[Mike@N54Tuning.com]

Hey guys,

Since Cobb + meth has been a hot topic lately I thought some of you would be interested to see how it performs on the dyno. Runs were done with the WW kit using a basic boost switch type setup, and then with the JB4 doing progressive control.

Test car and relevant mods: 2008 135i step, CPE downpipes, CL midpipes, BMS DCI, eBay version "big tom" intercooler, 93 octane, mid 70s in the dyno room.

1) Overall the Cobb S2+ v3.01 ST tuning on pump gas was expected and performed similar to last time I tested it. Several runs had odd boost control oscillations so I just disregarded those for the purposes of this post.

2) There seems to be some sort of persistent under targeting going on at higher RPM. At one point boost is around 5psi below target. I'm not sure if this is by design, or a tuning issue, but is worth noting. Perhaps under real world EGTs during a very long run boost would be closer to target given the duty cycles set.

3) Using our basic WW non-integrated kit we saw noticeable gains. Due to the cooler intake temps the meth provides the target was a bit lower. Peak power was up across the board 10hp or so. On the road I expect real world gains would be even more significant. For this run I used a CM10 nozzle with 80% meth which I happened to have on the car from earlier JB4+meth testing. Real world I'd suggest a CM5 or CM7 nozzle with this setup. Also note for these runs I accidentally left the JB4 boost targeting enabled so it was attempting to add duty cycle to compensate for the Cobb under-targeting. But there is no other tuning going on with those runs.

4) For the JB4 controlled testing I used the JB4 to dynamically add boost to the Cobb target as a function of methanol flow. Allowing for a safe fully progressive boost ramp up with nice street manners. Gains were fairly significant but again the car was unable to reach the set target even with the JB4 helping pull the wastegates closed. Given the advance curve I think the output is pretty decent and this power would be "heat soak" resistant and very safe/stable for general use.

5) I did a lot of dyno testing on JB4 and JB4+meth but to avoid the inevitable tuner wars I'll post that in another thread tomorrow. This thread is for Cobb and Cobb + meth results discussion only!

[blisstik]

Summary: 30whp/34tq gains at ~5200 rpm from non-meth Cobb only tune. The curve difference is also good between 3000 and 6000 rpms.

[marv85]

Impressive! Just saw this on the other forum.
will be running this setup soon

[dzenno]

Hey, nice work there!! Wonder where that horrible idea of stacking tunes came from hehe

nice pump gas numbers for Cobb too and the big tom fmic works pretty well i see

[marv85]

Originally Posted by dzenno

Hey, nice work there!! Wonder where that horrible idea of stacking tunes came from hehe

nice pump gas numbers for Cobb too and the big tom fmic works pretty well i see

Terry has big tom fmic on his car?

[dzenno]

Originally Posted by marv85

Terry has big tom fmic on his car?

big tom look-alike yes, not the "actual" KL Racing fmic but spec and price wise very similar

[rooringhusky]

Originally Posted by dzenno

big tom look-alike yes, not the "actual" KL Racing fmic but spec and price wise very similar

Terry put the famous "ebay intercooler" aka the CX Racing...(his has 3" outlets on the FMIC instead of most people that have 2.5"..)

I just installed the same intercooler last weekend but with 2.5" outlets...was a royal pain in the ass but now that its done the car pulls great..

Great post Terry...Looks like I might be keeping my JB4 afterall...

[rooringhusky]

BTW any runs with JB4 intergration on Cobb S2+ Sport?

[1faste903series]

I'm getting so confused now with all these different tunes .It seems each company is in war trying to put each other down .From the looks of things cobb flash looks like it makes the most on pump .Stacking different tunes seems dangerous.You can flash a Cobb while having a jb4 connected ?What does cl mid pipe mean ?

[RaihaX]

Originally Posted by 1faste903series

I'm getting so confused now with all these different tunes .It seems each company is in war trying to put each other down .From the looks of things cobb flash looks like it makes the most on pump .Stacking different tunes seems dangerous.You can flash a Cobb while having a jb4 connected ?What does cl mid pipe mean ?

Catless midpipes.

Stacking seems to be fine as proven by Dz.

