[Fuukk_Mercedes]

So according to Castrol (one of the worlds best manufacters of motor oils)and from what i hear, stop and go driving (like most people do in a city) and short trips are damaging to an engine. Well why and how? So what does that mean people arent allowed to go out to eat, hang with friends, go to work or school becuase those are considered short trips and short trips are damaging? What the hell is that.....and what about stop and go driving, so what are we not supposed to stop when the light turns red, theres a stop sign, or the person in front stops? Some one clarify this for me please.

"Castrol SYNTEC Blend is specially engineered with proprietary
Castrol GTX technology and Castrol SYNTEC molecular
components to provide superior short–trip protection*.

Frequent short trips are considered a severe driving condition that
can lead to premature engine wear. Castrol SYNTEC Blend is
specially formulated to provide maximum wear protection under any
severe driving condition, including towing and hauling, severe
temperatures, and stop and go traffic." - Off of Castrol.com

[SpdFreak]

I'm not sure, but they might be referring to those that don't warm up their cars in the morning after it was sitting in the driveway for the past twelve hours in 18* (degree) weather. Please correct me if i'm wrong.

[bnj]

Low oil temperature -> less lubrication.
Starting the engine -> for a split second the lubrification is poor
Short trips = low oil temperature & many starts -> a lot more wear per mile driven.
However, the same amount of starts but driving longer distances means even more wear. It's just that it's less wear per mile driven.

[BMW F22]

short trips are ones that only take a few minutes. For example: you need to go to a walgreens and there's one a few minutes away from your home. You drive there and shut the car off; then drive it back home and turn it off again.

I guess the engines and components are warmed up so they cause more wear and tear.

[teknochild]

its not so much that they are damaging to your engine as much as they add more wear and tear per mile

[Dubois]

I was told the E90 series has an electric water pump improving start up warm times. Can't think how this would work over mechanical pumps to warm the block quicker. The wear rate on cold start up refers mainly to lack of sufficient oil (or warm oil) under heavy load when cold.

Any thoughts?

[BoostedBMW]

On a side note, referring to the statement about warming up the car in the morning, I forgot which auto manufacturer it was (i'm thinking GM for some reason) that did a study and found that letting your car sit and warm up in the driveway at idle was actually worse for the motor then just starting it up and driving it easy for the few few miles. It would cause the ring seals on your pistons to not seat properly, which would have an impact over time. I'm not sure if its BS or not, just some food for thought. I always drive my car slowly, and easy until it gets up to temp so its really no big deal for me.

[teknochild]

Originally Posted by BoostedBMW

On a side note, referring to the statement about warming up the car in the morning, I forgot which auto manufacturer it was (i'm thinking GM for some reason) that did a study and found that letting your car sit and warm up in the driveway at idle was actually worse for the motor then just starting it up and driving it easy for the few few miles. It would cause the ring seals on your pistons to not seat properly, which would have an impact over time. I'm not sure if its BS or not, just some food for thought. I always drive my car slowly, and easy until it gets up to temp so its really no big deal for me.

yea sitting there with your engine at the same RPM when friction is at its greatest is probably going to wear on a specific spot, where as if your driving and the rpms are changing it will wear evenly

[jjlawyer]

Originally Posted by teknochild

yea sitting there with your engine at the same RPM when friction is at its greatest is probably going to wear on a specific spot, where as if your driving and the rpms are changing it will wear evenly

I have read this as well but I don't remember where. The reasoning was that you want to get the oil warm as fast as possible and that happens much faster under engine load. Same article said that pulling a cold car from the driveway to the garage is more damaging that 500 miles of driving when the car is already warm. I don't know how anyone could possibly know this but I seem logical.

[SpdFreak]

Originally Posted by teknochild

yea sitting there with your engine at the same RPM when friction is at its greatest is probably going to wear on a specific spot, where as if your driving and the rpms are changing it will wear evenly

I'm not sure your correct, the pistons/cams/valves and everything that moves are covering the same area, it's just at a lower speed, so it's not wearing out a specific surface.

[HyperM3]

The difference in the oils is how it attaches itself to the metal surface. The oil discussed in the OP is apparently made to adhere to the internal parts better to insure that lubrication is there even when heat isnt. When cars sit, oil will drip down to the pan leaving everything up top bare. Upon startup, this is the most detrimental moment because the oil pump takes a second to get oil up but at the same time, pistons have already started moving in the bore.

My m3 is a garage queen and before I let it sit over the winter(about 3-4 months) I drain about a quart of oil out of it. I pour that quart back in when Im ready to restart the car in the spring. I know it doesnt get every cylinder but at least it helps some of them in my mind.

