G05
BMW X5
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2 days agoLAST POST
11-21-2025
Polo’s back - still burning rubber on the spec sheet.

Appreciate the passion, but this rebuttal reads like someone trying to invalidate a real-world towing insight because the tire sizes weren’t held in a laboratory vacuum. Andy Thomson made a clear recommendation based on lived experience and the actual behavior of mid-size SUVs in towing scenarios. He wasn’t writing a whitepaper - he was offering practical advice to improve real-world towing dynamics. And in doing so, he pointed out that lower-profile tires improved performance and handling - the very thing you have been side-eyeing all thread.

Sure, his example involved a size drop and came with the usual trade-offs like speedo calibration - and he stated that plainly. But to then nitpick that it wasn’t a perfect A/B test in a wind tunnel? That’s not a rebuttal, that’s just dodging the bigger point.

Also, let's not pretend Andy is some internet forum hobbyist. He’s got 25+ years of publishing in RV Lifestyle Magazine, runs Can-Am RV Centre, and was trusted by Porsche to set up a Cayenne to tow a 30-foot Airstream. Porsche didn’t seem worried about the tire size delta, they handed him the keys.

Your attempt to disqualify his point by reshaping the conversation back into a tire physics seminar doesn’t change the lived experience of people who have actually towed on both setups. You are defending theoretical max load deltas and rotational inertia like we are towing spreadsheets. Meanwhile, the people who have spent real miles on real roads with real trailers are telling you the X5 rides more confidently on lower-profile, stiffer-sidewall tires.

That’s the part you keep missing. This isn’t about who can Google PSI charts fastest. It’s about what happens at 65 mph when a crosswind hits and the trailer doesn’t flinch, because that is towing stability.

Let’s stop trying to over-theorize what those of us with seat time already know.
Polo08816 wrote
Andy Thomson isn't really saying anything different than what I've been saying, but there's one part that he's actually wrong about that you've cut off:



1. It's an apple to orange comparison. He's not holding overall diameter constant. He's actually comparing two tires of very different sizes.

It's no different than me saying, "Hey, I'll take off my non-factory heavy 35" overall diameter offroad all terrain tires and put my original standard factory size 275/60/20 (33" overall diameter) on my large suv/pickup truck, I'll restore my on road performance, handling, and ride comfort.

Just for comparison:

235/70R16
106H
Max Load: 2,094 lbs
Max PSI: 51psi
Tire Weight: 33lbs
Overall Diameter: 29"

225/60R16
98H
Max Load: 1,653 lbs
Max PSI: 51psi
Tire Weight: 25lbs
Overall Diameter: 26.9"

The smaller tire weighs 8lbs less per tire which will feel like you've had a weight reduction of 320lbs due to lower un-sprung weight. The 26.9" diameter tire will also feel faster when accelerating than the 29" diameter tire because the smaller tire will change your overall drive ratio.

Why didn't Andy Thomson recommend a 225/60/18 (28.9" overall diameter) tire over the 235/70/16 (29.0" overall diameter)? Or better yet, a (225-235)/55/19 tire which is about 28.9" in diameter? Had he held overall diameter constant and simply changed the wheel diameter and tire sidewall profile, it would have been the direct comparison you're talking about, right?


2. Andy Thomson is not exactly correct about "smaller" tires not being quite as good in the snow. "Narrower" tires tend to perform better on snow covered roads.

3. I didn't realize one finger towing was the measure of "stability". Is it possible that your weight distribution hitch isn't transferring enough load onto your front axle and thus you're having the "light steering" sensation? You might want to visit a CAT sale at some point to confirm your rig and hitch are set up properly.
11-22-2025
bono wrote
Polo’s back - still burning rubber on the spec sheet.

Appreciate the passion, but this rebuttal reads like someone trying to invalidate a real-world towing insight because the tire sizes weren’t held in a laboratory vacuum. Andy Thomson made a clear recommendation based on lived experience and the actual behavior of mid-size SUVs in towing scenarios. He wasn’t writing a whitepaper - he was offering practical advice to improve real-world towing dynamics. And in doing so, he pointed out that lower-profile tires improved performance and handling - the very thing you have been side-eyeing all thread.

Sure, his example involved a size drop and came with the usual trade-offs like speedo calibration - and he stated that plainly. But to then nitpick that it wasn’t a perfect A/B test in a wind tunnel? That’s not a rebuttal, that’s just dodging the bigger point.

Also, let's not pretend Andy is some internet forum hobbyist. He’s got 25+ years of publishing in RV Lifestyle Magazine, runs Can-Am RV Centre, and was trusted by Porsche to set up a Cayenne to tow a 30-foot Airstream. Porsche didn’t seem worried about the tire size delta, they handed him the keys.

Your attempt to disqualify his point by reshaping the conversation back into a tire physics seminar doesn’t change the lived experience of people who have actually towed on both setups. You are defending theoretical max load deltas and rotational inertia like we are towing spreadsheets. Meanwhile, the people who have spent real miles on real roads with real trailers are telling you the X5 rides more confidently on lower-profile, stiffer-sidewall tires.

That’s the part you keep missing. This isn’t about who can Google PSI charts fastest. It’s about what happens at 65 mph when a crosswind hits and the trailer doesn’t flinch, because that is towing stability.

Let’s stop trying to over-theorize what those of us with seat time already know.
The part that you keep missing is that quite a few members on this forum currently own (or operate) other tow vehicles in addition to a G05 X5 and we're pretty much telling you the same thing. The G05 X5 isn't our go to tow vehicle because we actually have better solutions (tow vehicles) for the same problem set.

In addition to my F150 and 3 BMWs (to include the G05 X5), I've also towed with various take home work vehicles: Ford Explorer/PIU, Chevy Tahoe PPV, and Chevy Suburban. In each case, the larger/heavier the vehicle, the more stable the towing experience. It was consistent with my experience in the Army when an LMTV would tow the same trailer that a Humvee could with more stability.

A heavier tow vehicle has more mass which means it has greater inertia - it's resistance to changes in its state of motion. The increased inertia makes a heavier vehicle more resistant to being pushed or pulled out of its straight path by cross winds, etc.

