[TMP]

Have Saab actually gone bust or are they limping along....surely if they come back there is no long term future for such a limited car range.

Same goes for Alfa, i didnt realise they now only had a range of 2 cars (Mito and Guilleta) Where has the 159 gone

So which marque will be next then....Volvo? I would also have thought Seat would be pretty dodgy if they were not owned by VW.

[chris_s1]

Seat? Their sales are strong, especially in Europe. I think they are ok with or without VW.

I think Volvo are ok, they do well in North America and their HGV business is huge.

Alfa are owned by Fiat. I know they have Ferrari and Maserati but how they keep going is beyond me.

[ZURICH]

Originally Posted by chris_s1

Seat? Their sales are strong, especially in Europe. I think they are ok with or without VW.

I think Volvo are ok, they do well in North America and their HGV business is huge.

Alfa are owned by Fiat. I know they have Ferrari and Maserati but how they keep going is beyond me.

Volvo cars are owned by ford and have no affiliation with Volvo trucks.

[Edi1011]

Originally Posted by ZURICH

Volvo cars are owned by ford and have no affiliation with Volvo trucks.

Sorry, Ford sold Volvo Cars to Chinese Firm, Geely, in 2009

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/au..._to_geely.html

[peterg1965]

GM have recently bounced back from the brink, with things looking up globally maybe they are all safe. Saab don't surprise me though, they have been quirky and dull, dull, dull for years.

[rich1068]

Only because they were starved by GM really. The new 9-5 is a great car but it appears GM put the kybosh on Saab's sale to a couple of Chinese companies. For fairly legitimate reasons too if we're being honest. I don't think Saab can come back from where they are now unless the Swedish government steps in which is unlikely. More here.

As far as Alfa are concerned I'm not aware they're in trouble. No there isn't a replacement for the 159 yet but I'd just put that down to the Italian shrug of the shoulders way of doing things.

:edit:

There's a little bit of me (actually more than a bit) that mourns the passing of the 159. I think it's one of the most sublime looking four door saloons around and always turns my head. I had one for a few weeks as a loaner and loved it. It was one of the only cars I've driven that merits a second glance after you've locked it and you're on your way into the house. Obviously then I'd have to walk back to it because the remote locking was a little iffy and even if it did lock it wouldn't set the alarm. Usually it managed to arm itself at some point during the night because I'd have to disarm it in the morning. Buy hey, heart and head...

[mowflow]

I've go an appointment at Western SAAB/Alfa to test drive a Giulietta this Friday. I intend to ask what's going on with SAAB.

I don't think Alfa are struggling but Fiat have certainly messed it up a bit lately. I've heard rumours and seen pics of a 159 replacement and it looks rather nice. Not sure if it will ever see production though.

[rich1068]

I've seen pics too but when you look at the articles they're usually from a few years ago and nothing has happened since. Maybe they're just going to concentrate on the smaller cars that sell. Although it looks like the 4C is a runner.

:edit:

If you're test driving the 1750 unit I'd love to read your thoughts. On paper it looks a cracking engine.

[mowflow]

I'm booked to drive both the 1750 QV Cloverleaf thingy and the 1.4 TB Multiair Veloce. I quite fancy the idea of getting 200+bhp out of a 1.4 after a remap. I'll post my thoughts on them in here as I doubt the interest would merit it's own thread.

[rich1068]

Obviously ignore minor issues like trim falling off or the windows opening on their own. Your thoughts on the engines would be enough.

[TMP]

Originally Posted by rich1068

. Obviously then I'd have to walk back to it because the remote locking was a little iffy and even if it did lock it wouldn't set the alarm. Usually it managed to arm itself at some point during the night because I'd have to disarm it in the morning. Buy hey, heart and head...

[TMP]

I just can't see how its viable for a large manufacture to now survive with only 2 models.

Although I suppose if they share a dealer network, them perhaps that could make it cost in.....this could well to apply to both Saab and Alfa.

At least Alfa still have a shot with their 2 modern models and yep one day I would like to own an Alfa. Never really could say that about a Saab.

[mowflow]

Originally Posted by rich1068

Obviously ignore minor issues like trim falling off or the windows opening on their own. Your thoughts on the engines would be enough.

Yeah, all common "quirks" I believe along with dodgy paint and the gear knob falling off. Still, I've always fancied an Alfa but would only own one warrantied to the hilt with a good dealer. I'll be paying particular attention to performance, handling and having a play with the DNA switch.

[ZURICH]

Originally Posted by Edi1011

Sorry, Ford sold Volvo Cars to Chinese Firm, Geely, in 2009

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/au..._to_geely.html

Holy crap why did they not tell me

[rogerxp]

Funnily enough I saw a 159 Ti edition today, bloody gorgeous car, in fact I tried to buy one a few years back. I didn't realise they'd stopped making them until I saw Top Gear last week.