[Ryan(e92)]

Senseless bullshit. In Socal how is anyone supposed to avoid stop and go traffic. Its a daily thing. Pointless to worry about.

[HyperM3]

Originally Posted by Ryan(e92)

Senseless bullshit. In Socal how is anyone supposed to avoid stop and go traffic. Its a daily thing. Pointless to worry about.

Stop and go traffic is completely different than start engine-quick trip-turn off engine. In traffic the oil gets heated up enough and pumped all over the engine for adequate lubrication.

[grkm3]

cold starts and short trips is the worst thing you can do to a car.My cars valvs tick bad in the cold and today was really bad with it being 8 degrees out.

Emagine if I start my car up and drive 5 min down the street to the gym...Let it sit there for 1 hour and then start it up again(cold start)drive it back to my house(5 min)then hang out for 2 hours and then drive it to work(5min)and repeat every day.

the cars engine never has time to get the oil warm and lubricate the thing.

That is what castrol is talking about.Short trips with out letting the oil get to temp.

[SMOKE EM IF U GOT EM!!]

Originally Posted by bnj

Low oil temperature -> less lubrication.
Starting the engine -> for a split second the lubrification is poor
Short trips = low oil temperature & many starts -> a lot more wear per mile driven.
However, the same amount of starts but driving longer distances means even more wear. It's just that it's less wear per mile driven.

well put!

[Ryan(e92)]

Originally Posted by grkm3

cold starts and short trips is the worst thing you can do to a car.My cars valvs tick bad in the cold and today was really bad with it being 8 degrees out.

Emagine if I start my car up and drive 5 min down the street to the gym...Let it sit there for 1 hour and then start it up again(cold start)drive it back to my house(5 min)then hang out for 2 hours and then drive it to work(5min)and repeat every day.

the cars engine never has time to get the oil warm and lubricate the thing.

That is what castrol is talking about.Short trips with out letting the oil get to temp.

Everytime u start your car its cold/not warmed up. Whether u drive for 5 minutes or 45 minutes does not change how long your car is cold for.

[BMWPower06]

On a side note i believe BMW tells you not to warm up your engine, just fire it up and start driving, of course dont drive crazy, keep the rpms below 3500 or so until the car has warmed up

[Ghunger]

Couple comments responding to posts above.

You should in fact drive off after starting the car instead of letting it sit and warm up. The engine will warm up faster under light to moderate driving and cause less wear in the end. (RTFM)

The electric water pump warms up the car faster because it doesn't circulate water when the car is warming up. A mechanical pump that is belt driven will circulate and cool the water as long as the engine is running.

[Fuukk_Mercedes]

Damn.....and to think i used to believe that letting a car sit and warm up was good, and i would do it too, BUT i live in southern cali where its not cold AND my car is ALWAYS garage kept so the oil is always at room temp, however that doesnt change the fact that most the oil will fall back down into the pan after a while. So what we're saying is this right...to just start the car up, back out of the garage and driveway and just drive slow ( which works out perfect for me cuz i have to drive slow until i get out of my gated community anyways) and then just continue driving slowly and calmly until the oil temp is up? It just seems sooo wrong and goes so against what was comonly thought....almost like the proposal of the earth being round centuries ago.

[SamBoler]

Took a 335i Coupe to vegas

[Dubois]

Originally Posted by BoostedBMW

On a side note, referring to the statement about warming up the car in the morning, I forgot which auto manufacturer it was (i'm thinking GM for some reason) that did a study and found that letting your car sit and warm up in the driveway at idle was actually worse for the motor then just starting it up and driving it easy for the few few miles. It would cause the ring seals on your pistons to not seat properly, which would have an impact over time. I'm not sure if its BS or not, just some food for thought. I always drive my car slowly, and easy until it gets up to temp so its really no big deal for me.

I think this refers to new car break-in periods where the rings have not "bedded in" fully. Variable revs under changing loads to 2/3 of maximum revs with the occasional spurt to red line is apparently the best break in methodology. Mind you there are a thousand opinions on this one too.

Best to play dumb and RTFM.

[BoostedInPhx]

Part of the problem with the short trips occurs because the oil does not get hot enough to evaporate out the water and unburned fuel in it. The oil normally gets contaminated with water and fuel that get past the piston rings during normal operation. The water and fuel are not good lubricants. I live in Phoenix and the computer in my Mini Cooper S knows it is warm out and I get longer oil change intervals then people in cold areas.