That's not just theoretical. It's "lived experience".

You only tow with a G05 X5 currently, correct?

My lived experience is just consistent with physics and consistent with conventional towing knowledge.
11-22-2025
Oh, so we are changing the tune now? We have moved on from Tire Rack spreadsheets and are now playing the “I own multiple vehicles, so I must know best” symphony?

Look, if you genuinely think an F150 is a better tow vehicle than a G05 X5 within the same towing class, then we are in full delusion territory.

You brought up owning multiple vehicles and having “better solutions.” Cool. I don’t need to introduce Andy Thomson, do I? The man who’s been hands-on with more tow vehicles than most of us will drive in a lifetime—including plenty of trucks, which he has in his company. And when he sends his daughter and her friends camping, guess what they’re pulling that 27' Airstream with? A Jaguar XJ. Yeah. But I am sure he just doesn’t know what he is doing with tow safety, right?

Also, just a side note, X5 50e is heavier than most F-150s on the market. So let’s check the boxes:

Lower center of gravity
Shorter rear overhang
Far superior suspension
Better brakes
Better tires
And more weight

That’s not a liability - it’s a stability advantage.

BMW engineered the ultimate towing machine for its class.
Polo08816 wrote
The part that you keep missing is that quite a few members on this forum currently own (or operate) other tow vehicles in addition to a G05 X5 and we're pretty much telling you the same thing. The G05 X5 isn't our go to tow vehicle because we actually have better solutions (tow vehicles) for the same problem set.

In addition to my F150 and 3 BMWs (to include the G05 X5), I've also towed with various take home work vehicles: Ford Explorer/PIU, Chevy Tahoe PPV, and Chevy Suburban. In each case, the larger/heavier the vehicle, the more stable the towing experience. It was consistent with my experience in the Army when an LMTV would tow the same trailer that a Humvee could with more stability.

A heavier tow vehicle has more mass which means it has greater inertia - it's resistance to changes in its state of motion. The increased inertia makes a heavier vehicle more resistant to being pushed or pulled out of its straight path by cross winds, etc.

That's not just theoretical. It's "lived experience".

You only tow with a G05 X5 currently, correct?

My lived experience is just consistent with physics and consistent with conventional towing knowledge.
11-22-2025
bono wrote
Oh, so we are changing the tune now? We have moved on from Tire Rack spreadsheets and are now playing the “I own multiple vehicles, so I must know best” symphony?

Look, if you genuinely think an F150 is a better tow vehicle than a G05 X5 within the same towing class, then we are in full delusion territory.

You brought up owning multiple vehicles and having “better solutions.” Cool. I don’t need to introduce Andy Thomson, do I? The man who’s been hands-on with more tow vehicles than most of us will drive in a lifetime—including plenty of trucks, which he has in his company. And when he sends his daughter and her friends camping, guess what they’re pulling that 27' Airstream with? A Jaguar XJ. Yeah. But I am sure he just doesn’t know what he is doing with tow safety, right?

Also, just a side note, X5 50e is heavier than most F-150s on the market. So let’s check the boxes:

Lower center of gravity
Shorter rear overhang
Far superior suspension
Better brakes
Better tires
And more weight

That’s not a liability - it’s a stability advantage.

BMW engineered the ultimate towing machine for its class.
Why are you comparing a X5 50e with "most F-150s"? Isn't the more appropriate comparison a X5 xDrive40i vs most F150s (4x4 SuperCrew with 5.5 bed and 3.5 EcoBoost) and a (X5 50e vs a F150 PowerBoost)? A X5 xDrive40i, the most popular X5 model, weighs less than most F150s and a X5 50e weighs no more than an F150 PowerBoost yet has significantly less cargo capacity.

Your comparisons of vehicles and tires make very little sense thus far.

One thing you need to understand is that how well a vehicle handles by itself matters far less when the vehicle is being subjected to external forces such as a trailer. If what you are saying is true, we'd all want to be towing with a Porsche 911 GT3 instead of an SUV.

  1. Lower center of gravity - The impact isn't as much as you think. An LMTV weighs 20k lbs and has a much higher COG than a Humvee which weighs anywhere from 5.5k to 10k lbs. Yet when towing the same trailer, the LMTV is the far more stable towing platform. I've towed the same car on a U-Haul trailer with an Enterprise gas Ram 2500 and my F150 before. The Ram 2500 has a far taller COG than the F150, yet it's more stable than a 1/2 ton. The COG of your trailer is likely higher than your tow vehicle unless you have a really low flat bed trailer with cinder blocks placed right in front of the trailer axles.
  2. Shorter rear overhang - This by itself means nothing. The metric that makes this significant is wheelbase to rear overhang ratio. We've been here before. The wheel base to rear overhang ratio is more advantageous in your typical 1/2 ton crew cab 5.5 foot bed. The increased distance between your tow vehicle's axle provides more leverage to counteract the swaying motion of a trailer. In this regard, the X7 should also be superior to the X5.
  3. Far superior suspension - Again, this doesn't matter as much as you think when a tow vehicle is the subject of external forces such as a trailer. I go back to the 20k lbs LMTV vs 5-10k lbs Humvee example. The LMTV has a solid front and solid rear axle and the Humvee has a fully independent suspension. Despite this far inferior suspension, the LMTV is a far more stable and capable towing platform.
  4. Better brakes - Sure, my G05 xDrive40i M Sport trim, trailer tow pkg, and M Sport Brake option has better brakes than my F150. But both of them have brakes that have the capability to lock up multiple times before they overheat. However, the real difference that matters when towing is my G05 xDrive40i can't compare to my F150 5.0's hill grade braking ability. There's significantly more engine compression braking in my F150 that I'm able to coast downhill without needing to apply foot brake input nearly as often as I would on the X5. This would be similar to TFL's downhill portion of the Ike Gauntlet reviews where they observe how many brake applications are needed to maintain a certain speed range for their test rigs.
  5. Better tires - True for handling/performance of a single vehicle by itself. But load capacity matters more when towing/trailering. It's why load range E tires will resist trailer sway far better than a standard load tire.
  6. And more weight - See example addressed in the first part of this post.
11-22-2025
Here we go again… Feels like we are just running in circles at this point. I wasn’t planning to go line-by-line anymore, because frankly, most of this debate has been repeated ad nauseam.