I just joined the club and purchase myself a BMS WW kit

[enrita]

Originally Posted by 1faste903series

I'm getting so confused now with all these different tunes .It seems each company is in war trying to put each other down .From the looks of things cobb flash looks like it makes the most on pump .Stacking different tunes seems dangerous.You can flash a Cobb while having a jb4 connected ?What does cl mid pipe mean ?

yes of course you can , just put jb4 on map 0. You use jb4 for all the gauges and adds boost progressively (you set it up yourself per rpm) when meth is flowing.
It requires logging and understanding them.

[1faste903series]

Wow ! You guys are brave stalking tunes and using all these fuels .I rather stick to good old pump gas..How do we know these tests are fair.Did they really use 93 oct ? I did some research and saw people hit over 408 whp using Cobb stage 2+?Dam it every time I think I choose the right tune for me someone makes a new thread with a different test .lol.Maybe I'll keep it stock .

[enrita]

Originally Posted by 1faste903series

Wow ! You guys are brave stalking tunes and using all these fuels .I rather stick to good old pump gas..How do we know these tests are fair.Did they really use 93 oct ? I did some research and saw people hit over 408 whp using Cobb stage 2+?Dam it every time I think I choose the right tune for me someone makes a new thread with a different test .lol.Maybe I'll keep it stock .

you got some reading to do especially on methanol/water injection.

[tscdennab]

Of course there were power gains since the boost was increased by the JB4. Seeing these logs, I don't like what I see about Cobb. The timing is too low (let's say it's ok for non-meth), the boost doesn't reach the target. Plus boost oscillations. Hopefully this will be solved soon. There is a lack of Cobb logs on this forum...

[themyst]

Considering others are also underboosting Cobb + JB4, it's safe to say my unique issue was indeed tune related. Terry needs to go isolated boost control, pronto. As of today, Procede boost control is still superior to both Cobb and JB4. Hopefully not for long though.

[Joshboody]

Originally Posted by themyst

Considering others are also underboosting Cobb + JB4, it's safe to say my unique issue was indeed tune related. Terry needs to go isolated boost control, pronto. As of today, Procede boost control is still superior to both Cobb and JB4. Hopefully not for long though.

+1, BUT Cobb was still under target when JB was just used to log target (CAN channel) and actual boost (read directly from tmap I assume)... very weird. Is it just WG base map, or something else.

[enrita]

here some logs , first one stage 2 plus and rest stage 1 and jb4 progressive meth .

[dzenno]

I have ZERO issues hitting target with the latest RB high boost maps...car's running tons of boost too all the way to the top...

[tscdennab]

Originally Posted by enrita

here some logs , first one stage 2 plus and rest stage 1 and jb4 progressive meth .

You don't have the boost target plotted on those logs.

[enrita]

Originally Posted by tscdennab

You don't have the boost target plotted on those logs.

here you go

[Mike@N54Tuning.com]

Originally Posted by themyst

Considering others are also underboosting Cobb + JB4, it's safe to say my unique issue was indeed tune related. Terry needs to go isolated boost control, pronto. As of today, Procede boost control is still superior to both Cobb and JB4. Hopefully not for long though.

Their N55 board is isolated and could be easily adapted but I don't think that is the answer. On the Cobb only runs the main factor is the wastegate duty cycle is set too low for stock turbos for this car up top and maybe too high down low. Now with the Cobb + JB4 they are running close to 100% duty cycle (wastegates fully closed) and it will only hit 16.5psi @ 6000rpm and 14.5psi @ 6800rpm. The car can hit these same targets JB4 only as well. That is simply all the stock turbos have in them for short dynojet runs. During longer non-dyno runs as EGT increases you can hit higher targets but it won't be efficient. To get power from ~425rw stock turbos up to ~445rw as the piggybacks do more boost isn't the answer. This car simply needs more advance.

Mike

[Mike@N54Tuning.com]

Originally Posted by enrita

here you go

You also need the JB4 target. DMEBT will be the same as the JB4 target on map 4 but on the progressive meth map the JB4 target will be higher of course.

Also with larger turbos I would expect the Cobb to be more likely to over target than under target since it's duty cycles are programmed for stock turbos.

Mike