing as X.XHD exists in terms of what a 'type of sound'

I suspect when things refer to HD audio, they are referring to some proprietary method of sound coding which is unique to say, Phillips, or Sony, or whatever...

As long as you have an Amp which supports the modern variants of DTS or whatever its called nowadays - DTS-Digital or whatever, then thats the closest your gonna find to the so called HD audio...

For reference, my kit comprises of...

*Onkyo 806 7.1 AV Receiver
*XBOX 360
*(PS3 nicked and not replaced)
*Media Centre/Gaming PC
*Sky + HD
*3 big central speakers mounted in a custom built wall with a 46 AQUOS LCD TV
*4 surround sattelite speakers, 2 in the middle of the room mounted pointing downwards on the ceiling and 2 at the back at ear height
*1 Sub at the right side of the room

I have the 360, Sky HD and the Media Centre PC all going into the 806 via HDMI cable and all sync perfectly with the TV, and all output extremely good quality surround sound via all 7 speakers and the sub. Sky has also got an Optical cable into the 806 as it doesnt support HDMI audio.

Sky, which despite the excellent picture had crap sound quality is vastly poor in comparison to the sources using HDMI audio although its still excellent and much improved over the system I had before (a much less powerful amp/speaker combo)

Previously, I also had the PS3 connected up via HDMI and despite the fact that I dont really rate the PS3, the sound compared to the 360 which at the time used only the Component and Optical combo was much better - now the 360 has been upgraded to HDMI, it matches the PS3.

Also, its worth noting that for Blu Ray films which support proper 7.1 audio, there is very little to notice that you dont get with a 5.1 Blu Ray and a system like the 806 which spoofs the other two speakers.

I suspect older films which were not filmed with 7.1 in mind dont gain any benefit, in the future we might see some difference but I am not sure... as bullets pass the left side of my head for example, they originate from the centre speakers and move progressively down the left side of the room - what more could I want??

Matt

[rogerxp]

I found my room was too small to warranty 7.1 in my old house but settled using 6.1 (where 5.1 was really the maximum). You've gotta have sufficient space between the speakers for them to be effective and with 7.1 you've got 4 in a row which leads to a pretty large room. I bought all my kit about 5 years ago (when I was in a smaller house, was a two income family with no little one) so it's all top-of-the-range kit (Sony's EX series) but it was truely wasted where it was. Now, in a new house, it's all been in boxes until the HD TV & Sky HD arrived a few months ago but just can't get it working properly now (and have little time now to p!ss around with it). Luckily, because of the quality of the kit, the actual sound still knocks the stuffing out of modern kit but the connections are of course limited to optical.

I hear what you're saying Matt about the 5.1 & 5.1HD, or shall we call it DTS & DTS-HD which definately exists, I think there is a difference in physical sound quality, not that you're ears could tell. It's a bit like CDs and Super Audio CDs, both use the same number of speakers (OK, SACDs can be 5.1, but not all) but the 'size' of sound is far superiour with SACD. I say 'size' as I'm struggling with the terminology; you can have different 'sized' quality tracks on your ipod, the bigger the size the higher the quality - same thing. Is it the 'depth' of sound?? Bandwidth kind of...

[RagingKileak]

Originally Posted by rogerxp

I found my room was too small to warranty 7.1 in my old house but settled using 6.1 (where 5.1 was really the maximum). You've gotta have sufficient space between the speakers for them to be effective and with 7.1 you've got 4 in a row which leads to a pretty large room. I bought all my kit about 5 years ago (when I was in a smaller house, was a two income family with no little one) so it's all top-of-the-range kit (Sony's EX series) but it was truely wasted where it was. Now, in a new house, it's all been in boxes until the HD TV & Sky HD arrived a few months ago but just can't get it working properly now (and have little time now to p!ss around with it). Luckily, because of the quality of the kit, the actual sound still knocks the stuffing out of modern kit but the connections are of course limited to optical.

I hear what you're saying Matt about the 5.1 & 5.1HD, or shall we call it DTS & DTS-HD which definately exists, I think there is a difference in physical sound quality, not that you're ears could tell. It's a bit like CDs and Super Audio CDs, both use the same number of speakers (OK, SACDs can be 5.1, but not all) but the 'size' of sound is far superiour with SACD. I say 'size' as I'm struggling with the terminology; you can have different 'sized' quality tracks on your ipod, the bigger the size the higher the quality - same thing. Is it the 'depth' of sound?? Bandwidth kind of...

I know what your saying - I just made sure I had the DTS-XX which I dont recall as being as simple as just 'HD' but the main thing was for me that I chose a cost effective solution that could meet my current needs but may have the opportunity to upgrade later!

To be honest, I might have a slightly too small room for all the speakers I have got - considering the power they COULD put out, they certainly dont.

But having said that, there is a good 6 feet between any two speakers (central 3 excluded) so I guess thats more than enough if you get them setup right.

Connectivity is the biggest nightmare as you say - its a shame there isnt a niche product which helps bridge the gap between devices and amps/av receivers.

I know you can get optical splitters for example... but thats not going to help you from the sounds of things.

I am sure that some people (maybe not you or I) would happily plug a HDMI cable into a device which downgrades the sound to an optical out, and auto switches between say 3 devices... so that you could plug it into an amp which has say, only 1 optical in and 95% of people would take the hit in sound quality just for that ease of use.

I know about 8/10 of parents, grand parents, friends, friends parents, teenage brothers/sisters etc who run modern HD kit like 360's and PS3's through component AV cables, component HD at best, almost all of them have surround sound from one source but not another etc - I keep my mouth shut, or else I would end up rewiring fucking EVERYTHING for EVERYONE!!!

Matt

[M3-FAST]

Originally Posted by rogerxp

I'm completely confused now (see, this is what makes me just give up!!). My amp is 7.1 but I've only got it set-up for 5.1 now due to the shape of the room. Maybe I'm just wrong (it has been known!!).



Ah, there's the answer, and as my amp doesn't support HMDI I can only use the optical cable so would have to buy a separate BluRay player to use HMDI and unlock the others. That said, I'm only running 5.1 anyway, so I suppose it makes no difference anyway. Is there a difference in sound quality between 5.1 and 5.1HD (or does this difference not actually exist???).

My amp will switch video but has no hdmi input/outputs as it is a few years old now. Just use hdmi straight to the TV for the pictures and use 2 x optical cables straight to the amp. Both the PS3 and SKY HD transmit sound in dolby digital so no worries there. TOS cables are only a couple of quid on ebay or maplins. HDMI's are only a few quid also. There is no advantage to using expensive TOS or HDMI cables as they are only transmmitting data.

Check your PS3 firmware is up to date as there are more audio options on it than there used to be. You can also choose to send sound out of the hdmi and/or optical now. Before I think it was one or the other?

Should work no probs Rog