But let me just say this: Why am I comparing the X5 50e? Because… that’s the tow vehicle I actually own and use. Not sure what’s confusing about that. You’re welcome to compare the 40i to an F-150 if you like, but even the 40i is heavier than many F-150s roaming the roads.

You are dismissive about factors like low center of gravity, short overhang, suspension, etc. That’s totally fine with me. I am not trying to convert anyone. But the reality is - with my X5 I can tow a 33ft trailer with one finger on the wheel, even when semis fly by on the freeway. No drama. No turbulence. No wide knuckling. Just a planted, stable drive.

Compare that with towing the same trailer behind a half-ton truck and you will feel like you are landing a Cessna in a thunderstorm. Good luck with that.

And since someone brought up Porsche 911s as a joke tow rig... You mean like... this one below? I added some other photos for fun.

But yeah - clearly, we all should be towing with ancient boxy pickups on E-rated tires only. Because physics magically stops working when the badge says “BMW.”


Polo08816 wrote
Why are you comparing a X5 50e with "most F-150s"? Isn't the more appropriate comparison a X5 xDrive40i vs most F150s (4x4 SuperCrew with 5.5 bed and 3.5 EcoBoost) and a (X5 50e vs a F150 PowerBoost)? A X5 xDrive40i, the most popular X5 model, weighs less than most F150s and a X5 50e weighs no more than an F150 PowerBoost yet has significantly less cargo capacity.

Your comparisons of vehicles and tires make very little sense thus far.

One thing you need to understand is that how well a vehicle handles by itself matters far less when the vehicle is being subjected to external forces such as a trailer. If what you are saying is true, we'd all want to be towing with a Porsche 911 GT3 instead of an SUV.

  1. Lower center of gravity - The impact isn't as much as you think. An LMTV weighs 20k lbs and has a much higher COG than a Humvee which weighs anywhere from 5.5k to 10k lbs. Yet when towing the same trailer, the LMTV is the far more stable towing platform. I've towed the same car on a U-Haul trailer with an Enterprise gas Ram 2500 and my F150 before. The Ram 2500 has a far taller COG than the F150, yet it's more stable than a 1/2 ton. The COG of your trailer is likely higher than your tow vehicle unless you have a really low flat bed trailer with cinder blocks placed right in front of the trailer axles.
  2. Shorter rear overhang - This by itself means nothing. The metric that makes this significant is wheelbase to rear overhang ratio. We've been here before. The wheel base to rear overhang ratio is more advantageous in your typical 1/2 ton crew cab 5.5 foot bed. The increased distance between your tow vehicle's axle provides more leverage to counteract the swaying motion of a trailer. In this regard, the X7 should also be superior to the X5.
  3. Far superior suspension - Again, this doesn't matter as much as you think when a tow vehicle is the subject of external forces such as a trailer. I go back to the 20k lbs LMTV vs 5-10k lbs Humvee example. The LMTV has a solid front and solid rear axle and the Humvee has a fully independent suspension. Despite this far inferior suspension, the LMTV is a far more stable and capable towing platform.
  4. Better brakes - Sure, my G05 xDrive40i M Sport trim, trailer tow pkg, and M Sport Brake option has better brakes than my F150. But both of them have brakes that have the capability to lock up multiple times before they overheat. However, the real difference that matters when towing is my G05 xDrive40i can't compare to my F150 5.0's hill grade braking ability. There's significantly more engine compression braking in my F150 that I'm able to coast downhill without needing to apply foot brake input nearly as often as I would on the X5. This would be similar to TFL's downhill portion of the Ike Gauntlet reviews where they observe how many brake applications are needed to maintain a certain speed range for their test rigs.
  5. Better tires - True for handling/performance of a single vehicle by itself. But load capacity matters more when towing/trailering. It's why load range E tires will resist trailer sway far better than a standard load tire.
  6. And more weight - See example addressed in the first part of this post.
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11-22-2025
bono wrote
Here we go again… Feels like we are just running in circles at this point. I wasn’t planning to go line-by-line anymore, because frankly, most of this debate has been repeated ad nauseam.

But let me just say this: Why am I comparing the X5 50e? Because… that’s the tow vehicle I actually own and use. Not sure what’s confusing about that. You’re welcome to compare the 40i to an F-150 if you like, but even the 40i is heavier than many F-150s roaming the roads.

You are dismissive about factors like low center of gravity, short overhang, suspension, etc. That’s totally fine with me. I am not trying to convert anyone. But the reality is - with my X5 I can tow a 33ft trailer with one finger on the wheel, even when semis fly by on the freeway. No drama. No turbulence. No wide knuckling. Just a planted, stable drive.

Compare that with towing the same trailer behind a half-ton truck and you will feel like you are landing a Cessna in a thunderstorm. Good luck with that.

And since someone brought up Porsche 911s as a joke tow rig... You mean like... this one below? I added some other photos for fun.

But yeah - clearly, we all should be towing with ancient boxy pickups on E-rated tires only. Because physics magically stops working when the badge says “BMW.”
"One finger on the wheel" probably indicates that your steer axle is too light because either your trailer is poorly balanced and/or your weight distribution hitch isn't transferring enough weight from the tongue of the your onto your steer axle. You should really get to a CAT weigh station and get that checked out.

I love how all the pictures you have are of trailers hooked up to smaller cars in parking lots or in the case of the 911, on local roads. I'm waiting for a Youtube video of one of them keeping up with traffic on an interstate with an 6,000-8,000lbs enclosed trailer at 70-80mph which is the expectation here in the United States.

Also, the 40i is NOT heavier than most F150s on the road today - I've already disproved your assertion. The xDrive40i is ~5,200lbs (less passenger) and has a GVWR 6,360lbs. The F150 is about 5,600lbs and has a GVWR 7,200lbs. I have both (aka "lived experience) and I have weigh tickets for both ("qualitative data").