[Kerr]

Alfa have stunning designs but shocking quality.

Remember the one time they combined the best of Italian and the best of Japanese?

Or should that be the worst of both or an Alfa idea?

http://www.pistonheads.com/doc.asp?c=52&i=19141

[rich1068]

I've got a mate who always buys Alfas (though not one of those ^^) but he picks them up when they're a couple of years old and everything broken has been fixed. And he obviously takes advantage of the fact that they depreciate like a piano pushed off a cliff.

@mowflow, I believe Mangoletsi are the people to talk too but hardly local for you.

[m@rk]

Saab UK are now in the hands of the receivers Grant Thornton.

The 2 Saab owned dealerships are closing however the rest of the dealerships out there are still open (for now)

BUT

Your Saab warranty manufacturers warranty is not worth the paper it is written on. If you need to make a claim under it, you just get added to the list of creditors to Saab UK and have to try and recover any cost yourself.

BUT

If you bought your car from a franchised dealer then it is THEY who under the sale of goods act have to rectify faults however they themselves will struggle to recover any cash from Saab UK.

Because of this, I can see the franchised dealerships running into problems very quickly and also being less than cooperative regarding warranty repairs moving forward

You also have additional protection if you bought on finance

But in any case, there have already been newspaper reports of people with 6 month old Saabs having to fork out thousands of pounds to get their cars fixed with little chance of recovering the cash.

This story can only get worse.

[BGM]

Originally Posted by mowflow

I'm booked to drive both the 1750 QV Cloverleaf thingy and the 1.4 TB Multiair Veloce. I quite fancy the idea of getting 200+bhp out of a 1.4 after a remap. I'll post my thoughts on them in here as I doubt the interest would merit it's own thread.

TCT box is very nice, shame the car is a bit lacking in creature comforts

[mowflow]

I've got DSG at the moment so I'd like the TCT but the thought of a fist gen box like that built by an Italian scares the shite out of me. It's all beside the point really as I can't buy another car right now.

[mowflow]

Up dating this thread as promised.

Went to Western SAAB which also happens to be the local Alfa dealer today to test the Giulietta QV and Multiair. While I was there I asked what was happening with SAAB. The guy I spoke to didn't seem to know much more than us here. He figured that although GM blocked the buy out by the Chinese it will probably end up going that way as supposedly some Chinese company have already flowed 100M into it.

Anyway, my attempt at a review of the Alfas for Rich since he asked nicely. First drive was the 1.4 TB Multiair Veloce. Had to take the car to the petrol station so first part of the drive was in city centre traffic. The car felt pretty wimpy if I'm honest. It certainly felt like it had more power than a 1.4 but didn't feel "sporty". At one point I had to change lanes and decided to put the foot down to make a gap ahead. I made the gap but not with ease. I also noted in town that the brakes were horribly sensitive. I didn't notice until after the drive that the car had the Brembo 4 pot upgrade which I now feel are completely unnecessary. Anyway, after filling up we hit a bit of newly built motorway, again the car failed to impress much, it was just so tame. THEN, the salesman started going on about the DNA switch. He pushed it into D mode and "bloody hell" without moving the accelerator a millimeter the car suddenly felt like someone had booted it up the arse, the car felt noticeably stiffer in the bends and the steering was a lot heavier and very direct. The car still had a hint of civilization about it though, you didn't need to rev it hard and when you did it tended to die as it got close to the red line.

Next was the 1750TB QV Cloverleaf or whatever the hell it's called on exactly the same drive. Started off in normal mode with the DNA switch. The car felt heavier and stiffer straight away, same massive brakes but they were a bit easier on the neck, not sure why as I doubt the weight difference is that much. Out on the motorway when I flicked to D(dynamic) mode it really was quite a violent change. The car leapt forward and the exhaust note changed, I don't know if there's a port or something in this one. Anyway, the engine sound was lovely and the little pops on changes were fun. The steering and chassis felt identical to this mode in the multiair however the biggest difference was a shed more torque, overtaking was a piece of cake and I recon I could loose my license pretty quickly in one of these as you just feel like you want to drive it hard (until you look at the mpg in the display )

I've left out all mention of trim and build quality but what I will say is that I was very pleasantly surprised. going straight from an Audi into one of these I didn't feel like i was sitting in my sons Fisher Price ride on like I thought I would. If it was my money I think I'd buy the multiair. In D mode everything apart from "driving like you stole it" performance was on a par with the QV and I think that with a remap which supposedly can put the engine over 200bhp it would be a great all rounder. I never came away from either car with that "must have" feeling but I certainly won't write it off as a possible next car.

[Brennan]

Saab Automobile went into Administration back in December but currently there are two chinese companies trying to purchase and revive the ailing brand. These companies have to apply for permission from Saab AB and Scania to use the 'Saab' name on any cars they intend to produce.

So much for Victor Muller's outlook of making the brand profitable by 2012