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11-23-2025
Here we go again... We are clearly running in circles, so let me - a patient, helpful and a kind man - help you understand some basic physics of towing, since I see you are still trying to piece it together using spreadsheets and anecdotal comparisons from your fleet of Humvees and LMTVs.

One finger physics for beginners
You said, “One finger on the wheel” probably means your steer axle is too light. Oh boy. That’s... not how any of this works. If my front axle were light, I would be fighting for control, white-knuckling it like I am landing a plane in turbulence (similar to towing with a truck). One finger means the opposite: the whole combo is balanced and planted. Low center of gravity, short rear overhang, adaptive suspension (you know, those things that in your opinion do not matter for towing...) - it’s almost like BMW engineers knew what they were doing. I get that you are still learning from spreadsheets and brochure specs, so take this as a friendly tip from someone who is actually towing in real life, not just arguing theory in forums.

Scared of parking lots?
You “love how all the pictures are in parking lots” and are “waiting for a YouTube video”. They must have built those custom hitches just to flex in a parking lot! Sure buddy. Fabricating a hitch for aesthetic Instagram clout. Sounds totally rational. I get it - seeing a Corvette, Camaro or 911 towing makes your brain hurt a little. You are scared of what you are seeing. So you are trying to deny it. There will never be enough evidence to shift your mindset from “only a body-on-frame truck can tow” to “maybe, just maybe, modern vehicles can be better.”

Weight reality check
About your “X5 40i isn’t heavier than most F-150s” comment. Please re-read what I wrote - I said “(...) even the 40i is heavier than many F-150s roaming the roads.” Not “all,” not “most,” but many - which is still factually correct.

Let me break it down for you:

BMW X5 xDrive40i curb weight: ~5,200 lbs [your data]

F-150 curb weight - straight from google "it generally ranges from approximately 4,000 to over 6,000 pounds. For example, a 2024 model can be as light as about 4,021 pounds (Regular Cab, 2WD, 2.7L EcoBoost) and as heavy as 5,540 pounds (SuperCrew, 4x4, 3.5L PowerBoost Hybrid).". If this does not align with your spreadsheets and brochures, please let us know.

And considering the best-selling F-150s in America are often fleet-spec, base trims, it’s more than safe to say that majority of them are lighter than the 40i.

Can I help with explaining anything else? Happy to help.
Polo08816 wrote
"One finger on the wheel" probably indicates that your steer axle is too light because either your trailer is poorly balanced and/or your weight distribution hitch isn't transferring enough weight from the tongue of the your onto your steer axle. You should really get to a CAT weigh station and get that checked out.

I love how all the pictures you have are of trailers hooked up to smaller cars in parking lots or in the case of the 911, on local roads. I'm waiting for a Youtube video of one of them keeping up with traffic on an interstate with an 6,000-8,000lbs enclosed trailer at 70-80mph which is the expectation here in the United States.

Also, the 40i is NOT heavier than most F150s on the road today - I've already disproved your assertion. The xDrive40i is ~5,200lbs (less passenger) and has a GVWR 6,360lbs. The F150 is about 5,600lbs and has a GVWR 7,200lbs. I have both (aka "lived experience) and I have weigh tickets for both ("qualitative data").


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11-23-2025
bono wrote
Here we go again... We are clearly running in circles, so let me - a patient, helpful and a kind man - help you understand some basic physics of towing, since I see you are still trying to piece it together using spreadsheets and anecdotal comparisons from your fleet of Humvees and LMTVs.

One finger physics for beginners
You said, “One finger on the wheel” probably means your steer axle is too light. Oh boy. That’s... not how any of this works. If my front axle were light, I would be fighting for control, white-knuckling it like I am landing a plane in turbulence (similar to towing with a truck). One finger means the opposite: the whole combo is balanced and planted. Low center of gravity, short rear overhang, adaptive suspension (you know, those things that in your opinion do not matter for towing...) - it’s almost like BMW engineers knew what they were doing. I get that you are still learning from spreadsheets and brochure specs, so take this as a friendly tip from someone who is actually towing in real life, not just arguing theory in forums.
Interesting. I can't remember being taught or instructing students to ever steer their vehicles with one finger. Not at any BMW CCA or PCA HPDE, not at any driver's training for law enforcement, and not at any driver's training in the military to be licensed on any tactical military vehicle. I didn't realized that being able to to drive by steering with one finger demonstrates how planted and balanced a vehicle must be. BMW CCA should really get rid of all their seasoned HPDE instructors since they are doing it all wrong. You should definitely get nominated as the Chief Instructor with your sage driving advice.

bono wrote

Scared of parking lots?
You “love how all the pictures are in parking lots” and are “waiting for a YouTube video”. They must have built those custom hitches just to flex in a parking lot! Sure buddy. Fabricating a hitch for aesthetic Instagram clout. Sounds totally rational. I get it - seeing a Corvette, Camaro or 911 towing makes your brain hurt a little. You are scared of what you are seeing. So you are trying to deny it. There will never be enough evidence to shift your mindset from “only a body-on-frame truck can tow” to “maybe, just maybe, modern vehicles can be better.”
... then show them actually towing and keeping up with traffic on US interstates at 70-80mph.

Even a small car can be hitched up to a large trailer in a parking lot. That proves nothing. Heck, a small Corolla can move a 45 foot goose neck trailer around in a parking lot.

bono wrote

Weight reality check
About your “X5 40i isn’t heavier than most F-150s” comment. Please re-read what I wrote - I said “(...) even the 40i is heavier than many F-150s roaming the roads.” Not “all,” not “most,” but many - which is still factually correct.

Let me break it down for you:

BMW X5 xDrive40i curb weight: ~5,200 lbs [your data]

F-150 curb weight - straight from google "it generally ranges from approximately 4,000 to over 6,000 pounds. For example, a 2024 model can be as light as about 4,021 pounds (Regular Cab, 2WD, 2.7L EcoBoost) and as heavy as 5,540 pounds (SuperCrew, 4x4, 3.5L PowerBoost Hybrid).". If this does not align with your spreadsheets and brochures, please let us know.

And considering the best-selling F-150s in America are often fleet-spec, base trims, it’s more than safe to say that majority of them are lighter than the 40i.

Can I help with explaining anything else? Happy to help.
I gave you the reality check. Actual data from weigh tickets - something that you've never shown anyone here. Your CAT weigh tickets are like the Epstein files!

Don't always believe Google - just like don't always believe Andy Thomson unless you've met the man in real life. There's no way a PowerBoost hybrid's max curb weight is only 5,540lbs because PowerBoost models should be 200-400lbs heavier than non-PowerBoost models. My F150 non-PowerBoost model isn't even a top trim F150 and it clearly weighs more than the max curb weight you've referenced. It has a gross vehicle weigh of ~5,600lbs unloaded.


At the day, you can conjecture all day from the stuff you read on the interwebs, but it doesn't beat "lived experience" from actually owning BOTH vehicles to form a real comparison. My "lived comparison" is consistent with what the spec sheets would indicate.

Here's a picture my 2nd oil change on my 2026 G05 X5 that just hit 5,000 miles with the F150 sitting in the driveway. One oil change at ~1,000 miles and my 2nd oil change at 5,000 miles. Next one will be at the dealership at 10,000 miles.
An image attached to this post, provided by the poster
11-23-2025
I was genuinely hoping for some new and groundbreaking theories this time… but unfortunately, just another lap around the same cul-de-sac. Disappointed, but not surprised.
11-24-2025
A car that does not have a full size spare should not be used as a tow vehicle. you’ll find that out at 8PM sometime on a snowy day when you have a flat in the rear. Also when a service department cannot sell you the plug to wire in the brake controller on your car you may move on to a something else next time.

Not pointing to BMW specifically..
11-24-2025
X5_Oxfordii wrote
A car that does not have a full size spare should not be used as a tow vehicle. you’ll find that out at 8PM sometime on a snowy day when you have a flat in the rear. Also when a service department cannot sell you the plug to wire in the brake controller on your car you may move on to a something else next time.

Not pointing to BMW specifically..
A track buddy found out the drawbacks of towing with a vehicle that didn't have a full size spare. It cost him an extra day or two on his way back home on an interstate. He had to wait for the tire shop to source a less than common size tire. This wouldn't have been a problem with a common tire size like a 275/60/20 which almost every tire shop in the country probably keeps inventory on hand for. Then again most vehicles that use a common tire size like a 275/60/20 also have a full size spare.

I also lean towards having a full size spare on vehicles that go on longer road trips. Before we had our X5 and F150, we had the X3 which doesn't have any type of spare tire at all. I've repaired nail/screw punctures myself on long road trips and fortunately none of them were too close to the sidewall. I keep a compact/micro impact wrench, 1/2 drive adapter for the scissor jack, and appropriate torque stick in every car that I own. The rationale is that the equipment is a small price to pay to reduce the amount of time that I (or a loved one) is standing by the side of the a vehicle trying to get the tire/wheel off/on the vehicle.
11-24-2025
I get the concern. I really do. Nobody wants to be stranded on the side of the road with a flat, especially at night in bad weather. But let’s just bring a bit of real-world perspective to this. Flats are rare. A genuinely catastrophic blowout that leaves you stranded and unrepairable on the spot? Even rarer. And for the vanishingly small chance that it does happen, I would still rather be towing with a stable, balanced, confident tow vehicle like the X5 - even if it doesn't carry a full-size spare - than a wallowy, loose setup with a full-size spare bouncing in the bed like some kind of lucky rabbit’s foot.

Let’s stay focused: towing isn’t just about what happens once every 100k miles. It’s about what happens every second you are on the road.
Polo08816 wrote
A track buddy found out the drawbacks of towing with a vehicle that didn't have a full size spare. It cost him an extra day or two on his way back home on an interstate. He had to wait for the tire shop to source a less than common size tire. This wouldn't have been a problem with a common tire size like a 275/60/20 which almost every tire shop in the country probably keeps inventory on hand for. Then again most vehicles that use a common tire size like a 275/60/20 also have a full size spare.

I also lean towards having a full size spare on vehicles that go on longer road trips. Before we had our X5 and F150, we had the X3 which doesn't have any type of spare tire at all. I've repaired nail/screw punctures myself on long road trips and fortunately none of them were too close to the sidewall. I keep a compact/micro impact wrench, 1/2 drive adapter for the scissor jack, and appropriate torque stick in every car that I own. The rationale is that the equipment is a small price to pay to reduce the amount of time that I (or a loved one) is standing by the side of the a vehicle trying to get the tire/wheel off/on the vehicle.
11-25-2025
bono wrote
I get the concern. I really do. Nobody wants to be stranded on the side of the road with a flat, especially at night in bad weather. But let’s just bring a bit of real-world perspective to this. Flats are rare. A genuinely catastrophic blowout that leaves you stranded and unrepairable on the spot? Even rarer. And for the vanishingly small chance that it does happen, I would still rather be towing with a stable, balanced, confident tow vehicle like the X5 - even if it doesn't carry a full-size spare - than a wallowy, loose setup with a full-size spare bouncing in the bed like some kind of lucky rabbit’s foot.

Let’s stay focused: towing isn’t just about what happens once every 100k miles. It’s about what happens every second you are on the road.
This is where we are going in circles.

But I actually own BOTH vehicles and of course I'd prefer to tow with the more "stable, balanced, confident tow vehicle".

Based on lived experience of having both vehicles, the F150 is simply the better tool for the task at hand. When I'm not towing or carrying a significant load, I'd rather drive my G05 X5, F25 X3, or F30 335i. That's why I have almost 1,500 more miles on the X5 than the F150 despite picking both of them up in the June/July 2025 timeframe.

As for tire punctures, I've had tire punctures on my personal and work vehicles almost once every 10,000 miles. I prefer to be able to swap in a full size spare and store the damaged tire until it's convenient for me to bring it to a tire shop that can repair it properly. I've personally plugged tires on my cars without a spare or full size spare, but I always prefer it being patched and plugged which you can't do without unmounting the tire.

But when it comes to more stable and confident towing/trailering, as an owner of both an F150 and G05 X5, I can unequivocally say that the F150 is better towing not only for every second I'm on the road, but all the times when I'm "off the road" as well.

What reason would I have to lie about this? I'm clearly a BMW fan since I currently own 3 BMWs (G05 X5, F25 X3 35i, and F30 335i). And since I basically own all the common options being discussed here, I would argue that there's less reason to have confirmation bias in what I'm saying.
11-25-2025
Oh Polo, here we go again - I wasn’t going to respond again, but your last paragraph was just too good to pass up.

“But when it comes to more stable and confident towing/trailering, as an owner of both an F150 and G05 X5, I can unequivocally say that the F150 is better towing not only for every second I'm on the road, but all the times when I'm "off the road" as well.”

This is gold. You don’t even tow anything significant with the X5, yet you are "unequivocally" confident it’s worse. That is like reviewing a Michelin-starred restaurant after only licking the menu.

And then there's the "off the road" part... Wait, are we towing travel trailers or prepping for Dakar? The very suspension characteristics that make a vehicle great off-road (long travel, soft dampening, high COG) are literally what you don’t want when towing on pavement. Meanwhile, vehicles like the X5, with lower center of gravity, shorter overhang, stiffer and more responsive suspension, and tighter steering geometry offer significantly more control where it matters most: the road.

But hey, maybe they just skipped "Towing physics 101" in Army training. Must’ve gone straight from "How to rip out bushes with an LMTV” to "Advanced Forum Posturing". I understand yo are still learning from spreadsheets and torque specs, so as a patient man, I am here to help.

Polo08816 wrote
This is where we are going in circles.

But I actually own BOTH vehicles and of course I'd prefer to tow with the more "stable, balanced, confident tow vehicle".

Based on lived experience of having both vehicles, the F150 is simply the better tool for the task at hand. When I'm not towing or carrying a significant load, I'd rather drive my G05 X5, F25 X3, or F30 335i. That's why I have almost 1,500 more miles on the X5 than the F150 despite picking both of them up in the June/July 2025 timeframe.

As for tire punctures, I've had tire punctures on my personal and work vehicles almost once every 10,000 miles. I prefer to be able to swap in a full size spare and store the damaged tire until it's convenient for me to bring it to a tire shop that can repair it properly. I've personally plugged tires on my cars without a spare or full size spare, but I always prefer it being patched and plugged which you can't do without unmounting the tire.

But when it comes to more stable and confident towing/trailering, as an owner of both an F150 and G05 X5, I can unequivocally say that the F150 is better towing not only for every second I'm on the road, but all the times when I'm "off the road" as well.

What reason would I have to lie about this? I'm clearly a BMW fan since I currently own 3 BMWs (G05 X5, F25 X3 35i, and F30 335i). And since I basically own all the common options being discussed here, I would argue that there's less reason to have confirmation bias in what I'm saying.
11-25-2025
bono wrote
Oh Polo, here we go again - I wasn’t going to respond again, but your last paragraph was just too good to pass up.

“But when it comes to more stable and confident towing/trailering, as an owner of both an F150 and G05 X5, I can unequivocally say that the F150 is better towing not only for every second I'm on the road, but all the times when I'm "off the road" as well.”

This is gold. You don’t even tow anything significant with the X5, yet you are "unequivocally" confident it’s worse. That is like reviewing a Michelin-starred restaurant after only licking the menu.

And then there's the "off the road" part... Wait, are we towing travel trailers or prepping for Dakar? The very suspension characteristics that make a vehicle great off-road (long travel, soft dampening, high COG) are literally what you don’t want when towing on pavement. Meanwhile, vehicles like the X5, with lower center of gravity, shorter overhang, stiffer and more responsive suspension, and tighter steering geometry offer significantly more control where it matters most: the road.

But hey, maybe they just skipped "Towing physics 101" in Army training. Must’ve gone straight from "How to rip out bushes with an LMTV” to "Advanced Forum Posturing". I understand yo are still learning from spreadsheets and torque specs, so as a patient man, I am here to help.
Even in situations involve trailers that are right at the upper limit of the G05 X5's rated capacities, the F150 is a more stable and confident towing platform. Again, why would I lie? I actually own both vehicles. I'm in a position to actually compare them.

The G05 X5 is not rated to tow anything significant so why would I when I have another tow vehicle that is rated to tow what I need. But don't take my word for it, take BMW's word for it. If you take issue with what BMW is specifying, your fight is with them, not with me. I'm just the messenger of facts.

G05 X5's hitch receiver is only rated for a max tongue load of 551lbs and it also forbids the use of weight distribution.

524854881_10120768546243729_5403175388155267363_n.jpg?stp=cp6_dst-jpg_tt6&_nc_cat=111&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=f727a1&_nc_ohc=7JgeNMAenIkQ7kNvwHNi952&_nc_oc=AdnYMogwvsYwQP5zqISnJrpqpn81pew3-iWnBORUalvfXdOFqDotfz5lwbExaEDkvdc&_nc_zt=23&_nc_ht=scontent-lga3-1.xx&_nc_gid=2AKpE9XLfkRJIKXuvLB48w&oh=00_AfhQ_9A8yi013VegUJPnYS8eq4CmWBQ_8XoB5iD5m80Zzw&oe=692AFD81

"Off the road" mean a lot of things and full size SUVs/pickups have a lot of features that are useful in off road situations such as a locking rear differential and 2 speed transfer case - features that are not available in my G05 X5. "Off the road" refers to situations where you are traction limited or have abnormally long steep declines/inclines where having a low range can be useful and advantageous. None of these features are mutually exclusive with towing capability.

But if you "off the road" only meant Baja style vehicles, then yes, the Ford F150 Raptor's towing capacities are lower than the typical F150's, but still higher than the G05 X5's. The F150 Raptor has a more "advanced' suspension than the standard F150 and handles better than a standard F150 but that doesn't translate into better towing capacities. Because how well one vehicle handles as a single unit doesn't directly translate into it being a more stable towing vehicle when an external force is being applied.
11-25-2025
Ah yes, the man who doesn’t tow anything significant with his X5 confidently declaring the F150 tows better. That’s rich.

Also, love the pivot to off-road features, because clearly, low-range crawling is super relevant when towing on the interstate.

I will pass now. This discussion has entered the "I tow in theory" stage, and life’s too short for hypotheticals in truck cosplay.
Polo08816 wrote
Even in situations involve trailers that are right at the upper limit of the G05 X5's rated capacities, the F150 is a more stable and confident towing platform. Again, why would I lie? I actually own both vehicles. I'm in a position to actually compare them.

The G05 X5 is not rated to tow anything significant so why would I when I have another tow vehicle that is rated to tow what I need. But don't take my word for it, take BMW's word for it. If you take issue with what BMW is specifying, your fight is with them, not with me. I'm just the messenger of facts.

G05 X5's hitch receiver is only rated for a max tongue load of 551lbs and it also forbids the use of weight distribution.

524854881_10120768546243729_5403175388155267363_n.jpg?stp=cp6_dst-jpg_tt6&_nc_cat=111&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=f727a1&_nc_ohc=7JgeNMAenIkQ7kNvwHNi952&_nc_oc=AdnYMogwvsYwQP5zqISnJrpqpn81pew3-iWnBORUalvfXdOFqDotfz5lwbExaEDkvdc&_nc_zt=23&_nc_ht=scontent-lga3-1.xx&_nc_gid=2AKpE9XLfkRJIKXuvLB48w&oh=00_AfhQ_9A8yi013VegUJPnYS8eq4CmWBQ_8XoB5iD5m80Zzw&oe=692AFD81

"Off the road" mean a lot of things and full size SUVs/pickups have a lot of features that are useful in off road situations such as a locking rear differential and 2 speed transfer case - features that are not available in my G05 X5. "Off the road" refers to situations where you are traction limited or have abnormally long steep declines/inclines where having a low range can be useful and advantageous. None of these features are mutually exclusive with towing capability.

But if you "off the road" only meant Baja style vehicles, then yes, the Ford F150 Raptor's towing capacities are lower than the typical F150's, but still higher than the G05 X5's. The F150 Raptor has a more "advanced' suspension than the standard F150 and handles better than a standard F150 but that doesn't translate into better towing capacities. Because how well one vehicle handles as a single unit doesn't directly translate into it being a more stable towing vehicle when an external force is being applied.
11-25-2025
bono wrote
Ah yes, the man who doesn’t tow anything significant with his X5 confidently declaring the F150 tows better. That’s rich.

Also, love the pivot to off-road features, because clearly, low-range crawling is super relevant when towing on the interstate.

I will pass now. This discussion has entered the "I tow in theory" stage, and life’s too short for hypotheticals in truck cosplay.
Why would I use my G05 X5 to tow heavier trailers that exceed BMW's specified limits when my F150 is the better tool for the job?

It's theoretical for you because it sounds like you only have the G05 X5 as a tow vehicle and it seems like you're suffering from a bit of confirmation bias.

It's "lived experience" for me because I have both a G05 X5 and F150. It seems like I'm the only one out of the two of us that is actually in a position to provide the "lived experience" comparison.
11-25-2025
I had to move my small (2500lb load) trailer the other day and happened to be driving my X5 rather than my F150, so I hooked it up and drove it 60 miles or so at 65mph to get it where I needed. It was mostly fine but way more noticeable back there than when towed by the pickup. I sure had to put more of my right foot into the gas than in the truck.

I understand that some X5 owners might have confirmation bias about towing with their X5 simply because that’s the only option they have. It’s one thing to point out that the X5 is a reasonably capable tow vehicle within its advertised limits, but it’s borderline ridiculous to say that it does better than a modern half-ton pickup with much higher advertised limits.
11-25-2025
Oh wow, thanks for the groundbreaking insight from your life-changing 60-mile towing adventure with a 2,500 lb trailer. You really pushed the X5 to its absolute limits there - I hope you brought a pit crew and a medal ceremony.

About the "confirmation bias" comment - you just described yourself. You have got a truck, and you are convinced it’s the only tool for the job because it says F-150 on the side and "Built Ford Tough" in the commercials. Cute. Meanwhile, I am comfortably towing a 33' travel trailer with one finger on the wheel while your crew is still white-knuckling like they are landing a Cessna in turbulence.

Nobody - and I mean nobody - tows a 33' trailer long term with a half-ton truck unless they enjoy stress, sway, and early chiropractic bills. I have got videos showing my setup gliding with semis passing by, but I know how this goes - just like with the 911s, Corvettes, and Camaros towing trailers - the truck cult sees it and still screams "fake news".

Anyway, thanks for the anecdote. I have got videos, real-world miles, and actual stability. You have got vibes and vague anecdotes from the shallow end of the towing pool.

For those interested in learning about tow vehicles beyond traditional trucks, I highly recommend everything Andy Thomson publishes, including the video library at https://www.canamrv.ca/towing-expertise/videos/

They offer an education rooted in actual towing dynamics - not just dealership brochures and truck commercials.

Also, given how wrong you and your buddy have been on so many basic aspects of towing physics, I will be honest, I don’t consider your opinion particularly important in this discussion.
tooloud10 wrote
I had to move my small (2500lb load) trailer the other day and happened to be driving my X5 rather than my F150, so I hooked it up and drove it 60 miles or so at 65mph to get it where I needed. It was mostly fine but way more noticeable back there than when towed by the pickup. I sure had to put more of my right foot into the gas than in the truck.

I understand that some X5 owners might have confirmation bias about towing with their X5 simply because that’s the only option they have. It’s one thing to point out that the X5 is a reasonably capable tow vehicle within its advertised limits, but it’s borderline ridiculous to say that it does better than a modern half-ton pickup with much higher advertised limits.
11-26-2025
Polo08816 wrote
Why would I use my G05 X5 to tow heavier trailers that exceed BMW's specified limits when my F150 is the better tool for the job?

It's theoretical for you because it sounds like you only have the G05 X5 as a tow vehicle and it seems like you're suffering from a bit of confirmation bias.

It's "lived experience" for me because I have both a G05 X5 and F150. It seems like I'm the only one out of the two of us that is actually in a position to provide the "lived experience" comparison.
tooloud10 wrote
I had to move my small (2500lb load) trailer the other day and happened to be driving my X5 rather than my F150, so I hooked it up and drove it 60 miles or so at 65mph to get it where I needed. It was mostly fine but way more noticeable back there than when towed by the pickup. I sure had to put more of my right foot into the gas than in the truck.

I understand that some X5 owners might have confirmation bias about towing with their X5 simply because that’s the only option they have. It’s one thing to point out that the X5 is a reasonably capable tow vehicle within its advertised limits, but it’s borderline ridiculous to say that it does better than a modern half-ton pickup with much higher advertised limits.
bono wrote
Oh wow, thanks for the groundbreaking insight from your life-changing 60-mile towing adventure with a 2,500 lb trailer. You really pushed the X5 to its absolute limits there - I hope you brought a pit crew and a medal ceremony.

About the "confirmation bias" comment - you just described yourself. You have got a truck, and you are convinced it’s the only tool for the job because it says F-150 on the side and "Built Ford Tough" in the commercials. Cute. Meanwhile, I am comfortably towing a 33' travel trailer with one finger on the wheel while your crew is still white-knuckling like they are landing a Cessna in turbulence.

Nobody - and I mean nobody - tows a 33' trailer long term with a half-ton truck unless they enjoy stress, sway, and early chiropractic bills. I have got videos showing my setup gliding with semis passing by, but I know how this goes - just like with the 911s, Corvettes, and Camaros towing trailers - the truck cult sees it and still screams "fake news".

Anyway, thanks for the anecdote. I have got videos, real-world miles, and actual stability. You have got vibes and vague anecdotes from the shallow end of the towing pool.

For those interested in learning about tow vehicles beyond traditional trucks, I highly recommend everything Andy Thomson publishes, including the video library at https://www.canamrv.ca/towing-expertise/videos/

They offer an education rooted in actual towing dynamics - not just dealership brochures and truck commercials.

Also, given how wrong you and your buddy have been on so many basic aspects of towing physics, I will be honest, I don’t consider your opinion particularly important in this discussion.
Both tooloud10's user avatartooloud10 and myself have both a half ton pickup AND a G05 X5, and our "lived experience" tells us that the F150 is more the more stable towing platform. We are in a position to provide a side by side comparison, you're not. You only own one of the two options that's being discussed. We own multiple BMWs and yet we're not nearly as delusional as bono's user avatarbono to think that our G05 X5 tows better than our half ton pickup.

To that end, I also have a F25 X3 35i and it has a lower COG than my G05 X5, shorter rear overhang, adaptive suspension, and simply handles better than my G05 X5. Does that make my F25 X3 35i a better tow vehicle than my G05 X5?
11-26-2025
Oh, Polo - I love how you keep flexing "lived experience" as if towing a small utility trailer to Lowe’s in both vehicles qualifies as controlled A/B testing.

You keep repeating that you "own both" like that’s a mic drop - but ownership doesn’t equal understanding. I have seen folks "own" both a blender and a chainsaw - doesn't mean they know when to use which one.

Let me break it down real simple: neither you nor your buddy has towed anything close to the edge of the X5’s capability, let alone a full-size travel trailer. Meanwhile, I have done thousands of real miles with a 33’ camper and one finger on the wheel - and posted the videos. Not anecdotes. Evidence.
Polo08816 wrote
Both tooloud10's user avatartooloud10 and myself have both a half ton pickup AND a G05 X5, and our "lived experience" tells us that the F150 is more the more stable towing platform. We are in a position to provide a side by side comparison, you're not. You only own one of the two options that's being discussed. We own multiple BMWs and yet we're not nearly as delusional as bono's user avatarbono to think that our G05 X5 tows better than our half ton pickup.

To that end, I also have a F25 X3 35i and it has a lower COG than my G05 X5, shorter rear overhang, adaptive suspension, and simply handles better than my G05 X5. Does that make my F25 X3 35i a better tow vehicle than my G05 X5?
11-26-2025
bono wrote
Oh, Polo - I love how you keep flexing "lived experience" as if towing a small utility trailer to Lowe’s in both vehicles qualifies as controlled A/B testing.

You keep repeating that you "own both" like that’s a mic drop - but ownership doesn’t equal understanding. I have seen folks "own" both a blender and a chainsaw - doesn't mean they know when to use which one.

Let me break it down real simple: neither you nor your buddy has towed anything close to the edge of the X5’s capability, let alone a full-size travel trailer. Meanwhile, I have done thousands of real miles with a 33’ camper and one finger on the wheel - and posted the videos. Not anecdotes. Evidence.
No doubt! Let's re-hash this too while we're at it.

bono's user avatarbono has posted videos (two?) of himself driving so slowly on US interstates that people have had to pass him in the right shoulder while there is a line of cars and a 18 wheeler trying to pass him in the left lane because he doesn't have enough tow vehicle to keep up with the flow of traffic on US interstates. He would have you believe that it's because of some towing speed limit in California, but he's logged 60,000 miles of towing and all of it is only in California?
bono wrote
You stopped by an RV park, took creepshots of strangers, and interrogated someone about their Lincoln Aviator… and you think I’m the clown? You’re out here doing full-blown recon like it’s a military op just to prove that trucks exist. Bravo, soldier.

As for your homework obsession — I’ve logged 60,000 miles towing, not typing. If you want a full documentary, maybe pitch Netflix. Until then, you can keep posting “gotcha” checklists while I pass you on cruise control — one-handed, as usual.
Here are most of his videos and the common theme is that he just doesn't have enough of a stable tow vehicle to even keep up with 18 wheelers on the interstates: